Naruto 549 Breakdown

Holy shit, it’s Sunday already?

Kishi’s had a decent run the past couple weeks, but this chapter, in my opinion, wins the day for the manga thus far.

I can’t quite put my finger on what it is that made it tick in my head. It could be the nostalgia of seeing the old once again. Actually, I bet it is. It was pretty cool seeing Itachi again. And Nagato seemed very different: a lot less emo, which is always a good thing.

On another note, they both look exactly the same: no Edo Tensei body marks or anything. Well Nagato always looked like something out of Thriller, but I bet you Itachi isn’t even really dead. He’s only attacking Naruto and Bee because he’s a dick like that.

Also, look who’s back as well. It’s Kabuto. And he’s up to no good. Surprise. Well whatever, I can never really bring myself to listen to what he has to say anyway. It’s like Harry Potter and that snake guy from He-Man made a love child and bred a whole new species of human: homo hideous. Actually hideous homo is more like it. Fits the whole Kabuchimaru M.O.

Oops. Tangent.

Anyway, I’m pretty sure he said something about molesting children and making shitty movies. And then maybe take over the world somewhere along the line. How is he going to do that? With Naruto and Bee of course.

Apparently, this has been his plan from the very start. We all knew he hid an ulterior motive from what he had told Madara, and now I guess we know what it is. Or more accurately, now we know how he plans to achieve it. I sincerely doubt he plans to extract their power in some unwholesome manner, and then proceed to destroying the earth as we know it. Madara needs the Jinchuuriki, else his plan is naught. I reckon he plans to use them as bargaining chips to obtain what he really wants. And then proceed to destroy the earth as we know it. Classic villain style. But not before his plans get uneventfully shit on at the last minute. Classic villain style

Back to the people that actually matter, Bee does not only spit fire, but splits it. GG.

Meanwhile, Itachi pretty much confirms in this chapter that Madara had no direct influence on the Uchiha massacre. But then again, how did Danzo recognize him as being from the massacre as if acknowledging his involvement in it? Plot hole? Not quite. He may not have worked with Itachi that night, but with the elders in the background. Or maybe he just went into Uchiha village a little earlier for some deadly prelims before Itachi brought on the main event. The floor is wide open for inferences as the facts still remain.

This pseudo-battle I doubt has the propensity to go full-blown as before. I give it one or two more chapters before we are moving on to a different stage in the war.

But before then, with the return of animal-in-mouth no jutsu, you can bet your shit something interesting is going to find the light.

All I know is Kishi better not blow it. The manga is awesome where it’s at.


Congratulations to Kantongage.

It's a trap!!!

Something about the bluntness of this entry just made me lol.

For this week…

Insert possible caption here.

Use the caption for extra points.


It was pretty heated down there. But there can be only one winner.

And it turns out to be…

Prime or not, in the end, his huge array of techniques leave him with strong defenses and effective counters to keep him on top.



~ by Captain Pickles on July 31, 2011.

202 Responses to “Naruto 549 Breakdown”

  1. FIRST!!!!

  2. Second!!!!

  3. Awesome breakdown Pickles!!!

    Caption: If eating crows brings tear of sadness, what is the tear when you cough up a crow … FEAR!

  4. Is it me, or are the days going by REAL slowwwllyyy >.<

  5. Cool Breakdown.
    And by the way, since noone has posted it yet, here’s some trailers for the new naruto games coming up. I’m actually more excited for the PSP one, even though I don’t own a PSP, i just looks awesome.



    I love the fact that they included the characters you see in this trailer.
    Alrighty, I hope i didn’t mess up the links, I’m still not familiar with wordpress.
    And if somebody owns a 360 I’ll be glad to exchange gamer tags 😉

  6. Bubble: “Kishimoto, I am a sycophant aiming to promote cinedologically necromantic symbiosis. My ego rebels against your work and urges dehortation. The cretinoidal microcephaly of your phylacterio-logical text, together with the monstrous spaciosity of empiricist graphics suggesting retrospective delirium, is an insult to the intellect and to the study of universals as envisaged and carried out by the mind.”

    Caption: Because if Kishi can stuff an entire freaking crow into Naruto’s mouth and STILL give him a speech bubble, that blond kid better make it worthwhile.

  7. LOL @ breakdown,

    LOL @ DarkAvatar!

  8. I agree Pixy poo , the chapter was awesomeness incarnate xD and it got just an awesome breakdown as well !

  9. Pshhh No Debate? How about If Itachi were alive when madara would cast the moon’s eye plan . Would he be able to “see through it”?

  10. Caption: Damnit Itachi, you said if I let you put something in my mouth that it wouldn’t get out!!

    Debate: ZABUZA vs SUIGETSU!!!

  11. i think kabuto might rather want to kill off naruto and bee also, bacause otherwise if the moons eye works then hes pretty much srcewd aswell but if the moons eye plan fails then kabuto has a better chance at world domination because he has edo tensei and whatever the thing in the one coffin is that madara fears so much as we were reminded of in the anime. anyway thats my thoughts.

  12. kabuto wants to kill Naruto an Bee, and heres why, if the moons eye plan fails then kabuto has a chance to edo tensei the crap out of madara and have the world for himself, but if the moons eye plan succeeds then well kabuto has problems. also maybe kabuto wants to kill them as jinchuuriki and edo tensei them back as immortal jinchuuriki with probably infinite chakra, i mean cmon! thats the dream!

    also kabuto has whatevers in that coffin that scared madara like a little baby as seen in the newest anime episode…..mmmmmm i wonder what it is…………

  13. Great breakdown! Awesomeness has returned to the war arc!

    *Bubble: I gotta lay off the curry….

    *Caption: It burns just as much coming up as it did going down…

  14. Bubble:

    Naruto: “Blaargh!”


    Sing a song of sixpence a pocket full of rye,
    Four and twenty blackbirds baked in a pie.
    Naruto ate the pie whole, without a single thought,
    But when the birds came out his mouth he seemed to be distraught.


  15. @Iamnotreally here

    Zabuza vs Suigetsu? That’s just about the biggest insult to Zabuza I have ever seen on this blog. He should slap you across the face with the flat end of his beheading sword for that. <_<

    Sorry to say, but as he is now, Suigetsu is an insult to the seven swordsmen of the mist.

  16. @ Tenrai, Insult or not, Suigetsu took the full blast of Bee’s tailed beast bomb and survived. Now I don’t know about you but anyone who gets hit by a TBB and lives to brag about it is pretty strong in my book.

    Oh and about Zabuza, he’s just all talk and no trousers, the only think he can do is the silent kill and a few suiton jutsus, so he’s not as strong as you set him out to be.

    I dare say he’s the weakest of his 7 swordsman of the mist generation.

  17. @Eugen

    Being durable doesn’t make you a good shinobi. It just makes you good at surviving. Other than that, I don’t see much in Suigetsu that makes him seem that strong to me. I’ve just mostly seen him being beaten really.

    As for Zabuza being all talk, or the weakest of the seven swordsmen, I would like to remind you of something…

    Now, even if it was only once, Zabuza was still able to best Kakashi, the famed copy Ninja of Konoha who himself was above jounin level even back then. If that was a one-on-one battle without interference, he would have inevitably killed Kakashi as well, which in my opinion, shows that he is stronger than you make him out to be.

    Tell me if you think Suigetsu could even possibly come close to defeating Kakashi like that, considering he was played around with by Bee like a toy, easily defeated by Darui and then captured by a few nameless, generic Samurai along with Juugo.

    Suigetsu has done nothing to show any real comparable strength to the likes of Zabuza, and Zabuza is also just way, way cooler. <_<


    Nobody makes a mockery of kakashi when I’m around 😛

    The fact that Kakashi utterly destroyed Zabuza a second later clearly shows Kakashi could/would have made a way to break that prison as well.Genjutsu maybe? Who knows . Didn’t Neji break it as well?

  19. @Ahsan

    Sorry, but you left out the part where he yelled for his students to escape because even he admitted the fight was over the moment he was caught…

    … and where he was saved by 3 twelve-year-old genin.

    The fact that Kakashi destroyed Zabuza later was only thanks to the efforts of his pupils who freed him and is no indication that he would have been able to escape on his own. That is just an assumption on your part. Even later on, when talking about their training to prepare for the next meeting, Kakashi admitted that it was thanks to their efforts that he was rescued and that was the reason why he believed they would be able to assist him in the upcoming battle with some more training.

    Don’t get me wrong, Kakashi is stronger than Zabuza, of that much I am certain. But even still, for Zabuza to catch Kakashi in a situation where he would have died if not for aid, it says a lot for Zabuza’s skill as well.

    In any case, this is a Zabuza vs Suigetsu debate, and Suigetsu just doesn’t seem to have as much skill. Perhaps you have some thoughts on that. <_<

  20. For Zabuza to Catch Kakashi in the Water Prison shows that How effective he was at using his own power. This of course was because he had to work hard to gain these powers and was adapt at using them. [Unlike some other ninja’s who seem to pull new summons/techs outta’ there ass] Moreover He put Kakashi ; Who is shown to be very good at Analyzing/Strategy ; In that situation . That is indeed commendable . To that point I agree.

    But even if it’s an assumption I’d Stick with it as it is a very safe one . I’d like to read “this fight was over from the moment i was caught” In a different way i.e The fight for Naruto and Co . Since Kakashi later on was himself surprised at how good Naruto and Sasuke were , It would be safe to say that He was thinking of them fighting as a group to save the dude. Since Kakashi was ATM trapped Naruto and Co couldn’t have beaten Zabuza. The thing is Kakashi beat Zabuza the second he escaped and you too agree with this that Kakashi was stronger than Zabuza . So I would safely assume here that He COULD have gotten out of the Water bubble . Maybe Raikiri it or Just Use the friggin Sharingan and cast a genjutsu on Zabuza . So I disagree with your statement that

    ” But even still, for Zabuza to catch Kakashi in a situation where he would have died “

  21. @Ahsan

    I will reitterate. This is a Zabuza vs Suigetsu debate. You, as a Kakashi fan, are turning it into a Zabuza vs Kakashi debate when I’ve already said Kakashi is stronger than Zabuza.

    But let’s face it Ahsan, Kakashi was caught and that fact doesn’t change. You can’t change what he said about his own predicament either. I know you can’t bare to even consider the chance that Kakashi is not unbeatable, but that’s why I don’t like debating against Kakashi fans.

    And of all the Kakashi fans I know, you have to be the most loyal by far.

  22. @Ahsan: ah, the “just sharingan it” argument…

  23. @ten & zzattack & all

    All I’m trying to say is that Could Kakashi have not broken out of the prison,by casting a genjutsu on Zabuza ?
    Neji did it as well somehow didn’t he ? I actually never understood how he did it , could someone explain ?

  24. I hear you, tenrai, but let me ask you this: how exactly would Zabuza kill Suigetsu? Zabuza is good, dont get me wrong, but without an effective way to take Suigetsu down he’d lose.

  25. first off sorry about the double post earlier it seems my browser is a bit funky. thought ill keep true to being a naruto fan and use firefox but it seems its not working too well lol anyways……

    I think to compare suigetsu and zabuza isn’t a fair comparison. in that early stage of the arc they couldn’t make zabuza swordsmen level strong because well that would just kill everyone off early and game over, so then later in the time skip they had to up everyone’s game and show the swordsmen weren’t wusses, when you look at the level all the other swordsmen are at you can only imagine zabuza wouldn’t be one as we know him, he just wont qualify, all im saying is don’t compare pre time skip with time skip, already zabuza is showing serious skill when he was edo tenseid, we never knew his blade regenerates until now so yet again there’s a prime example of time skip and pre time skip inconsistency’s, its just the way it is.

    But anyways also we haven’t seen suigetsu get to use real skills anyways, hes always up against someone waaaayyyy out of his league or his fight scenes get thrown aside for sasuke who apparently forgot all his other attacks and only knows susanoo now. but so far he irritates me because he really puts the executioners blades name to shame. he needs something smaller and speedy.

  26. OH YES! i just remembered the caption and bubble!

    Bubble: Wha?! Its still alive?!!
    Caption: Chinese food- Every. Damn. Time.

  27. :)) lol a @ Bakakage, great caption, because it’s true.

    About Suigetsu, Darks is right, how do you kill a mass of water that can make his body into a tsunami if need be. Well one way I guess it’s lightning based attacks witch are Suigetsu’s weakness and I’m guessing that’s how Mangetsu got killed too. Either that or a strong enough genjutsu and then a finishing blow before he can react. Either way people seem to underestimate Suigetsu a lot, remember the almighty Sasuke Uchiha choose Suigetsu out of a lot of great shinobi Orochimaru might have had at all those hideouts of his, so that must mean he’s one of the top 5 shinobi Oro had under his command along with Juugo and a few others.

    By a simple analysis we can conclude Juugo was a better fighter then Kimimaro the latter being the only one who could calm him down during his happy time. Now Suigetsu said he was pinned against Juugo before and he said it with a lot of confidence and no remorse or fear so that must mean he was more then a match for juugo. That being the case Suigetsu might be in the same category as Kimimaro and that to me says one thing; Kimimaro better then Zabuza = Zabuza weaker then Suigetsu.

    I know this is purely speculation but I really don’t see Zabuza as that great of a shinobi, sure his image and fear factor are in there own league and the image he made for himself says a lot about who he was, but he didn’t really prove himself in a fight of great stakes for me to consider him a great shinobi.

    Sure Kakashi fell for the water prison but keep in mind Kakashi was mostly thinking about drawing Zabuza away from his team and the bridge builder, having a lot of people to look out for during a fight in no easy thing, something Naruto made very clear in his fight with Pain. Zabuza in my books is at a loss compared to a expert water user like Suigetsu, a shinobi who knows all about the swordsman and all there blades and skills and was even considered a prodigy by Kisame himself in the art of murder.

    Also, so far Suigetsu fought really strong opponents and might actually be considered at high jounin level for the fact that he took on Bee in his bijuu form and took the full power of that TBB and also fought Darui who also is considered a very strong shinobi, maybe the 3rd strongest in Kumo after Bee and A. So from those fights alone one can rank Suigetsu really high on the totem pole.

    Who can really claim they fought with the top two shinobi in a hidden village, one being the perfect jinchuriki, and not dying after…. I really can’t see someone walking away after a fight with Naruto and Kakashi, both at full force, and not departing after for St Peter’s ticket booth, maybe that’s just me.

    Now it’s beddy bye time for me, good night everybody.

  28. How does Zabuza defeat Suigetsu?

    Well, he could stick his hand in Suigetsu and just make him heavy with chakra in the same manner he creates a water prison.

    Suigetsu is made out of water so it would actually be easier to trap him in himself. O___o


  29. first off sorry about the double post earlier it seems my browser is a bit funky. thought ill keep true to being a naruto fan and use firefox but it seems its not working too well lol anyways……

    I think to compare suigetsu and zabuza isn’t a fair comparison. in that early stage of the arc they couldn’t make zabuza swordsmen level strong because well that would just kill everyone off early and game over, so then later in the time skip they had to up everyone’s game and show the swordsmen weren’t wusses, when you look at the level all the other swordsmen are at you can only imagine zabuza wouldn’t be one as we know him, he just wont qualify, all im saying is don’t compare pre time skip with time skip, already zabuza is showing serious skill when he was edo tenseid, we never knew his blade regenerates until now so yet again there’s a prime example of time skip and pre time skip inconsistency’s, its just the way it is.

    But anyways also we haven’t seen suigetsu get to use real skills anyways, hes always up against someone waaaayyyy out of his league or his fight scenes get thrown aside for sasuke who apparently forgot all his other attacks and only knows susanoo now. but so far he irritates me because he really puts the executioners blades name to shame. he needs something smaller and speedy like the twin lightning blades, then atleast he can catch lightning when someone is attacking him with it lol

  30. its like DBZ, one saga freeza is known for hundreds of years as the strongest being in the universe and the 2 sagas later, theres a whole ship full of beings thats stronger than freeza, i mean cmon, how did that go unnoticed then? just cant compare the 2.

  31. @ bakakage – Well I think Saigetsu is a fair battle with Zabuza, not saying he will win but we have no comparison of the two in battle, also depends who has the sword in the end?

    Dragon ball z – Freeza was the strongest of that time, Androids where created after, and Buu was sealed WAY before Freeza was born, the rest where just unknown or in an alternate reality like Debora… 😛 DBZ for the plot win ^_^

  32. LMAO @ red and his demotivational!!

  33. i love naruto…..^^

  34. @ Chary – I love Lamp —– Welcome to WRA <_<

  35. @Chary

    I love cheesecake. @____@

  36. i love pizza’s

  37. I love Oreos. and not getting eaten !!! Welcome to WRA Chary, glad to have you !!!

  38. I love tacos!

  39. @all: I love pizza cheesecake tacos!!

  40. looks for delete button… can we just forget about my last comment?

  41. @arpotu – Nope, that’s not how it works around here. Once a comment is made it’s trapped in the annals of history for everyone to go back to and rub your face in =P

  42. let the rubbing begin!

  43. @drigruan: I’m starting to see what you mean 🙂

  44. Spoilers are out.

    Spoiler alert!!!!

    Wow, this is quite a twist. The crow is definitely not what I expected… Which is awesome!!!

    And, judging by screens, this chapter will be as epic as last week’s. But what does this mean for Itachi!?!?!?! @____@


    I read the spoilers my self, and all can say’s, last week is goona suck compared to this one. The eye implanted in the Crow is actually Shisui’s eye witch had a genjutsu of the greatest powers. It was programmed to “Save Konoha” that was it’s meaning for Sasuke, but some how it didn’t.

    By the way Itachi breaks out of Edo Tensei and ……………….. I not gonna say more then that. EPICNESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS

  46. BTW It seems next week Jump is on hiatus, so enjoy this week’s chapters more then usual.

  47. It’s times like this that i wish I could read Japanese.

  48. *****Spoiler alert*****

    Itachi is the most awesome character in the history of manga… He managed to break out of Edo Tensei and he plans to brainwash Sasuke!! Even though I don’t think he’ll succeed because that bastard Madara will probably find a way to break the genjutsu, he’s still awesome.

    By the way, is Nagato absorbing Naruto’s chakra in that last panel?? I think Naruto will finally feel the side-effects of shadow clones in Rikudo Mode now.

  49. IT IS OUT

  50. Oh god Itachi is Awesomeness Incarnate

  51. Dear God, this chapter was just freakin… god I don’t know how to describe it, Itachi and Nagato are just so awesome. If images could grow legs, this chapter would kick the crap out of the whole Expendable’s team…
    Yes Anime only guys who are reading this it’s that good and you can enjoy some more filler episodes lol. (I’m evil I know)
    Alright, sorry for the random freakout :), but GOD…

  52. @dragon
    Oh and Apparently Nagato is using Human path’s ability on Naruto on the last page . But it’s on his stomach , so maybe pulling out the ninetails [evil] so that Naruto can stay in This mode longer?

  53. OMG this chapter left me brain dead. Itachi really is the greatest shinobi ever in the history of the narutoverse. And Nagato is gonna F a lot of Shi* up in the next chapter being complete now. He’ll show us exactly what we’ve wanted to see from the start.

    As for Shisui, did he give away his eye willingly to Danzou from the start, thus going along with the plan against the Uchiha or was the eye stolen from him ?? Anyway, to think he had that much power in his eyes it’s incredible.

    And hopefully next chapter will start without Naruto dying and so we’ll get to see a all out fight between the Rinnegan, Sharingan And 2 Complete Jinchuriki. It’s going to be AWESOMENESSSSSSS !!!!!!!!!!!!

  54. @ Ahsan, I think Nagato already lost his consciousness and is under Kabuto’s full control now. So the Human Path, if effective, will most likely kill Naruto if it manages to rip out his soul. Same as what happened to Shizune.

    I think Naruto will kick him away next chapter or maybe Bee or Itachi, maybe even the fox will aid Naruto, but Nagato will go all out against all of them and now he’ll probably be 10X stronger then the 6 paths.

  55. Nagato with his original body is so overpowered. Lol.

    I mean, he can use Shinra Tensei to pwn everything and defend himself, and any jutsu he can’t defend with Shinra Tensei can be absorbed by Preta Path. Going Taijutsu with him is a massive gamble because Preta path can absorb chakra out of the opponent’s body as well and Human path can remove their souls. He also has a summoning jutsu on par with the best of them, and he can control all five elements.

    To top it all off, he’s immortal now. How the hell do you beat something like that? O__o

    I have a feeling that Itachi, Naruto and Bee will need to work together for this one. There’s only one question though. If Nagato is using Human path on Naruto, wouldn’t that mean that right now he is removing Naruto’s soul? O_o

    The chameleon was also very sneaky. Lol.

  56. @ Tenrai – Psssht!!! How can God be over powered ? <_<

    he can probably only use each power at a time and not all at once, still super powered what I like is now this will become Nagato’s strongest point even without Pain of 6 Paths he still a beast 😉

  57. I think the Answer to defeating Nagato was also in this chapter. Itachi said the Shisui’s eye closes for 10 years after one use and reopens after that time UNLESS you have Hashirama’s blood, anyone thinks Naruto can override this by implanting the eye and using his Uzumaki blood + the added bonus of the kyuubi chakra ???

    Just a guess, but kishi doesn’t throw info like that around just for the sake of it. Danzou could use it once maybe twice a day because of Hashirama’s cells, maybe Naruto can do it too. Whatever happens, if that crow falls into Kabuto’s hands he’ll be able to use it in so many ways that will cripple Tobi for sure.

    He can bring Shisui back with edo tensei, he can implant them into a Zetsu or use Yamato to have control of the eye, and who knows what else he could do with that power.

  58. Wow. Itachi really had everything under control. Even after death he still had a plan to control sasuke lol. And now, he is back from the dead.

    The tide of the battle will really change now that he is back and on the right side.
    Btw, did anyone else notice the “Naruto is complete” comment at the end of the chapter?

    I wonder what it was referring to.

  59. I’ve been saving this for a while but the last couple chapters have been about as awesome as this music video…–pM… trust me on this

  60. @marks: It says “Nagato becomes complete” not Naruto. 🙂

  61. @Marks.

    Well, Itachi didn’t plan everything perfectly. His plan to kill Madara by placing a trap in Sasuke failed because of a simple oversight and his plan to use Shisui’s genjutsu on Sasuke was ruined by himself, ironically. Lol.

    Although I will admit his foresight was remarkable, unfortunately, his plans haven’t turned out quite the way he… planned. O_o

    Even still, the results are interesting. The only question is, will Itachi continue to live to the point where he will come face to face with his brother again, or will he somehow die in this battle? I personally believe his resurrection won’t be that long lived, but you never know.

  62. @ Tenrai, strangely both Itachi and Nagato, don’t look like the other edo tensei zombies with the cracks and rippled skin look, they actually look as good as new.

  63. So, Itachi is fully resurrected. How did that happen?
    Does Naruto have to physically implant the eye into is left eye? Or does Itachi mean that being inside Naruto might shorten the effect of the use of the genjutsu?
    What soul is Nagato sucking out?
    I think Itachi would intervene some how.

  64. @Eugen

    But they still had the dark eyes around the pupil, which is a sign of Edo Tensei. Itachi may be free from the mind control aspect of the jutsu, but the problem is that he is still being kept alive through unnatural means.

    There’s nothing to say that if Kabuto releases the jutsu, that Itachi won’t just turn to dust.

  65. I found this on one of Naruto’s forum.. I would love to hear what you guys think.

    Itachi is alive again?!
    For real? Or only till Kabuto dispell ET..but still…Itachi is in action and he’s for a good guys!…..Those ED bastards are screwed!

    But didn’t kabuto say he can’t cancel/dispel ET? or is it that he can cancel the justu but it can’t be cancelled by killing him…

    Can amaterasu burn ED to ashes to the point of no return? (but i see Nagato just Shinra Tenseid Amaterasu in one of the pages.)

    I think Itachi will be “alive” until Kabuto breaks the Edo Tensei. He isn’t Itachi, he is just a dead corpse of an ninja combined with fragments of DNA from Itachi’s body and mud, the real body of Itachi is in Madara’s hands, so, enjoy Itachi while we have him, because next chapter he could be gone.

    agreed the thing he isnt under control doesnt mean he is alive…he will remain in the story only till Kabuto wont release ET….but….on the other hand, I believe that Kabuto cant releas single ET and it must be all or nothing…that means he wont release it right now…also i dont believe Itachi will be there to help Naruto for long so i predict Nagato or Madara using Human path and taking Itachi spirit out of body


  66. @ tenrai, I too think this is a temporary solution and I think Itachi won’t even get the chance to talk to Sasuke, that part should be left to Naruto. So this will come down to the duration of the jutsu, will Itachi release the edo tensei and die at will or will he be killed by Kabuto. I for one think Kabuto has absolutely no more control over Itachi.

    I really want to see what will happen to the crow and Shisui’s eye, it would be a real treat for Naruto to gain such awesome powers but I don’t know if he is to inherit such powers, it will seem a bit cheep.

    @ Thelaughingwiseman, Nagato is using Human path’s skill to extract Naruto’s soul, I doubt the Kyuubi has a soul, being a mass of chakra, so the only soul to be sucked out is Naruto’s own. Too bad we’ll have to wait 2 weeks to find out what happens, seeing as the Jump will be on hiatus next week.

    Maybe Naruto is in kagebunshin mode so he’ll get out of the situation on his own, being a bit more dramatic if we think it was really naruto himself. But I don’t know if the side effects of that will kill Naruto or weaken him, if Nagato dose manage to steal the soul of one of Naruto’s kagebunshin.

    I really like how Kishi turned this war around, I always saw kishi as a man full of surprises and he never fell when it came to a great plot twist. He always knows how to keep the public guessing and he always does something unexpected and awesome.

  67. MUAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!! now who was it that dismissed my crazy theory earlier mmmmmmm? 😛

    Seriously though im starting to think that secret coffin that kabuto never showed is is either shisui or the real slim shady ehem i mean madara. because lets be honest this is just obito being his cowardly self hiding behind a big name to get people to take him seriously hehe and yes im commited im gonna ride this obito train straight to hell 😀

  68. So this week’s Manga’s

    Naruto 11/10
    OP 10/10
    Bleach 0/10


  69. Or Just make it 01/10 for Bleach for the entry of Urahara

  70. @ Ahsan – Do what I did stop reading after you see Urahara 😛

  71. @Ahsan

    WAs Bleach that bad? I thought it was getting better again from the comments all around. O_o


    Edo Tensei can be dispelled quite simply actually. Kabuto even told Madara the hand seals needed to dispel it. All Madara would have to do is take control of Kabuto using his sharingan and have him make those seals.

    On the flipside, Kabuto also stated that if he died, the jutsu would NOT be released. So, imagine if Kabuto just died right now and Itachi and Nagato were left as immortals in the world of the living. O_o

  72. You know ten when you wear the same clothes everyday , wash em daily . They begin to loose color . And then a time comes that they become so fragile that they tear easily . That’s what happened with bleach 🙂

  73. @ Tenrai: Very interesting point. Now we will just have to wait and see if Kabuto will release he jutsu. Yet, the way he is panicking, he seems to have lost control over Itachi.

    Here Kabuto states that not even the Edo Tensei can hold him. So i wonder if this “Non-control” aspect will effect Itachi once the Jutsu is released.

  74. @ Ahsan – u know that is a good analogy I may use it… Since Bleach actually weakens cloths and fades color O_O

  75. @ Marks, Actually from the look on Kabuto’s face I think e was genjutsu’ed to release the technique, if you look at his hands he forms the “release” sign. So maybe Itachi already used the crow in order to force Kabuto to release him from the Edo Tensei. But if he did that, what would stop Kabuto from regaining control over Itachi again.

  76. @Eugen

    The way genjutsu works is by changing the chakra flow to the brain to make the victim hallucinate, lose their sense of rationality or even their free will.

    The term genjutsu itself means “Illusionary techniques”.

    Now, I can understand Shisui’s genjutsu overwriting the orders that Edo Tensei uses to control the summoned bodies by taking control of their minds, but I don’t see how it can change the entire physical nature of the jutsu itself. The only jutsu we know of that can alter reality like that is the Izinagi, which can turn dreams into reality.

    Here’s my opinion on the matter. I thought that maybe performing the seals to release Edo Tensei would end up releasing all of the summoned shinobi, not just Itachi, which would be very detrimental to Kabuto. It is one way of explaining why he might not do it, because of the risks involved.

    Now, of course, it isn’t 100% certain whether or not Kabuto could even get rid of Itachi that way now, but from Itachi’s eyes, you can tell he is still under the effects of Edo Tensei one way or another. This is no longer his natural body, even if he is free from any form of control, and I doubt he would want to live as an immortal zombie, especially in a world where he is hated, a truth he doesn’t want to change for the sake of the Uchiha name.

  77. @ Eugen, another interesting point you make to consider. However, in order to regain control over itachi, Kabuto would have to re-cast the edo Tensei, which would mean canceling the first one and re-summoning Itachi again and put him under a fresh one.

    Yet, there is only one problem with this.

    Itachi said the the Genjutsu has already cancelled out the Edo Tensei, giving Itachi back his free will. With the jutsu already cancelled, Kabuto cant re-cancel a cancellation and regain control of Itachi by starting the justu over. Did i mention cancel? O_o

    Well, there is my 2 cents anyway.

    *brain overloads* X___x

  78. The thing that annoys me the most about the crow is that it wasn’t a gift for Naruto, it was only a fail safe in case Sasuke turned out pretty much the way he did. There was no power transfer, maybe it’s batter this way but all that wait and debating about what it could have been sure was for nothing. The plot twist was good, I’ll admit, but I really wanted Naruto to gain a power from a doujutsu user like Itachi or Nagato so that he would become the new Sage of Six Paths by fusing his own blood with that of a Uchiha.

  79. @ Marks and Tenrai, I actually thought of something else; each edo tensei summon has the special kunai implanted in the brain for body control and brain washing, what if Itachi shrouded the kunai in his head under the genjutsu thus negating all control over him.

    All he is now is a Edo Tensei without a master, just like if kabuto were dead and he was left alive.

    Sure this doesn’t change the fact that Kabuto, just as you said Marks, can re cast the edo tensei on Itachi. Shisui’s genjutsu might hold that against Kabuto now because there’s no reason for Kabuto to keep Itachi alive like this anymore.

    And Itachi’s eyes I think will stay like that even if Kabuto were to die, just as you said Tenrai, he’s a zombie made of dust and someone else’s body right now and that will never change.
    Sure Orochimaru said it himself that he’d give Tsunade both Dan and Nawaki back to her and without the kunai in there heads they’d be just like the real ones, only undying and probably suffering a lot from the trauma, but it shows that the Edo Tensei summons can remain on earth for as long as they choose, either they choose to move on like Sai’s bother and Sasouri did or choose to get sealed away. So Itachi might remain in this world now for as long as he wants to.

  80. itachi is officially the baddest badass of all badasses. this is the reason he has always been my favorite character from ths series.

  81. Just a quick note: When explaining Edo Tensei to Madara, Kabuto did say that the jutsu had no weaknesses and couldn’t be cancelled, even when he releases the technique. I’m on my phone so i can’t show you the page, but you’ll see it if you look back a bit.

  82. @ Darks, he says the technique will only end if he uses releases the jutsus himself or if he is under genjutsu and made to release it. He stated that if he died the jutsu won’t release on it’s own.

    Now it’s a gamble if what Kabuto says is true or not, but there you have it.

  83. @Darks

    I think you are a bit confused. Saying it can’t be cancelled even if he releases the technique is like saying it can’t be stopped even if it is stopped. Lol. It’s a contradiction in itself.

    But here Kabuto tells Madara exactly how to stop it.

    The jutsu won’t end even if the user dies, but it can be cancelled if Kabuto simply uses the Dog, Horse and Tiger seals.

    EDIT – It seems Eugen beat me to the punchline *Eats Eugen* <_<

  84. The most important thing now is what KAbuto says on the following Page:

    He says that as long as he has Edo Tensei and “That OTHER JUSTSU” he’s invincible. I know Kabuto is far stronger then any bad guy right now because of the fact that he knows a lot of forbidden jutsu from Orochimaru, But what could that other jutsu be that he’s so confident in his own power so much.

    I regard Oro as the greatest mind in the narutoverse, him and Itachi, but Oro was a twisted power hungry fanatic that searched for the meaning of life in every secret jutsu he could gain mastery of. That’s why Kabuto now has all that intel and power and maybe even some of Oro’s memories.

    Oh and I was wondering for some time now, Is Naruto’s “that jutsu” the completion of a human held Tailed Beast Bomb, in essence the rassengan with the 8:2 ratio of positive and negative chakra, or is it something else??/

  85. Last post was made after Tenrai kindly regurgitated me just enough to hit Enter, thx Tenrai 😉

  86. BTW sorry for the triple post but I found Prowl, Supertrek, TotalitarianHypnosis and Kisu down here in Senshi’s bowls of hueco mundo hell, just in case anyone was looking for them.

  87. Lah.

    Well then, if he releases the technique, he’d be releasing ALL his minions wouldn’t he? He probably isn’t willing to risk it yet.

  88. @ Darks, that’s the thing, can he release only one or is he forced to release all of the summons at once? That’s the biggest IF so far that affects Itachi the most. Because while Itachi is free from Kabuto, Nagato is out there kicking the living daylights out of everyone, and I doubt he’s doing it just for the fun of it.

  89. Bubble: Baka Baka
    Capiton: Proof that Kishi thinks your an idiot Naruto.

  90. Well, it seems Kabuto jumped conclusions. Shisui had Itachi hide the eye from existence and the ace was pulled. I think the hand seal Kabuto uses is to attempt control of Itachi once more. From the rough translation,
    I assume the reactivation of kotoamatsukami can be used similar to Izanagi using Hashirama’s chakra. The rest is just speculation in my head on where they’re going with this. I don’t see why if Kabuto can adjust more chakra to control set groups that he can’t just release a set target. Then again, one is just adding chakra, the other is a full blown release.

    I’m glad they didn’t try to add more power to Naruto. He kinda deserved getting his soul grabbed, being so careless on the battle field.

  91. Anyone else notice that nobody even cares about Gaara and his dad any more? And Kakashi Rampage doesn’t quite compare to *bringing yourself back to frickin life*!!

  92. WRA: @ Arpotu. Kakashi’s what?


  93. Kantons caption wins the Internet.

  94. Oh, and who’s Kakashi?

  95. @arpotu

    I think you missed the part when Kakashi stabbed himself with his lightning blade , and then made himself come back to life , just for the heck of it ! 😉

  96. I think we all missed that part Ahsan, even Kishi. T____T

  97. WTF!!!!! Nagato is on a rampage of awesomeness too!!!

    @Tenrai and Eugen

    Can Nagato summon Gedo Mazo? I think Madara has it.. and of course we cannot forget the Sword of Totsuka(sp?) This fight is gonna be more than awesome!! Susano’o + Sword of Totsuka+ Gedo Mazo and we may even see other new JUTSU from naruto and BEE. Maybe Shishui’s eye is not the power Itachi is talking about when he told Naruto he is giving “SOME” of his power but Shishui eye is just another plan. Maybe the Sword of Totsuka was Itachi is talking about.. We don’t know.. Kishi is full of surprises.. 😀

  98. @pisbolman That is exactly what I was thinking when it came to Madara and Naruto’s fight. I was thinking in the end, Naruto would have obtained the sword by some means. But before that, Madara would’ve had the upper hand in the fight against Naruto and right when Madara sets up for his final strike, the screen goes dark. The next page shows Madara collecting Naruto, and later is shown resurrecting the Juubi. He then proceeds to put the whole world into his Eternal Tsukuyomi. And then we find out it is all part of the dream spell the sword puts on the people it pierces ( In reality, Naruto had pierced Madara with that sword, using the FTG technique to get near him before Madara teleported away. Calling it!!

  99. I think the real question is: how will Naruto survive now that Nagato’s got him in a ninja-WWE choke hold?

    I have a couple of options.

    1) Naruto’s sheer will overpowers Nagato’s Jutsu and his soul stays intact. (I don’t think this has a good chance of happening)

    2) Bee and Itachi are still in the fight. Albeit Bee is very weakened – he got the Stage 2 Jinchuuriki form sucked outta him – and Itachi is, although in control, under Edo Tensei. They could interfere with Nagato’s jutsu and thereby stop his soul form being stolen altogether. But this one’s got a lotta ifs. If they interrupt the jutsu, would it kill Naruto immediately? Or what if Kabuto COULD release Edo Tensei on a single person? I don’t think he can because he would’ve done so already on Itachi. But he might be able to. very iffy this one.

    3) Help comes from outside of the fight and the jutsu is interrupted. Again, some ifs.

    4) Kyuubi’s hatred overwhelms Nagato and it somehow affects Edo Tensei? I don’t even know but this tangent kinda came to me as I was writing this comment. Like Nagato, somebody who aims for peace and is knowledgeable about true pain, wouldn’t like a hatred as malicious and harmful as the Kyuubi’s. So it might undo Edo Tensei like it did some of the others.

    5) Kyuubi’s soul is attached to Naruto’s and is in threat of being stolen too. Now Kabuto needs the Kyuubi for his evil world domination plan. So if he wouldn’t destroy it.

    Any thoughts or other options?

  100. Caption: Discovering how big black really is

  101. @laughingwiseman

    That’s the only this that came to my mind.. Itachi’s Sword of Totsuka might be of a great help against Nagato’s Gedo Mazo. They both kind of reap something from anyone and then seal it but i doubt it so soon to appear the Sword of Totsuka. I thinking there’s something else that would interfere OR someone else!

    1. Naruto might transform to Sage Mode immediately + the Kyuubi. hence the eyes are in SM+KM=total awesomeness. and I was thinking of how in the hell would Nagato react if he absorb much of the Sage Mood Naruto has before he turns into stone.

    2. Madara. you know him. He always show up anywhere.. lol He might appear and see what is going on with Itachi, Nagato, Naruto and Bee. I know he can sense chakra too.. He might show up with the Edo Tensie’s Jinjurikii.. but I doubt that too since it’s too super duper awesomeness chapter it would be if almost all of the badass and strongests character appear at the same place. and Madara will know that Kabuto is up for something.

    3. Naruto can use chakra to be molded like multiple arms.. so he might do that too. with bunch of not so ordinary rasengans..

    I think it’s too soon for us to see the FTG Technique.. but i guess Naruto will learn that too…

    I saw this post from someone else:

    nothing’s been removed. This is a failsafe, think of it like radar, as soon as it detects itachi’s MS being used upon naruto, it’ll always come out. Itachi never said its only to be used once. plus he kind of activated it on purpose last chapter saying “lets see what happens”.

    if he entrusted sasuke to naruto and hopes for naruto to use this failsafe on sasuke since sasuke’s irredeemable right now, then he wouldnt have activated it on purpose if it was meant to be used only once, since that would mean naruto wont be able to use it on sasuke.

    that proves that naruto can use it multiple times.

  102. WOW great activity on the blog, me likes it a lot. Great points brought up by pisbolman & cranksatnyc, I agree with a lot of what you guys and the wiseman said. Naruto is now at a point were he doesn’t need outside help anymore so I for one think he’ll indeed try to use some of his own tricks to get out of the choke hole on his own.

    Maybe the chakra arms with a rassengan on nagato’s 1000 years of death side (ooooouch that’s gotta hurt), also the Sagemode + Kyuubi mode would be the Awesomeness of Awesomeness above 9000 ever since Kakashi gave Chuck Norris a wedgy.. Yes you heard it here first ;).

    Also As I stated before Naruto might just be one of he’s kage bunshin and pull a fast one on Nagato, even if that carries a lot of risk. Also the Itachi involvement will prove to be Epic as ever, now that he’s in control and has no life limit or illnesses to hold him back, plus no more partially blindness, he’s at the peak of the Uchiha power right now even without a EMS, his immortality compensates that and will make both him and Nagato the most dangerous shinobi in the narutoverse so far, with no known limit and no danger from death.

    It actually feels a bit hopeless for Naruto, even at he’s great skill level, the odds Nagato brings are just crazy, if Itachi was under Kabuto’s control now I dare say both Bee and Naruto would have lost this fight.

  103. Are we gonna see Gedo Mazo and Sword of Totsuka? That’s what i want to happen!! lol

    Debate: Itachi vs Nagato 😀

    I don’t know if it already been matched up before i don’t remember. I just want to know what you guys have in mind. 😀

  104. @ pisbolman – *RUN AWAY*

    If you include, Itachi or Kakashi in a debate the fan boys will destroy you O_O

  105. unless of course its Kakashi vs Itachi then they will destroy each other 😉

  106. @ pisbolman, regarding your debate, I’m really itching to see what they can do in the next 3-4 chapters before I state my favorite, but so far I give it to Nagato the way he’s right now.

    Itachi has a great trump card with Susano’o and Amaterasu but Nagato still has all the ultimate hex’s in the narutoverse.

    It’s a tight match and one that I was hoping to see for a long time. Just to make things clear:

    Are they Edo Tensei to the Ubber Max Nagato & Itachi, or are they as strong as they are now only living and prone for blindness and crippling and all the problems both fighters had in the world of the living??

    I would actually like the debate to be with Itachi as he is right now (no blindness, no illnesses, no shortage of power but alive and fragile to death)
    and Nagato also as he is right now (no wheelchair, no anorexia, no limitations and also without the 6 paths and also limited by life).

    If the debate is as following I would still give it to Nagato, but only just. Itachi prove he can use the most powerful techniques in his clan and has knowledge of jutsu we can’t even imagine. So Itachi has the ability to keep Nagato at bay with Susano’o and also strike with Amaterasu for the kill, also he can use Tsukuyome if Nagato gets too close and catch him off guard.

    On the flip side Nagato can repeal Amaterasu with Shinra Tensei if he can time it just right and he can draw Itachi closer with Bansho Tein.
    If Itachi gets too close Nagato is as good as champ seeing as he can use Naraka path’s skill or human path’s powers to kill/drain Itachi of his life/chakra, leaving him either dead or dying.

    Also the Fuc*ed up summons Nagato has can really do damage to Itachi’s strategy and seeing as they’re so hard to kill the only shoot he has is to use either Amaterasu or the Sword of Totsuka.

    On the other hand Nagato can sense what Itachi’s pretty much gonna do before he dose it, this puts a heavier wrench in Itachi’s plan. But it Itachi dose catch Nagato in Tsukuyome it’s all over seeing as how he doesn’t have the other paths at his disposal now for resurrection.

    So far I see it 49/51% in Nagato’s favor, but as I said I’m waiting to see what Itachi can really do as a immortal bad ass and I’ll cast my definite vote after that. ( BTW I’m a Itachi fan, so I’m rooting for him on this one even if he’s the underdog, and also Nagao is cool as hell too).

  107. @ Pein :)) :)) =)), that’s right don’t even mention Kakashi if you know what’s good for you, lol.

  108. In terms of Itachi vs Nagato, I’m sorry but Nagato is just way too over powered right now. Unless, of course, Tsukyomi works on a dead person who doesn’t feel pain or wouldn’t be affected by trauma.

    Even then, I don’t know if visual genjutsu works on a Rinnegan user at all.

    But, let’s face it, Nagato can absorb jutsu or chakra using preta path and he can use Shinra Tensei and Chibaku Tensei as well for offensive and defensive purposes. This means that 90% of Itachi’s jutsu won’t work on Nagato. The only one I am not 100% sure of is Amatarasu (because I don’t know if it can be safely absorbed anymore because Nagato didn’t try to absorb it the first time it hit him).

    Susanoo is a great trump card, but so far as I know, it is also made up of chakra, so it may also be absorbed once it comes close to Nagato for all we know. If Preta path can absorb a Rasenshuriken while it is flying towards him at high speed, there’s nothing to saw Nagato can’t absorb Susanoo when it tries to hit him.

    In my opinion, this battle will need to be a team effort, especially if Nagato has already powered himself up with some of the Hachibi’s chakra. I wonder if hell ever bring out all of those other jutsu he has learned using all five elements.

  109. @ Tenrai, firstly Pain did fell for Ma and Pa’s genjutsu and got 3 of his paths killed by Jiraiya due to that. If Nagato (one person) falls for Tsukuyome, known as one of the top 3 most powerful genjutsu cast by Itachi who was rivaled it seems only by Shisui, I doubt he won’t get caught in the technique and even die.

    Right now Nagato doesn’t have the paths at his disposal for the added bonus of more eyes and ramified skills. But on the up side he has all the skills in one body to use at the right moment.

    Sure Nagato is strong but first we must decide on the battle rules as I pointed out in my post to Pisbol.
    Is Nagato in a wheelchair, dose he have the 6 paths, is he a edo tense zombie, and so on. Same goes for Itachi, is he ill can he see clearly without the near blindness, can he use all his powers and not have some implanted into Naruto. I for one think it’s very important to set the rules for the fight and not come up with techniques either could use under the situation at hand.

  110. guys, itachi will win this one single handedly against nagato, just keep using izanagi, rip out blind eyeball and get new one from edo tensei. works every time 🙂

  111. I think Nagato is using an extracted soul to summon the resurrection pain. That way he can step inside, totally rez himself, and boom – Itachi/Nagato Team LIVE and on set!!

  112. @ Arpotu, dude that would make my jaw drop, it would feel a bit strange having so many strong shinobi alive and Naruto will fell like a little wimp but it would still be something great.

  113. I’m so confused with Naruto…

    1.) The crow was supposed to activate when Sasuke transplanted Itachi’s eyes…

    Sooooo why was no crow activated? Was it because Itachi put the crow in Naruto or something!? I’m so confused. Why didn’t Itachi just keep the crow in his own eyes so when Sasuke transplanted them (As Itachi was so sure he would) the crow would spring out and “save” Sasuke? Is there something I’m missing here?

    2.) Was the point of this whole chapter supposed to be a big hint to, ‘Hey guys this is how Naruto is going to save Sasuke! Look, it’s not going to be a Speech No Jutsu after all!!!’

    Alright, Itachi rigged Shusui’s genjutsu into the crow’s eye which would activate and hypnotize Sasuke into getting back on Konoha’s side, but it was just wasted on Itachi (lolz). Shusui’s jutsu can only be activated once every 10 years unless you have Hashirama’s chakra. That’s why Danzo could use the ability more than once in the span of what…a few days? He had Hashirama’s chakra flowing through his body. Basically, as of now the crow and Shusui’s genjutsu is useless until another 10 years.

    But wait! Naruto is very much related to Hashirama and has this weird “life force” chakra which even affects and is in all likelihood related to Hashirama’s Mokuton jutsu.

    Yes, I’m saying Naruto can probably reactivate the crow’s eye and set the trap back up again. Is it really going to be that easy? Naruto fights Sasuke and slowly revives Shushi’s eye in the genjutsu crow and Sasuke unwittingly activates Itachi’s trap and is hypnotized into “protecting Konoha”? The solution to Naruto’s entire plight is genjutsu. HAHaHAa! I can only hope I’m wrong.

  114. OMG loooook its Supertrek, everyone loooooooook he’s really back :)).

    Omg dude where have you been all this time, I haven’t seen one of your posts since 3-4 months ago ???

    About Naruto, I hope the crow lost that power for good because the whole meaning and plot of this manga is related to Naruto talk no jutsuing Sasuke back to the good guys. Sasuke falling for a genjutsu, even one so carefully planned, is a bit out of the question for a genius like Kishimoto. At least that’s my opinion.

    But concerning the reactivation of Shisui’s eye, I’m seeing Naruto pulling that off with his linage and chakra, the question is; will he implant the eye and become a true sage using both Uchiha and Uzumaki blood or not ???

  115. @ bakakage, you can only use Izanagi if you have both uchiha and senjuu blood, Itachi only has his own clan’s blood.

    It’s actually a bit of a mistake made by Kishi, because he said it’s a technique forbidden to the uchiha, meaning it’s a uchiha technique soo why can’t no uchiha make use of the jutsu??? It’s really the only big mistake i’ve seen kishi make so far in the manga.

    Anyway Izanagi can only be used by Tobi and probably Nagato, the latter might even use it without the disadvantage of having his eyes close after using the jutsu just like the So6P.

    So if Nagao, being of the Uzumaki, can presumably use the jutsu so might Naruto do if he combines uchiha dna with his own. Maybe Itachi will give up his life in the next chapters for Naruto, if Nagato steals his soul, and he’ll be resurrected as a true Sage, who knows.

  116. I would just like to say that kishi has done a great job at turning this war around. In fact, I believe everything before this was great too as it made this last couple weeks even more awesomeness.
    *warning harry potter anaology*
    I’m not twelve. But even so, here it is. Quidsseditach(sp?). The points scored by the persons throwing the balls through the hoops(calm yourselves) are essentially filler. When the snitch is captured, the amount of points won overwhelmes those previous ones. Just the same in the war arc, if naruto and bee are captured, it doesn’t matter how many zetsus died, the war will be over. Vise versa, if they aren’t captured, it wont matter how many shinobi die, as madaras plan will not come to fruition.
    What happens in between the naruto and bee section of the war is only there to keep us entertained until the outcome of Naruto/bee is determined. As far as that goes, i believe kishi has done a fantastic job of keeping us entertained and guessing. He’s still got it, and hes got us hooked.

    Oh…and kakashi who?

  117. @eugen, I don’t think this will save Sasuke. Let’s remember that the EMS is stronger than Itachi’s/Sasuke’s MS alone. I think Itachi’s genjutsu is just below Shisui’s genjutsu since Itachi can manipulate space, time and make the affected feel true pain. So with the EMS I think Sasuke will be able to overpower it somehow. And remember during Sasuke-Itachi fight, Sasuke was able to see through Itachi’s genjutsu, albeit it wasn’t Tsuk without even the MS.

  118. @ cranksatnyc, sure I agree with what you said, Sasuke indeed overcame the Tsukuyome cast by Itachi’s MS with only his 3 tomoe sharingan but only because of his hard training and his determination. Now the EMS might be a match even for the rinnegan as far as we know but the powers of that ocular jutsu haven’t been seen yet so all we can do is speculate.

    The only thing we have to cling on to is the fact that Hashirama mangaed to whoop a EMS Madara and the Kyuubi’s asses on his own. So it’s not unbeatable.

    As far as Sasuke’s mastery of genjutsu goes I think he’s proficient enough to cast a great Tsukuyome if need be, but Itachi’s genjutsu can’t be beaten by anyone at this point and if you think about the fact that the genjutsu Sasuke was supposed to fall for from the crow’s eye (Shisui’s eye) was even a more potent and powerful genjtsu then what Itachi could pull off, I’d say Sasuke wouldn’t even know that he was under the jutsu.

    I. E. that’s exactly what the jutsu was meant for, it was a genjutsu that no one would even notice and would stay like that forever. Maybe only a Hyuuga would detect something like that with the Byakugan.

  119. @ Mantys, I know what your saying, Kishi is a true genius at turning things into such great & unexpected plots, it’s really cool and it’s the main reason why I read & like Naruto so much.

  120. Awesome chapter.

    I don’t think Nagato will kill Naruto though. I assume ripping the soul out of a jinchuuriki isn’t as easy as ripping out the soul of someone like shizune. I think Kyuubi will say “Tits or GTFO”, or, “the price is WRONG, bitch!”

    Naruto’s plan of action against Nagato should be Sennin mode and then, hugsy time!! Nagato can absorb all the chakra he wants. It will be interesting to see whether Edo Tensei can counter the effects of unbalanced nature chakra.

    That or Itachi can just go “Bitch plz…” and Tsukuyomi Nagato into next summer. Let’s see Nagato shinra tensei his way out of that one. ^__^

    @ Super,

    The crow activates when targeted by Itachi’s Mangekyo, Itachi knew Sasuke would transplant his eyes but didn’t know he would be ressurected. Remember Itachi tried to make Sasuke the hero of Konoha by dieing at Sasuke’s hands so he didn’t need the crow at that time. The crow was a failsafe in case Sasuke decided to betray Konoha. That’s why Itachi stored the crow in Naruto assuming Naruto would go up against Sasuke with the EMS (Itachi’s eyes) which would then activate the crow which would put Sasuke under Shisui’s genjutsu….

    … Now I’m confused too. Wait, maybe I’m not.

  121. @EUGEN

    “Sasuke indeed overcame the Tsukuyome cast by Itachi’s MS with only his 3 tomoe sharingan but only because of his hard training and his determination”

    Oh my freakin God , Don’t go being a Sasuke fangirl now please . His hard training and determination ?

    As far as the EMS goes all we know as of yet is that it gives the user all of Ms’s power and doesn’t go opaque over time. It shouldn’t have any effect on sasuke’s genjutsu skill [ Which are pathetic as Danzo rightly pointed out] Of course the key word here is SHOULDN’t but we all know kishi…

  122. @Red

    “That or Itachi can just go “Bitch plz…” and Tsukuyomi Nagato into next summer. Let’s see Nagato shinra tensei his way out of that one. ^__^”

    +10 Awesomeness points for you!

  123. BTW,

    I just totally forgot Itachi’s Susano’o….

    Nagato is doomed! Unless he can shinra tensei himself out of the sealing power of all sealing powers….

    “It’s times like this that i wish I could read Japanese.”

    It’s times like this that I wish I could read….

    Can anyone confirm I typed what I wanted to type?

  124. +Itachi vs Nagato – I think the capability of the rinnegan still has not come to light. We don’t know how a powerful genjutsu would work against the rinnegan. Nagato could dispel the genjutsu and just rip out the soul of Itachi. The almighty push is able to repel amertuasu and if Susano is the trump card, then Nagato has got one of his own. Yes people, that one jutsu that created the moon, I forgot what it was called. With Nagato not perplexed with the limits of the human body, he would have the power to lock up the susano’o in a miny moon. That’d be an awesome battle whomever wins. Let us hope it’s in the next few chapters!

    p.s. I also think Naruto’s vitality will shorten the effects of Shisui’s eye technique.

  125. “We don’t know how a powerful genjutsu would work against the rinnegan.”

    Looks like it did O.K.

    And that genjutsu is nowhere near as powerful as Itachi’s Tsukuyomi.

    As for Chibaku Tensei trapping Susano’o. Chibaku Tensei takes a lot of time to create, Susano’o does not. Nagato could probably trap Susano’o but he needs to stand still in order to concentrate. Not the ideal tactic when up against something holding a gigantic sword capable of sealing you forever when it so much as touches you.

  126. @Eugen: Aye, thanks.

    Yeah, I know what you mean. For Sasuke to be saved by having to be brainwashed into “protecting” Konoha would be disappointing, but is it hard so hard to imagine that may be Naruto’s only option? Eventually Sasuke might be like Madara by the time they face off. Impossible to use Talk No Jutsu on.

    It’s a possibility that Kishi miiiight take but you’re right, I don’t see him going down the ‘Hypnotize Sasuke’ route either. Kishi will end tyhis manga as everyone knows he will. Talk No Jutsu on Sasuke, either Sasuke or Naruto dies for the other one’s sake, and something about Hokage.

    @Red: If Itachi was really smart he would have just left the crow in his own eyes so when Sasuke transplanted them (no matter what side Sasuke was on at the time) the crow would hypnotize him into “protecting Konoha”. I mean, if Itachi was already willing to go far enough to completely swipe over his brother’s will and turn him on Konoha’s side he might as well have played it safe.

    He should have put the crow in his own eyes to be activated on transplantation or when Sasuke first used EMS.

    If Sasuke was on Konoha’s side and transplanted the eyes then the crow would effectively hypnotized Sasuke into…being the same person he already is. If Sasuke was on Konoha’s side and decided not to transplant the eyes then the crow wouldn’t even be needed so neither would the transplant.

    Of course if Sasuke was on the wrong side, which he is, then the transplant would have activated the crow and hypnotized Sasuke. The chances of Sasuke not transplanting the eyes while still being power hungry and on his quest for revenge was basically close to zero. That’s why Itachi was so sure Sasuke would go ahead with the transplant and seek “true power”.

    See? Itachi should have kept the crow in his own eyes instead of making Naruto the fail-safe. Sasuke would be saved already.

    Also, I’m guessing it’s a translation error but the chapter really makes it seem like the crow was supposed to activate upon transplantation.

    @Ahsan: Of course he broke it! Go watch Kakashi’s rampage again. Somewhere in all that dialog, blood splatter, and epic fighting it was foreshadowed that only a Uchiha (Itachi’s own blood) could break his EMS and Kakashi said, “SASUKE”! Wait…was that Kakashi’s rampage or another chapter? I forget, Kakashi is everywhere nowadays.

  127. Kakashi’s what?

  128. @Super

    Shouldn’t have questioned the genius’s might @_@ . If Itachi had put Shishui [Whatever the spellings are] Sharingan aka the crow in his own eyes . Wont that technically be like handing the sharingan over to madara , as in literally free?

  129. @super

    I didn’t want to prove this again but >_> I think you missed the partS when Zetsu pointed out many things

    “Itachi is Sick”
    “Itachi should have dogded that easily”
    “Why is he coughing up blood , is he sick?”
    “Itachi should have won this” etc
    And of course Itachi was Almost blind and still Itachi died his own death , Sasuke didn’t have much to do with it .Itachi had staged it all , need i say it again?

    Now for the breaking Tsukyomni part , Against Danzo we actually saw how weak and pathetic sasuke’s Genjutsu skills are. Danzo’s words ” This is NOTHING compared to Itachi’s [Tsukyomni] Where he could control Time and Mass” and “the land is not above the sky” .

    Are you trying to tell me Sasuke broke through the tsukyomni on basis of a fight which was completely Scripted and Fought by a half dead Itachi? Whereas we Have solid proof of Sasuke’s Genjutsu skills being Nothing compared to Itachi’s . Which you choose to believe is up to you

  130. @Super

    I assume that Itachi didn’t want to have to hypnotize Sasuke to force him to protect Konoha. I also think he assumed that Sasuke would go back to Konoha none the wiser once he had achieved his goal of killing his brother.

    Shisui’s eye was only a last resort for a “what if” scenario. He obviously put it in Naruto because if Sasuke did by some chance turn on Konoha, then Naruto would always be the one who would confront him. And if Sasuke was willing to use the EMS to kill Naruto, then it was also further proof of his fall to the dark side.

    In any case, the crow only casts genjutsu when it sees Itachi’s eyes use MS. Itachi figured that if Sasuke did transplant his eyes and then activated the MS, it would recognise that they are still Itachi’s eyes and would thus cast the Genjutsu on Sasuke. I don’t think putting shisui’s power in Itachi’s eye is possible, because I’ve never heard of eyes being implanted into each other or combined and giving Sasuke Shisui’s actual eye would be like giving him another weapon to use.

    Either way, the eye can’t be used for another decade now, unless someone gets a hold of Hashirama’s chakra. Or perhaps Naruto’s life force will have the same effect…

  131. @ Ahsan, sure Itachi was on his death bed when he fought with Sasuke and the tsukuyome might have been less potent then usual BUT a technique is a technique and weather Itachi used a a less potent Tsukuyome or not the effects would have still been almost the same.

    I’m not a big Sasuke fan but I do give credit where credit is due and Sasuke did prove he can be a match for strong shinobi. Now I’m not saying Nagato can or cannot break one of Itachi’s full power Tsukuyome BUT Sasuke is of the Uchiha and he did train a whole lot just to counter that technique so the fact is Nagato might not be able to counter Itachi’s genjutsu even if he knew it was coming, not facing the technique before it might come as a surprise to him and fall for it at first glance, remember all Itachi needs to do is Flip Nagato the “Bird” and it’s all over. That would be priceless to see :)) lol.

    Oh yeah Kakashi’s what ?????

  132. @Eugen: We stil dont know whether a sharingan technique can even affect the Rinnegan, so it’s not safe to say a tsukuyomi would take Nagato out. What we do know however, is that nagato can be defeated by Genjutsus who dont work with eye contact but other senses. Maybe a “no name” genjutsu would work better on Nagato. He is alone after all and has no other bodies to help him…
    Oh, and it isn’t a debate if it involves Itachi <_<
    If anyone couldn't hqve guessed already I'm a die hard Itachi fanboy

  133. @Ahsan: As I’ve stated before, how well you can cast a genjutsu has little if nothing to do with how well you can break a genjutsu. Take Naruto for example. Jiraiya knew Naruto had little skill in casting genjutsu so he went straight to teaching him how to break out of one. Naruto right now should be able to at least break a mid-level genjutsu by just overriding the genjutsu with mass amounts of chakra.

    Yet, Naruto can’t cast a single genjutsu spell. Again, how well you can a genjutsu does not correlate with how well you can break a genjutsu. Sakura broke a genjutsu and she can’t cast any. Deidara broke Sasuke’s genjutsu and as far as I know he can’t cast any. You don’t need super or superior genjutsu skills to break a genjutsu.

    Yes, Itachi’s Tsukoyomi is wonderful and far outdoes Sasuke’s. Doesn’t mean Sasuke couldn’t break the genjutsu with all his training and fights since their last confrontation.

    @Marks: You know….that guy with the silver hair and the affinity of lightning and to be cast aside…

    Ah! There he is! He’s right there on your avatar!

    @Tenrai: Well, when you can take an eye ball and put it into a crow made of genjutsu and then put the genjutsu crow into a living human being I wouldn’t be surprised if Itachi was capable of just putting the crow in his own eye balls to acitvate when Sasuke transplanted them.

    Especially since Sharingan users combine eye balls all the time. Itachi also transferred his own powers into Sasuke’s eyes just by tapping him on the forehead. Silly eye fetish.

    Wait what!? I’m just wrapping my head around Itachi implanting the Sharingan with the most powerful genjutsu into a crow made of genjutsu… And how was Itachi going to use Shusui’s eye on Sasuke if the 10 year limit wasn’t an issue? Was he going to cast the genjutsu crow and have the genjutsu use Shusui’s genjutsu? W.T.F.

    Genjutsu on top of a genjutsu on top of a genjutsu. That’s some Inception territory right there. Or Bleach *cough*layeredkido*cough*

    Anyway, as I said before I still think it would have been smart for Itachi to just play it safe and just have made the crow automatically activate upon transplantation into his brother’s eyes, assuming it’s possible. If all the above is possible then why not this? He was already willing to go far enough to override Sasuke’s will if he turned to Madara’s side. If Sasuke didn’t turn out on Madara’s side then overrding his brother’s will to protect Konoha with a genjutsu to protect Konoha would have no adverse effects.

    “…I’ve never heard of eyes being implanted into each other or combined… ” (Tenrai)

    Hold on now, this isn’t to Tenrai that reads Naruto with all the eye powers and Uchiha Clan is it…? @_@


    Here are some questions for anyone to answer.

    1.) Does the Mizukage have a Doujutsu and if so (OH SHE DOES) which one…of the 3?

    2.) Where is the Mizukage?

    3.) Where is Rock Lee?

    4.) I remember there being a character named Hinata but my memory is fading. Does she still exist?

    5.) Why did I see Tenten do something?

  134. @Super

    1) Yes, however the effect is unknown because it’s not her eyes people stare at.

    2) Searching for her soul, or whatever it is gingers do in their spare time.

    3) Dunno, but when things go missing around here, you’ll usually find it in Tenrais stomach. If he’s not there, try a hockey match somewhere, or the maple syrup aisle.

    Last two are anybodys guess.

  135. @ Super,

    About the eyes, if Sasuke implanted Shisui’s eyes nothing would have happened. The genjutsu is cast when the eye sees Itachi’s MS. The only other thing Itachi could have done is make the eye activate upon seeing it’s own reflection. But Sasuke doesn’t look in mirrors a lot and I don’t think he can look at his own eyes…
    I think in general you’re forgetting the part where, for the genjutsu to work, their needs to be eye contact as is the case with all Sharingan genjutsu.

    As for Tsukuyomi,

    The Tsukuyomi Itachi used on Sasuke during their ‘fight’ wasn’t like the Tsukuyomi Itachi used on Kakashi or on Sasuke during part 1.
    Proof? where was the moon that lit the pace so beautifully during the real Tsukuyomi…
    The real Tsukuyomi is a one hit K.O. technique.
    You believe Sasuke was able to overcome the techbnique. Fine, your entitled to. The fact is Itachi never meant to defeat Sasuke that day. What would he have done if he used the full Tsukuyomi on Sasuke and Sasuke wouldn’t get up afterwards… Not exactly a part of the plan now was it.

    “1.) Does the Mizukage have a Doujutsu and if so (OH SHE DOES) which one…of the 3?”

    She doesn’t. Unless you count her mesmerizing,… uhmm… features.

    “2.) Where is the Mizukage?”

    Sadly, not with me. She’s protecting the Daimyo, traveling from country to country.

    “3.) Where is Rock Lee?”

    Lee is a part of the Third Division and we last saw him help Kakashi against Haku and Zabuza.

    “4.) I remember there being a character named Hinata but my memory is fading. Does she still exist?”

    Who? You might be confused with Pokémon here.

    “5.) Why did I see Tenten do something?”

    She didn’t. It was a trick of lights, camera and panel movement… Tenten is useless, everybody knows that.
    What actually happens was is that she grabbed the Bashōsen and immediately fainted. Once again proving her uselessness.

  136. Ohhhh my!!! What have i done.. lol now everyone is alive.. lol


    I just want to know what’s on people’s mind about the match Itachi and Nagato. I don’t intend to come into the debate.. 😀

    I’m still missing something.. you guys said a lot.. what i want to hear from you about what do you think about Gedo Mazo appearing. Can Edo Tensei’d Nagato still summon it? like his other summons. and can Itachi unleashed the Sword of Totsuka?

    I know we haven’t seen much of these two powerful jutsu.. but i want to know what you guys think of that when use against each other.

  137. Why is everyone comparing Itachi’s Tsukuyomi to a regular Genjutsu?

    If it was as simple to break Itachi’s Genjustu as everyone claims Sasuke did and can do, then kakashi, who has just as much if not more experience with the sharingan then sasuke, should have easily been able to break Itachi’s Genjutsu as well.

    When you compare Itachi’s Genjutsu on Oro and kakashi, to the time he applied it on sasuke, there were some obvious differences. One, Itachi’s motives. He intention of going easy on Kakashi or Oro.

    Kakashi and Oro were both bound helpless, they couldnt move their arms or legs. The univeres turned that red, shady color and etc. Sasuke on the other hand, still had the option to fight in the genjutsu, though it did him little good. Beside that, nothing was out of the norm. We could diffidently tell this was not Itachi’s true Tsukuyomi.

    Let me show you something else.

    Notice that Naruto does not say, “Hey bee, watch out, if he catches you with Tsukuyomi, you will have to get help from the hachibi to get you out.”

    No, Naruto specifically States, if he catches you, game over. End of fight.

  138. @Red: Yeah, about the eyes I see that now it was a mistranslation in the chapter. It basically said the crow was supposed to activate upon transplantation.

    About the Tsukoyomi, that’s not proof. Itachi utilizing a different scenario inside the genjutsu doesn’t make it any less of a Tsukoyomi. There’s nothing in the manga which differentiates between Itachi’s “real” Tsukoyomi and his what…? Fake Tsukoyomi? You’re simply assuming the appearance of a moon = “real” Tsukoyomi.

    Honestly, where is the moon in the “real” Tsukoyomi during Kakashi’s toruture? You can start from here, and this is the foreshadowing I’m talking about regarding the breaking of Tsukoyomi.

    It mentions “moon” but that’s just what Tsukoyomi is. The world of the “Grasping Moon”. The appearance of a moon doesn’t dictate whether or not the Tsukoyomi was in anyway different. There wasn’t even a moon in Sasuke’s “real” Tsukoyomi (Part 1 flashback).

    In conclusion there wasn’t any moon in any of the Tsukoyomi’s actually. It’d probably be better if you said something like the “real” Tsukoyomi is perhaps…black and white?

    Even if it is a long shot it holds more water than the appearance of a moon.

    And the Tsukoyomi can’t be an automatic 1 hit K.O. because if that were the case Itachi would not have said only a Uchiha stands a chance against me. He would have said nobody stands a chance against me and gone, “Muahahahhaa”.

    As for Itachi risking Sasuke’s life he did it to push him to the edge (get Orochimaru). Itachi didn’t throw anything at Sasuke he knew he couldn’t handle. It’s not like Sasuke did it solely with his Sharingan anyway. He used the combined power of his Sharingan and the cursed seal.

    @Marks: Bee, Kakashi, Orochimaru, and mostly everyone else aren’t the Uchiha and I don’t believe anyone is comparing Itachi’s Tsukoyomi to regular genjutsu.


    Thanks for answering my questions guys~ We should have more question and answering sessions like this in the future.

  139. @ Super: You also have to take into account that Madara also stated, “If Itachi were serious, you (Sasuke) would be dead.”

    Therefore, it is easy to make or build an arguement on this statement, that Itachi used a weaker Genjutsu on Sasuke, which allowed him to break it. Once again, the evidence is in the pudding, so to speak.

    I was merely comparing the Tsukoyom’s ITachi used on Oro and Kakashi, to show the difference in how serious Itachi was.

    My point was, if Itachi was serious and he put Sasuke in the move with the intent to kill as he did with Kakashi and Oro, Sasuke would be dead. I know its an assumption, but it is a VERY safe one. Itachi would have simply had Sasuke bound and helpless like he has done in the past with two of his previous victims.

  140. …I still think Itachi should sneak up on Sasuke, and sing “Do You See What I See?” in his ear…

  141. So Shishui gave his one eye to Danzo? They both have one thing in mind.

    They both said something about self-sacrifice.

  142. @super, yes but when a user casts a jutsu, he can control the effectiveness of it as well. If Itachi didn’t want to kill Sasuke, then he wouldn’t exactly use a full-blown tsukoyomi. I understand your point, tsukoyomi is a tsukoyomi, a genjutsu unrivaled by any other other than Shisui’s apparently. But, Itachi controls his genjutsu, he can control when to release it, when to activate it, when to weaken or strengthen it as well. Genjutsu is just another type of jutsu. And the scope of a jutsu is controlled based on how much chakra a shinobi puts into it. More chakra = stronger jutsu.


    By “features” do you mean her amazing hoo-hoos? I mean, take a look at em and you’ll go hoooooo baby…or something…

    And about the crow and who implanted what into which cavity of which person…yeah you could take that dirty btw…I think it’s ridiculous. Obviously, Kishi could’ve had Itachi implant it into himself, make it so when he sees Sasuke it would genjutsu him into protecting Konoha, but one, he doesn’t want to control his brother like that, and two, where would all the action for Naruto go? We’ve all been waiting for the epic showdown between Sasuke vs. Naruto whether you like to admit it or not. So yeah, Kishi had a minor plot hole, but so what? I give him credit for even thinking of it in the first place. And he’s smart to actually keep the plot going so that Naruto can come in and save the day and treat everybody to Ishiraku ramen (I think that’s what it’s called). AND the past is the past, we can’t make Kishi recall this chapter and make him rewrite to the way we see fit. So LET IT GO. It’s pointless to argue about it when you could be debatin bout something else like…why the @#$* is tenten even in the story =D? Just kill her off already, Kishi, honestly…

    As for the Gedo Mazo and the Sword of Totsuka problem…
    If Nagato can summon his bunny-breeding dog and his big-mouthed crane then I have no reason to doubt that he can summon Gedo Mazo as well. I just don’t know if Madara will let that because Madara is contracted with the statue as well. If Madara allows Kabuto to summon Gedo Mazo, it’d be like Kabuto taking a shit on Madara’s fan in his room and then Madara turns it on full speed… Same concept with the Sword of Totsuka. It’s linked with Itachi’s Susano’o and its not a chakra sword so whoever (I can’t seem to find the name I’m sorry) said that Nagato could just absorb Totsuka, you’re wrong. Slap yourself in the face. JK!!…maybe…give it a thought.

    I have a question though. Do you guys think Naruto will learn FTG technique? I mean he already moves as fast as Yondaime already now that he’s dodged steroid-kage’s crack-induced attack. He’s already super fast, personally, I don’t think he’s gonna learn it. But I’m open for somebody to prove me wrong.

  143. Btw sorry for the long comments, I’m not on the site during the day so I gotta catch up in bulk.

  144. @Pisbolman
    Interesting point. It is plausible that Danzo did not take the eye by force. It could be accurate to say Danzo couldn’t have gotten the eye without Shisui’s consent. However, at this point the detail is trivial.

    Itachi’s thoughts: Keep Shisui’s eye away from enemy hands, Cleanse Sasuke and his quest for revenge, and ensure that he returns to leaf a hero. Knowing Madara would likely try to get to Sasuke, he left the fail-safe with Naruto. This meant if Sasuke went dark, there was a safe and guaranteed confrontation that would lead to kotoamatsukami and victory.

    Brainwashing your brother who you love more than you’re ideals is not something one wants to do. You want to believe you’re family can change and walk down the right path with their own decisions. It was essentially an ‘all-in’ gamble, and fate seems to have given him a bigger lolz than the last ten years of the U.S. economy.

    What could this lead to? When have we seen cool headed characters suddenly become the ‘century slayer’? Yes, Itachi rage may be coming, and what better a counter than zombie Nagato rage? I vote it ends with Itachi’s soul being eaten while he impales Nagato with the sword of totsuka.

    Itachi went easy on Sasuke, but he did not dumb down his jutsu. He was smart; he knew what Sasuke could and could not handle as I believe Super stated. Based on the evidence presented, I can agree it was a strange version of tsukuyomi, it has been noted quite far in the past that someone related by blood could break it. I won’t comment on whether or not genjutsu activated from eye contact could work on the rinnegan. This is the same eye that failed to see through a field of shadow clones disguised as rocks…

    Bubble: *Whatever noise you would make regurgitating a live bird that’s been inside you for months* “This crow…could it be…?”

    Caption: Rockin’ a mangekyo sharingan like a G? Yes. The awesomeness power that is mysterious and going to pwn Sasuke? Not anymore…U mad?

  145. W/cranksatnyc

    Further reiterating the sword of totsuka not being chakra, it is an ethereal weapon.

  146. *Just finished watching the video Alec posted*

    Response:…………….Imposibru! *Shoots confetti out of rear*

  147. @ Super,

    Fair point. I remembered the Moon being there in the Anime though so I was going with that.

    Nevertheless my point still stands. Itachi couldn’t have used the full effect of the Tsukuyomi because if Sasuke couldn’t handle it Itachi would have ‘won’.


    By “features” do you mean her amazing hoo-hoos? I mean, take a look at em and you’ll go hoooooo baby…or something…”

    Off course not,… When have I ever said anything about ladyparts… >__>

    “And about the crow and who implanted what into which cavity of which person…yeah you could take that dirty btw…I think it’s ridiculous. Obviously, Kishi could’ve had Itachi implant it into himself, make it so when he sees Sasuke it would genjutsu him into protecting Konoha”

    I don’t know the exact conditions for the activation but I think it’s a safe assumption that it can only be activated by being looked upon with a MS. So for it to work like you said Itachi would have to have Sasuke’s MS.
    If it was possible for Itachi to set the eye to react to the Sharingan (which are all identical part from 2 or 3 tomoes) he would have used it on Madara for sure. But that’s just my assumption.

    On a side note,

    Who here thinks Shisui is still alive. I do. Why? Because he ‘disappeared’. The perfect excuse for Kishi to have him resurface later on.
    I just wonder whether it’s possible Shisui knew/knows about Madara as well and made plans to counter Madara’s actions.

  148. @AJD

    Yup! That’s what i’m thinking too. Knowing how strong Shishui is. Maybe he entrusted his one eye to Danzo to be the other failsafe just in case Madara or Sasuke turn against Konoha but then it’s not activated when he fought Sasuke. Im guessing Shishui just gave his other eye to Danzo to use for Konoha. But still I’d love to see his other eye in action not just crushed when Danzo killed himself. What if Danzo used it against Sasuke the time they fought and turn Sasuke’s mind to fight Madara instead? That would have been something but sad to say Shishui’s other eye was just crushed when Danzo chooses to kill himself.

    The big question now is “Are we gonna see Gedo Mazo with Nagato summoning it?” because we know that Madara has Gedo Mazo too.

    and Susano’o with Sword of Totsuka along with the Yata Mirror? along with those jutsus are what is more powerful? it’s trivial as what jutsu is stronger than the other. Maybe we will be enlighted by Kishi in the next few chapters to come about Gedo Mazo and Sword of Totsuka history how they get those.


    I think Shishui knows about Madara too. I agree with you that Shishui’s disappearance is controversial. Kishi must brought that too in a few pages how he disappear.

    I think the crow with Shishui eye is for Naruto’s keep forever… but i doubt it too when Kabuto heard about Shishui eye he said his luck is getting better and better meaning he’s not just up for Naruto and Bee but Shishui eye too. it’s like 3 birds in one shot. But sure he’s hands are gonna be full as two powerful Jinchurikii + Itachi are in the way.

  149. ////
    /^.\\/ Kakashi’s the man!

  150. @Redbaron, if Shisui is really alive…how many beast-shinobi will there be alive? Honestly we already have Nagato, Itachi, Nine-tail Naruto, Hachibi, Madara, Sasuke (if you will consider his EMS), blah blah blah the list goes on and on + Shisui now. I don’t like the idea of so many strong shinobi at one time because it leads to fights that will be amazingly controversial and will be debated by fanboys on both sides. Plus, I think it draws away from the actual plot in general, unless Naruto fights all of them. But even then, the gradual increase in opponent level for Naruto, how will Kishi be able to determine that? There are so many consequences to this than there are advantages.

    That being said, it could also be used as a gauge to measure Naruto’s increasing fighting level. Remember he still has to learn how to go full out Kyuubi or atleast stage 2 mode and still remain in full control. He still has to learn how to use the Tailed Beast Bomb, he has a good chance of learning FTG, and if FTG isn’t Yondaime’s legacy, then Naruto still has that mysterious jutsu that Jiraiya and he worked on.

    But again, this is war, despite what we may believe, if Naruto has to fight every single badass out there…he’s gonna get tired. He’ll use too much of his Kyuubi chakra, thereby getting his chakra sucked outta him. And with Kabuto and Madara as the strategists behind this, I’m not surprised if they don’t unleash every part of their arsenal to capture him.

    I just don’t believe that at this time, there will be a revival of Shisui. At a later time, there’s a possibility. But answering this has made me think of a new question. Will Naruto go through the entire war with his current abilities and skill level? Because he’s in a constant state of war, I doubt he has time to learn all those techniques I mentioned before. It’s just a very confusing time right now. Kishi has opened up so many opportunities and possibilities that for us to come up and predict the sequential events is crazy. Good for him, bad for us. But obviously that still doesn’t stop us XD.

  151. It’s entirely possible that Shisui is alive. The Uchiha massacre at the time Itachi had fought Sasuke was 9 years. It may be year 10 now. If Shisui perfectly faked his death with kotoamatsukami, It makes sense Kabuto couldn’t find any trace of his corpse. If he is still alive, he either has no eyes or implanted ones. I doubt he’d be as powerful as someone like Itachi in his state. He will probably never show up unless they through plot twist and make him “Madara” (Very Seriously doubt that).

    It would also solidify Itachi’s decision to leave the crow with Naruto. It wasn’t ready yet.

    (2 hours later)

    0_o…I forgot what I was doing, so I’ll leave this comment and run.

  152. Well hello….been awhile. Just wanted to say i’m loving where the manga is heading..can’t wait to see it animated!

  153. @ cranksatnyc,

    But Shisui wouldn’t be an adversary to Naruto. Quite the contrary.

    “He still has to learn how to use the Tailed Beast Bomb, he has a good chance of learning FTG, and if FTG isn’t Yondaime’s legacy, then Naruto still has that mysterious jutsu that Jiraiya and he worked on. ”

    Wasn’t the Rasengan a substitute for the Tailed Beast Bomb? It has killed more people than any TBB and it is a lot more effective in battle without the colateral damage that comes with a TBB.
    As for the FTG. I don’t think Naruto will learn that skill since it’s a time-space jutsu that requires a high level of intellect to even comprehend. Naruto is street smart but he doesn’t have the intellect his father had. Besides, Naruto’s speed is now greater than A. No need to have him travel FTL just yet. Especially since that would make him practically invincible.
    Just imagine Minato flickering through a battle with the Kyuubi cloak, dissappearing and reappearing in random places, spamming Rasen Shurikens. Not even 6 paths of Madara’s Pain could do much against that.

  154. And welcome back Miranda.

    I agree with you, I am really anxious to see what a non-crippled, fully powered Nagato can do.

  155. Naruto will absolutely learn the FTG technique. there’s a perfectly good reason why no one else has been able to figure out how to do it, n that’s because naruto is the only living shinobi who has a chance to learn it. possibly because it has something to do with having the 4th’s blood. honestly i think that’s the reason no one else could do it, because you have to have the same blood, it’s like a blood-line limit.

  156. @redbaron, yeah i agree with you but still I think just the overload of really strong characters would lead us away from the general plot and theme for some reason. And yeah, FTG does seem outta Naruto’s reach I’m just saying its a possibility. Then again there’s like 50 billion other possibilities out there too.

    @dish, I think instead of blood it’s the seal that his special kunai have.

  157. @FTG Debate Sorry but I just can’t imagine Naruto learning that anymore. I wanted him to learn it more than any other thing, but right now it just makes no sense- Naruto is really fast as of right now and his fighting style is different than Minatos. It’s a pity that he didn’t learn it but in my opinion Kishi has already made his decision. But I’m actually pissed at Kakashi, I mean he has the damn Kunai but he probably just put it on the wall of his apartment for decoration. Either that or he uses it to scratch his back… Hasn’t he ever felt the need to at least show it to Naruto??

    Oh and a thing that would really interest me. How many of you think that Sasuke will die and how many that he will be convinced by Naruto?
    I don’t know anymore if the “save your friends” thing that we have seen throughout the manga can be applied to sasuke anymore.

  158. @dmaxx: i still think dark Zetzu is influencing Sasuke. Also, Sasuke has never announced an alliance with Madara (even after Danzo fight), and has, in fact, announced that he intends to *kill* Madara. So I think there’s still a chance he could be “saved”.

  159. i understand that it’s the seal that makes the technique work. i’m sayin the fact he has his father’s blood could be what activates it. orochimaru couldn’t get it to work, n he was a genius. i’d find it pretty dumb honestly if naruto couldnt figure out how to do it. he’s already surpassed the fourth in other aspects, n what is the one constant of the whole series? the next generation always surpasses the previous one.

  160. Kishi has been shown to pull a 180 on very important aspects of Naruto, so I wouldn’t be surprised if he also scraps the “Save the friends at any cost” mantra also. I hate that there is no manga this wiki. Just speculation. Not that your guys’ theories are bad but it’s just that! Theories! … Sorry, ranting bitch mode off.

    I feel that Naruto’s cloak form is now capable of dodging away from Madara’s black-hole jutsu.

  161. @dish11: Naruto sucks at seals. Even if he is an Uzumaki, he is an exception to the seal trait they carry. I have no doubt that there is a unique process that goes into the technique, but from what I understand, you just have to be good at understanding the seals that go into them. If no one knew how they worked, how can Naruto figure it out?

    It would be great for Naruto to learn when he’s not fighting in 9-tails cloak, but when is he not fighting in these new modes? as dmaxx3d states, it is not his style. Him figuring that out is almost worst than sharingan hax. It’s also just not happening time-wise. How can there be a war and you not fight the main villain? Everyone’s gone all-in, they won’t just say “let’s stop fighting so Naruto can train more.” They did that in bleach using time chambers, let’s hope they don’t pull one now.

    There can be no valid arc after this one, as they’ve exhausted all the potential baddies and dooms day plans in this one. This is probably as strong as Naruto gets, besides a potential temporary plot power up.

    Is it me, or is “that jutsu” Naruto’s supposedly been taught just a translation issue? If Naruto really had this amazing trump card jutsu, either it will kill him or he would have used it in those terrible situations he was in. I personally believe it was just pertaining to three/four tails cloak. Maybe I’m just being the neigh-sayer here but I like to think Naruto is going to make the correct decision to finish while they’re ahead.

  162. Something tells me that “JUTSU” requires the power of Kyuubi. FTG for sure can be learn by Naruto which is one of the jutsu to beat Madara/Kabuto/Sasuke on top of other jutsus Naruto would learn. But that “JUTSU” really would be something like out of the manga neither all of us haven’t predict or heard. 😀 And we should also not forget that Naruto “MIGHT” learn the Shikii Fuuin technique. His parent is good at sealing so might as well the Naruto would leanr that in the future.

  163. I think too that “that jutsu” is a combination of translation errors and simple misunderstandings. Jiraya probably referred at first to the kyuubi cloak and it is obvious that during Sage training Naruto meant the rasenshuriken. Some thing I definitely want to see however is Naruto befriending the Kyuubi and owning pretty much everyone and everything.

    Oh and a thought struck me just yesterday: Is it actually possible for Sasori to be caught in a Genjutsu? It’s not like he has a brain anyway. If not that would make him a lot stroner in any debate.
    Well, he was one of the strongest of The Narutoverse in my opinion, he just had a fight where all the advantages were on his opponemt’s side. I don’t think he would have lost to anyone except the usual powerhouses like Itachi, Nagato, Naruto ( only with kyuubi) and maybe some others. What are your thoughts on that?

  164. You guys sure left a lot of reading behind, I enjoyed all the posts and topics so far but the one I want to jump in to is the FTG isuue and THAT jutsu.

    1st off the FTG was originally the 2nd Hokage Tobirama’s technique stated by Minato in his fight with Tobi, so it’s not a blood or trait knowledge not unless Tobirama was minato’s grandfather or something like that (they do look alike, strangely). So I think the technique can be learned by anyone talented enough.
    As for Naruto learning the jutsu, sure it would be awesome for him because he would have a far greater range of action due to the fact that he can place a tag or seal or sealed kunai anywhere he wants, just like Minato used to do.

    So that would be a added bonus for Naruto, but as far as his speed goes, he’s faster now then Minato was when using the FTG because Minato only dodged A at his highest speed with the FTG, Naruto did it with his own speed. So in terms of speed Naruto is the fastest shinobi in the narutoverse thus far.

    Now about “THAT JUTSU” I don’t want it to be so but I think it’s actually the TBB, Bee said that the rassengan was especially left behind for Naruto just so he could use it without going full kyuubi mode. So that to me means it’s Minato’s legacy to Naruto, so far we’ve been shown so many deviations about the rassengan most people might think that’s all Naruto can do. Even if he has the wind style, besides rassengan Naruto doesn’t use other shape manipulation jutsu. Remember “Waves Of Rage”, we all thought Naruto was going to hit Pain with a jutsu that would leave us speechless but all we got was the Fuuton Rassen Shuriken being thrown, that was a let down due to the fact that Naruto is basically incapable of learning or making a new Jutsu on his own. All he dose is upgrade old jutsus, even if the upgrades have a great effect on the jutsus the diversity is nowhere to be seen in Naruto’s skills.

    It could be something else the frogs and Jiraiya referred to as “THAT JUTSU” but so far I can’t see what that something is, but when it happens I’m sure we’ll be told by Kishi.

  165. Bubble: Oh no! A dick!

    Caption: Itachi’s actual imprinted command: “Don’t be a dick.”

  166. :)) :)) :)) I don’t care who decides the winner for the bubble contest, but this week’s flawless winner should be GAVIN, lol dude I can’t stop laughing :)) =))

  167. @ajd: Naruto could have been navel gazing…. a complex seal he looks at on a daily basis… could learn a thing or two from it…

  168. @Eugen

    I thought so too.. but with a unique deviation or variation of the rasengan. As I stated on my last post before this that it might require the Kyuubi’s power in order to complete that “JUTSU” since we know that Kyuubi’s not that easy to tame and on that training with Jiraiya. We may be seeing jutsu that was left behind by his father that hasn’t been shown or talked about in the manga since then. Like I said it’s something might be of a out of the manga(I mean the awesomeness) jutsu we can imagine. 😀 I agree with you too about the FTG. He’ll learn that. I bet my ass! 😀 lol! Tenrai might eat my ass..(runs away palm covering my ass) lol 😀

  169. About Naruto not being good at seals; he’s not bad at doing seals but most of his techniques require simple seals like the shadow clones and sexy jutsu but he also learned a combination of seals for the summoning jutsu ,very fast I might add.

    So Naruto’s problem is the nondiversity of his jutsus that doesn’t require much hand seals, but that doesn’t mean he’s bad at doing seals. Actually I’d go as far as to say that he learns hand seals really fast.

    I hope that by the mid point of this war Naruto stumbles upon the banana fan so he will be able to use every element he wants and maybe make different element types rassengan; I give anything to see a Raiton Rasengan or a Katon one.

    It must be on Kishi’s mind that either Naruto or Bee use the tool being the only ones able to harness that much chakra and power, maybe the Raikage too. I wonder if the rassengan combined with the earth element will turn out to look like normal pool ball or a rock.

  170. @ Pisbol, I’m sure you’re right about the fact that the “JUTSU” requires the aid of the Kyuubi and being in full control over the beast. So we can only speculate Naruto can’t make use of it just yet.
    But as far as it goes I really hope it’s not another rassengan, Please Kishi don’t make it another rassengan, please.

    Also it would be great to see some top secret jutsus left behind by both Minato and Kushina for Naruto to use. We can only speculate that a shinobi grows in power, skill and mind as time passes and as they grow older. Just think about the fact that Naruto has only 16 years and knows what he knows. Both he and Sasuke could be considered above any genius for there skills at there young age. The only other prodigy I can think of that was STRONGER at there age is Nagato, who had the rinnegan at his disposal, other then he I can think of no one else

  171. @Eugen, Minato never said anything about FTG being Tobirama’s technique. He just said Madara’s space-time jutsu surpassed his and Tobirama’s. FTG is Minato’s signature technique, no other person can use it at this time

    Plus, Naruto manipulated the seal on the Nine-tails so he does know about fuuin jutsus, or atleast the one on his stomach

  172. cranksatnyc, just as the link you posted states; Madara’s space time ninjutsu exceeds both Minato’s and Tobirama’s so that means one of two things; Either Tobirama could use a technique similar to that of Minato’s if not the same one or something like Madara’s own jutsu.

    When using a space time ninjutsu that is based on traveling from one point to another I don’t see much difference in the techniques apart from the incipient stage when you initiate the jutsu, either like Madara through the use of the sharingan, or minato’s use of tags and seals that can be attached to any object or person in order to move through the space, or worm hole, between the two or more seals. Just like a network of pipes.

    So to say Tobirama used pretty much the same ninjutus as Minato is not as impossible as you might think, Tobirama not having a sharingan I doubt he knew another way to send himself flying through space by some other means then tags with seals similar to Minato’s.

    He might not have used the kunai as a battle aid like Minato but I’m sure he had he’s own means of teleportation.

  173. Wow, Eugen! You’re really keeping the blog alive!

    By the way, do you think that maybe the Second’s teleportation had something to do with his mastery of Suiton jutsu? It just popped up in my mind when I thought of how Tobi’s teleportation reminds me of waves and currents…

  174. 1st- seal master’s aren’t born that way..they are taught. all naruto has to do is get some one to teach him about seals. that bein said..idk who that would be at this point besides kakashi, but the fact that he “sucks at seals” is because no one ever taught him how to do them.
    2nd- FTG was a technique only used by (and i’m pretty sure created by) naruto’s father. with all the help minato has been with the kyubbi it isn’t far-fetched to think he left a way to help naruto figure it out

  175. eugen, yeah but you said FTG was originally Tobirama’s technique…it really wasn’t. And yeah a slut is a slut and a whore is a whore but there could be sexier sluts or fatter sluts or stupid sluts. Tobirama’s space-time ninjutsu could be easier or more complex than FTG. And if you say that FTG was a mimic of Tobirama’s technique then Tobirama’s technique could be based off of studying Madara’s technique. And knowing Kishi, we can’t assume that space-time ninjutsu can only be accomplished using seals/tags or a sharingan.

  176. @Eugen

    😀 And I guess that there’s more to FTG Level two. Sasuke is getting powered up with ninjutsu and genjutsu. So do Naruto might as well. I know we know that Naruto is on the higher level now but that only consist of speed not ninjutsu and genjutsu except for the variation of rasengan. I’d love to see “HOW” naruto can upgrade that FTG Level Two into something we never imagine like Madara’s transportation. I know FTG will be introduced in the near future as it plays a big role on Naruto defeating Madara and Sasuke and Kabuto. and how the FTG was created. In chapter 499 Kushina told Naruto that she taught Minato lots of seals i’m thinking that including the FTG seal mark on the kunai.

    On the side note. I’d love to see Naruto learn that badass genjutsu Jiraiya casted on 3 of Nagato’s 6 paths.. 😀

  177. @ Dragon, thanks a lot dude but we’re all here to keep up the good mood, so I’ll do my best just like everyone else, I remember not long ago You, Ahsan, SCHY and Spill kept IRA working on your own and did it really great I might add.

    As for Tobirama using the water for teleportation, now that is a great idea and it would explain how he could summon so much water at any given time and place too. Great idea ;).

    @ Dish, I totally agree with you 100%, so far naruto had teachers that didn’t use that many hand signs in there training like Jirayia, Kakashi is a master at using seals but seeing as he only taught Naruto the wind style in particular he never really had that much training time alone with Naruto besides that one training session. So Naruto not knowing that many hand seals or more correctly not applying the seals to his own jutsu is because he never really practiced moves and jutsu that require the skill in particular. Personally I think a lot of seals suck because they can give your move away and they take precious time on the battle field to do.

    @ cranksatnyc, loved the analogy a lot and I will admit you were right, what ever space time ninjutsu Tobirama used can’t be proven to be the FTG unless kishi himself says so, so with that I give you props for sticking to your argument, witch indeed was the right one.

    @ Pisbol, Naruto doing a lvl2 FTG and even upgrading that, like he’s known to do with his jutsu, would be awesomeness beyond anything. I wonder IF he dose learn the technique, will he use Kunai or will he come up with something cooler to throw the seal around in order to teleport.
    I’d love to see him implement the seals somehow in mini rassenshuriken and throw them at random enemies finishing them off in a badass manner like Minato did to Tobi.

    End of Rant, good night/morning/afternoon guys I’m goona go to bed because its almost 5 am and I’ve been on the graveyard shift.

  178. @Pisbol, a nice upgrade to the FTG would be Naruto use Tajuu Kage Bunshin and then with each clone having a seal for space-time ninjutsu, like 50 different clones could transport to one clone and then use Oodama Rasenrengan or Rasenshuriken-barrage or something. And with his Nine-tails chakra mode, he could use a bunch of shadow clones, speed off to anywhere he can be in a few seconds, and then using FTG he could instantly transport across every single battlefield in a flash. Epic fantasmic awesomeness rape sauce pwnage of over 9000? I think so O_o

  179. @Eugen, I love how you take on 4 different debates at the same time like a boss haha

  180. @Eugen

    Yeah! we’re giving some of our crazy ideas but who knows one of our ideas is right! 😀 Naruto upgraded the rasengan into many variation. big or small.


    Holy cow!!! 😀 😀 😀 a barrage of rasen shuriken in a tajuu kagebunshin + FTG would be totally over 9000 awesomeness!

    I came across this chapter where Minato put a contract seal.

    Does anyone know what does this mean? When Madara retreated Minato followed him which got Madara surpised. Meaning Minato can follow him anywhere because of that marking somewhere on his body? Something tells me that it is connected to Naruto’s battle against Madara as Naruto would learn FTG and then find that he can follow Madara anywhere he go and then find Sasuke.

  181. @pisbol, the contract seal is to relinquish the control a summoner has over a creature they summoned. So Madara summoned the kyuubi, and Minato used the contract seal to make sure Madara couldn’t control it anymore.

    And the FTG seal he placed on Madara…he can wash it off…in a shower?…haha nice try man

  182. @ Pisbol & Crank, actually I too was hoping, In spite of the fact that Madara knew the seal for the FTG was placed on him that it would remain on his body somehow.

    It’s tricky because Madara swaps a lot of body parts when he gets injured but the seal was placed on his back where he was hit with the rasengan by Minato, not a very easy place to reach and change if need be. I don’t know, anything could happen, someone pointed earlier ( sorry but I didn’t find the exact post, I think it was Marks or Red) that Minato left behind a kunai for kakashi when he was young and if naruto can get that kunai and somehow learn the FTG he might just have an automatic pathway str8 to Madara’s ass.

    Now picture a 1000 years of pain done with a mini rassen shuriken and 9 TAILS. I don’t care how many battles you’ve been in, that’s gotta hurt like 25 years in one prison showers.

  183. I see some old debates rising up again. Lol.

    It’s too bad there are no new manga this week. It’s gonna be a quiet one…

  184. Hmm…about Tobirama’s Space/Time no jutsu. It could be some crazy awesome summoning skills.

    But I highly doubt it. That’s the only thing I can think of besides Minato’s FTG, Madara’s Space/Time no Jutsu and…any other Space/Time no Jutsu? Oh yeah, Kakashi’s Mangekyou Sharingan.

    I don’t think Kishi ever revealed Tobirama’s jutsu besides his affinity for Suiton jutsu. We only learned recently that Tobirama created Edo Tensei. Kishi is either trying to hype and pump up the 2nd Hokage because he realizes how dim he is in the light of the other Hokages, or there’s more to Tobirama than meets the eye.

    -Created a jutsu that revives the dead with the sacrifice of a living being.
    -Had a Space/Time No jutsu.
    -Master of Suiton jutsu
    -Persecuted the Uchiha and sectioned them off in a corner of the village.
    -Sacrificed himself for his comrades and appointed Hiruzen the 3rd Hokage.

    Tobirama is a little bit of this and a little bit of that.

  185. @ Super, personally I always regarded Tobirama as one of the coolest shinobi out there mostly for how he looks. But as time passed and Kishi gave us more and more info on him I started to realize he was a great hokage as well. He actually was a great innovator and made a lot of powerful jutsu if he managed to pull off something like Edo tensei on his own. Also Minato was actually referring to movement space/time ninjutsu otherwise he wouldn’t have included Tobirama in a discussion about himself and Madara’s speed skills.

    That’s why I originally regarded Tobirama a a pioneer of the Flying Thunder God. Also he was known for having a lightning blade (I think it was only shown in the anime with Ibiki Moreno’s brother) but I doubt that sort of info would be planted in the story without no real relevance in the main story line. So that must mean Tobirama also had an affinity for lightning based jutsu as well as water (water + electricity = very very fast movement over large ares if there wet) Maybe he did use water as a conduit from one place to another and then used his lightning style for the fast movement needed to travel between the spaces.

    I hope we get a flashback of both Hashirama and Tobirama’s glory days and see what they could really do.

    But from what we do see in the manga now and the 2nd Tsuchikage and Muzukage being as strong as they were I doubt Tobirama couldn’t hold his own against them especially after seeing there reactions to the fact that they were summoned by his original jutsu.

  186. To me, Tobirama was probably the one Hokage who had the most negative effect on Konoha and the world as a whole.

    I’m sorry, but someone who supposedly believes in the “Will of Fire” but then creates a jutsu that brings the dead to life and enslaves them to the user’s will, just seems too shady to me. The fact that his decisions also lead to the extermination of the Uchiha clan and the birth of one of the most vile and corrupt jutsu to ever exist, doesn’t help either.

    However, in saying that, I also believe that there is very little chance of Tobirama somehow being related to Tobi. If they were one and the same person, there would be no need for Tobi to ask Kabuto the weaknesses of Edo Tensei or how it works, especially if he was the original creator of the technique. I would also imagine that Tobi would have perfected the technique himself in his elongated life and used it to his own advantage as well on a level that would be beyond Kabuto’s after so much time in development.

    I just think that Tobirama made some really bad choices and perhaps he had a darker mind than his brother did, kinda like Danzou. But that doesn’t mean he wanted to destroy Konoha or that it was some secret plot to take over the world, it just means he may have been willing to make sacrifices – including the sacrifice of his own humanity – to make his village better in a way he perceived as the most effective. (Danzou, too, was also willing to walk a dark path of blood and sacrifice to affect his own vision of a better Konoha).

    So, I would go with the option that Kishi was just pumping him up to make him seem more prominent as a Hokage in the likes of his fellow hokage, who’s exploits were far more well known and revered up until now. I mean, he does have to compete with the professor, the one who defeated Madara and the famed Yellow Flash himself. It’s quite stiff competition. Lol.

  187. But Tenrai.




    Conclusive evidence.

  188. @ Tenrai, we actually don’t know for sure if Madara did say the truth about Tobirama and his involvement with the uchiha’s downfall.

    It might be true, it might not, so far I’m regarding almost everything Tobi said as doubtful. He did said the truth about Itachi, it seems but he isn’t a person you would want to trust with your life. Now regarding jutsu like Edo Tensei, I do admit its a bit of a mad and scary jutsu but remember the opponents and instability in those days. Having trump cards like that was mandatory especially against foes like the uchiha, who could use skills like tsukuyome and amaterasu and maybe even susano’o. So matching the Uchiha’s skilsl was a real struggle maybe even for the Senju that’s why all shinobi in the same age group as Hashirama and Tobirama, Muu and Madara were as strong as they were.

    The fact is they didn’t know pace and stability all they knew was kill or be killed and the only way to be top dog back then would have consisted in the best and most powerful jutsu.

    Maybe it doesn’t make it right but it was there way of life and anyone is entitled to there own life and self preservation.

  189. @ Super, Sarutobi; Saru-Tobi; Tobi 😉

  190. @Eugen

    You are forgetting that Hashirama had most of the tailed beasts under his control before the alliance with the Uchiha was formed to create Konoha. Now, if you want “trump cards” that would allow them to go against the Sharingan, it doesn’t get much better than that. This is also discounting the Senju’s alliance clan and distant relatives, the Uzumaki, who were revered feared in their own right.

    Quite frankly, the use of Edo Tensei doesn’t seem justified no matter how you put it and it goes against the principles of those who follow the will of fire. That is probably why it was declared a forbidden jutsu once its dark nature was realised.

  191. @ Tenrai, regarding your last post I have no objections to what your saying but if I’m not mistaken we were talking about individual power not power as a group.

    Sure Hashirama was strong due to his mokuton and the ability to control bijuu but that was his own skill and Tobirama had his own as well, if you think about comparing the two you can hardly compensate Tobirama’s Mastery of water jutsus, edo tensei, space time ninjutsu and who knows what else to Hashirama’s brute power.

    It only just evens out the balance between the two. I regard Hashirama and Tobirama as the relation between Jiraiya and Orochimaru or Naruto and Sasuke.

    One part wields raw power while the other relies more on innovating personal S class jutsu.

    You can see the pattern with Jiraiya who had skills like the rassengan, toad summoning and sage mode and was a powerhouse that could bring you down with skills that could of been B or C class but with the addition of his great chakra pool he turned those skills into A an S class jutsu.

    On the other hand Orochimaru is a more calculated fighter who relies on discovering as much as he can about unknown jutsu just to give him every edge in a fight. It’s the same for Naruto and Sasuke.

    I can see how this skill “Edo Tensei” could seem a bit evil, because of the human sacrifice but we can’t know for sure if that’s the same method Tobirama used it. Either way I don’t really judge shinobi’s jutsus only what they use them for.

  192. Thought burst:

    Naruto is defeated and Madara, having achieved his “Moon’s Eye Plan”, casts Sasuke’s corpse to Kabuto as promised. Kabuto, an excellent medical nin, heals Sasuke and asks him to fight Madara (or revives him with Edo Tensei). Sasuke refuses, and Kabuto tells his childhood story (flashback time). Sasuke is then convinced to help Naruto, and together they defeat Madara. Having helped defeat the great enemy, Sasuke is forgiven by the Kages.

    Bullshit, or not?

  193. @ Tobirama’s edo tensi. He could have used it for good. We all agree that back then it was a mush harsh narutoverse. Tobirama could have used this “evil” jutsu by getting a really bad guy (murder and the likes) and using his/her body to revive someone who had previously been killed by powerful ninja to gain intel. Who knows, he might have done that jedi thing (where the ghost of a jedi can come back and give advice) and do that thing with Hashirama and ask him for advice.
    What Eugen said, also makes sense about exploring different jutsu. He could have revived Hyugas and put them under control to study their fighting style, eye technique. And could have done it with others as well. Maybe that’s why his student knew so much (The Third), because Tobirama passed down the jutsu he learned.

  194. You know, I seriously doubt Sasuke is going to like the fact that Kabuto brought his dead brother back to life and forced him to fight in the war agaisnt Kanoha. I doubt Sasuke will ever join teams with Kabuto. He will probably be more interested in learning how Kabuto used Edo Tensei so that he can personally bring Itachi back himself.

  195. Based on his grey hair…i wonder if Kabuto is related to Tobirama some how… or maybe Kakashi?.

  196. “I mean, he does have to compete with the professor, the one who defeated Madara and the famed Yellow Flash himself. It’s quite stiff competition. Lol.”

    And don’t forget Tsunade! She knows… uhm…. she did… uhm…..well, she helped……. uhm………. Well, she healed Kakashi and Sasuke!

    As for Tobirama and Edo Tensei. We have no idea whether he ever used Edo Tensei. It IS a kinjutsu after all. Perhaps Tobirama tried to find a way to revive a deceased person of interest but discovered the only way that was possible was to sacrifice someone else. We don’t look at Chiyo’s Kisho Tensei in disgust when it’s actually almost the same technique.

  197. The way I see things with Edo Tensei this is probably how it was intended to be used, most likely in war time.

    Step 1: Kill an important enemy target and collect DNA sample. (killing shinobi is rather easier than trying to take them alive)

    Step 2: Find an enemy flunky that can be sacrificed for the Jutsu (since he would kill you in a heartbeat, this negates the cold blooded murder aspect that would normally be involved here)

    Step 3: Resurrect the target with Edo Tensei, get him/her to tell you all the secrets he/she knows. (This step being the entire purpose of the Jutsu)

    Step 4: Order the target ( who is likely to be a highly trained killer) to go slaughter your enemies, that or spy on them if they don’t know you killed him/her in the first place (his/her previous allies). This step is optional and probably a bonus in war time as it’s likely that He/She will either kill a lot of enemy ninja before being sealed, or relay plenty of valuable military intelligence to you. Either way is a win in my book.

    Seeing as how this could significantly shorten a war (theoretically reducing casualties on both sides) I don’t see any reason why Tobirama wouldn’t have used it given the chance.

    There you have it, Edo Tensei for Dummies =P

  198. BTW,

    Shisui’s eyes got me thinking. Shisui had the Mangekyo but in order to get the Mangekyo he would (as instructed by the Uchiha tablets) need to kill his best friend. Seeing as Shisui didn’t kill Itachi and Itachi didn’t kill Shisui, how did they awaken their Mangekyo Sharingan? We know Kakashi found an alternative so Itachi and Shisui probably figured that alternative out as well. Question is, what’s the alternative?

    Furthermore, if Shisui had unlocked the Mangekyo did Danzou have a Mangekyo eye or just a regular Sharingan eye.

  199. @my earlier statement: “Naruto sucks at seals.” – that was a poor choice of words, but I don’t take them back. When it comes to his current skills and fighting strategies, he is lacking the knowledge and therefore “sucks.” I don’t doubt his potential. Well made arguments Eugen, and I can say I may be jumping the gun on FTG.

    Tobirama does have the darkest run as a Hokage, but when you consider what old school ninjas in an all out war would do, it’s not so surprising. In fact, I say it was a very cunning strategy.

    @redbaron, In Chiyo’s case, it was her own life force that it stole, which is a bit less demented. It’s actually pretty much the “light” version, returning your target to “free will” life. Quality comes at a high cost in this case.

    Here’s a question: If no one has died after having edo tensei zombies running around, how can they possibly confirm that the zombies would stick around after you died? For that matter, how did Shisui/Itachi know it would take a decade for kotoamatsukami to be usable again? Were there others in the clans history that could do it?…Wait, not a huge window, since Madara was the first to unlock mangekyo…

    I’m making my own head hurt on this one. Anyone care to clarify these?

  200. The idea of sacrifice is as old as the human race itself. So is the desire to bring dead people back to life (especially those we love dearly). To say that Tobirama lost his sense of humanity purely because he invented edo tensei is ridiculous. It’s actually quite the opposite. His actions were VERY human, just not acceptable by the standards we uphold today.

  201. @ ajd,

    But would it be OK if Tobirama used serial killers as sacrifices to resurrect important people? And Edo Tensei itself doesn’t rob the resurrected of their free will. Edo Tensei is just a resurrection technique. The Kunai (and the jutsu) that is placed inside the resurrected robs them of their free will.
    Perhaps Tobirama was working on a jutsu to bring them back to life AND give them their identity back.

    “For that matter, how did Shisui/Itachi know it would take a decade for kotoamatsukami to be usable again? Were there others in the clans history that could do it?…Wait, not a huge window, since Madara was the first to unlock mangekyo…”

    The Sharingan shows chakra, perhaps they can see chakra building up in someone’s eye (in this case Shisui’s). If you know the level of chakra required for the jutsu prior to it’s release and than watch how fast chakra builds up after the jutsu is used you can calculate how long it would take before the jutsu can be used again.
    That’s from a scientific point of view however.
    It could be Itachi and Shisui knew because of the experience from other clan members but chances are Kishi just gave it a figure for dramatic effect like he did with Konan’s 600 billion exploding tags.

  202. @ Ajd and Darks, i think you guys portrayed Tobirama best, he and his unholy jutsu. There’s a lot of taboo upon those years in the narutoverse and the potential for new jutsu was still at it’s peak, personally I regard Tobirama as a genius for developing a jutsu like Edo Tensei on his own, It’s a hard thing to do unlike the Uchiha and Hyuga who have there eyes to make the process easier. He showed real wits and smarts to experiment with resurrection and space/time jutsus that are now considered S class and forbidden.

    As for Your point Red, I too though about the upgrade to the MS a lot in the past but all I could think about was, and this is more in Kakashi’s case, What if you think about a friend that you loved a lot in the past and he died but you didn’t actually killed him, Kakashi had Obito, Rin and even Minato to think about, maybe that’s what spurred the transformation both for him and Itachi and Shisui.
    Whatever it was I would have hoped Kishi would reveal the process in the future but I guess he has no intention to.

    And if one could awaken the MS maybe there;s a way to use the EMS without a spare also. All I know is Kakashi’s the man to do it if it’s possible.

    Wouldn’t that be a slap on Sasuke’s emo cheek, for a non Uchiha like Kakashi showing up with EMS saying ” I did it on my own you little pussy”.

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