Naruto 507 Breakdown: Lies! All lies!! (De)motivational poster and last week’s debate results inclusive; plus, what I would like to call “comment(s) of the week.” WHOOP! The Naruto breakdown is not last for once!

`*logs onto WRA*

*reads comments*

. . .

Ahahaha!!

Hahahaaaa!!

*deep breath*

Hahahahahaha!!!

If you’re trying to decide which is funnier between the fact alone that he’s firing “random projectiles” in his sleep and the fact that these “projectiles” are fired right after being “curious on Orochimaru,” then we’re on the same boat. I suggest we just laugh at the whole.

But don’t worry, Kage. Your body is just going through some changes.

*dies of laughter before the flaming boulders start coming*

HAHAHA!! I SAID COMING!

#dead

Something tells me I won't be able to live this down. >_>

Hello, my pretties! It is I, the Pickles Captain, coming to you live and direct from a reinforced panic room 500 ft in the ground. That leaves me with about five minutes until a certain raging individual claws his way through multiple layers of bare earth on a mission to exact a very painful revenge, which ultimately send me on a one-stop course to meet my maker for about the 6th time this past month.

Oh, that reminds me…I met some pretty cool people up there.

@Avatar: Papa says to not worry about him, so you just keep on livin’, brother. 😉

@Prawlkage: MJ says, “Ok, you can stop beating it now.” >_>

Nope, definitely can't live this one down...>_>

Don’t bother telling me, I already know I’m going to die a slow, painful death when my time has come—kind of like one particular character this last chapter showed us. But this is me getting ahead of myself.

I’ll start by saying last chapter had me reminiscing about the good old days of the series: the times when dead meant dead; when little boys looked like little girls; and when jonin were the finest specimen of badass known this side of the planet.

However, time has passed now, and for better, for worse, things have  changed. Now, dead means Kabuto just got a new playmate, and little boys don’t look like little girls anymore. Grown men just look like grown women. Still, one man is determined to prove that some jonin still know their way around their victim’s behind, and find a suitable location to implant a deep, never-come-off footprint.

In my opinion, 507 wasn’t awesome. It was awe-a-lot.

Bad puns FTW!

Hopefully, he also taught you how to dodge the counter-technique called "Lawsuit."

It was nice to know, when I read the comments, that I wasn’t the only one who tried to make their hands like Gai. I think I got it just about right, but no giant tigers came shooting out. Even so, I wasn’t aimed at my baby cousin just yet.

So far, I’ve only spoken of Gai-sensei and his wild escapades. But that only accounted for about half of the chapter’s awesome.

We were briefly taken through two short stints of Kisame’s checkered past which featured some pretty interesting points of note: lies, lies, lies, and more lies! For all Kisame knows, the tooth fairy is a burly pro wrestler with a hockey stick.

“Can you smell what my bad acting is cooking?”

Yea, I didn’t see that movie, either…

...And so was the start of a great friendship.

So far, as the series has progressed, we have learned that each member of Akatsuki was not just a malicious s-class ninja killer. They were a malicious s-class ninja killer with purpose: one for which they sell their soul to a criminal organization.

Nagato: To make the world witness his own personal adaptation of justice, invariably bringing about “peace;” Itachi: to keep an eye on his village while maintaining an antagonist persona to make his killer into a hero.

Well, for Kisame, it was one thing: truth.

Yet, does he really know the truth about the one who calls himself Madara?

Do you by any chance have a daughter?

I’m truly at my wit’s end with this guy. I’m starting to believe that “Madara” may actually be two people!

Everyone say congrats to Kantonkage! 😀

For one thing, in this chapter, “Madara” was shown wearing bandages from torso to toe as if he were wounded throughout; whereas before AND after this very moment in time, the “same Madara” was depicted as having a human body which was…well…inhuman. Minato sent his left hand flying and he later plopped off his right arm like Action Man. And what came out? Creamy goo. Yea…not something you’d put a bandage on…especially not when you can just plop back the detached appendage like he has been shown to do.

And again, what manga character has two completely different hairstyles? Well “Madara” does. Prior to Konoha’s formation, it was long. A little while after that, sixteen years ago, it was short. About seven years after that, it was long again. A few years later (in this chapter) it was still long, but Heaven only knows what it was in-between. And now, in the present day, it’s back to looking like Elen Degeneres after black hair dying and gallons of hairspray.

So let’s see: long, then short, then long, and back to short…

Yup, it’s official. Madara’s hair is a penis.

Sigh...

So here we have two supposedly different heads and two supposedly different bodies. And coincidentally, each head has a specific body counterpart and vice versa, so there never is a crossing. In other words, short hair is to gooey body, and long hair is to normal body. Never have they been showed to be mixed or paired otherwise, which further hints to two supposedly different personalities.

Conclusion: there are supposedly two different “Madaras”…supposedly. >_>

In this case, the possibilities become even more wide open than they have ever been. I’d go about listing them one after the other, but my time is quickly running out.

Well hey, I’m sure that my logic is flawed at some point; I just haven’t found where that is. Maybe you can help me with that?

In the end, before we can really find out for sure, Kisame goes all Million Dollar Baby and bites his own tongue to snap himself back to consciousness. And, well…

It's been swallowed by background lining effects! =O

Biting one’s tongue (hard enough)  leads to exsanguination. That’s physician speak for “bleeding to death.” And the way Kisame is looking, it seems he’ll be following me to the same place I’ll be going by the time this breakdown is finished.

Gai is still not completely out of commission. Yamato can still make fine firewood. Naruto can surely work up a decent fire. And Killer Bee doesn’t need chakra for some slicing and dicing.

Well guys, I dare say these boys will be be having themselves some grilled sushi tonight.

BUBBLITION CONTEST

Oh boy. This was a toughie. Almost every entry was a great one. But! There had to be some cuts.

5) Bostankhan

bubblition:-
Kisame:(awakes from sleep) WTF! its gonna eat me! awwwwwwww.my worst nightmare came tr-..
samehada:shut up im not ur fu**ing dick thats gonna eat ur head.
Caption: The moral is”Look before u scream noobs”

4) Lol! I just saw this one! First with the double D’s and now this. Well whad’you know, Baron. We do think alike.

Redbaron

Bubble:
(From left to right again)
GiGi, GiGiGiGiGiGiGiGi?

Same thing we do every night Pinky, try to take over the world!

Caption:
I’ve got a feeling they’ll fail again… >__>

3) 会長加賀 Chairman Kaga

Bubble:
Bee:
I’ll take you to the candy shop. I’ll let you lick the lollipop. Go ‘head girl, don’t you stop. Keep going ’til you hit the spot…

Samehada:
Gigigigigigigig! Translation: Stop! Im a guy!

Caption: Language Barrier: Makes you wonder, who gets “screwed” in this relationship…

Bijugami

samada-i had the time of my liiiife and i owe it all to youuu….

bee-Girl…It’s easy to love me now ,Would you love me if I was down and out?Would you still have love for me?

caption-love…. can get past racial barriers…. black rapper+ spiky vagina sword forever….. ❤

You guys think you’re so clever with the 50 Cent references, knowing KB’s Pickles-assigned stage name…well you are! >_>

2) Iamnotreallyhere

Bubble:
Samehada: GiGiGiGiGiGiGi!! *♫He tastes like Octopus and he’s chakra loaded, big and thick and dumb as a stick, what would you dooo, for a Biju Bar♪*(sung to the toon of the Klondike bar song)

Kirabee: What’s that Sasuke fell down a well!!…..and the well commited suicide?

Caption: This manga panel brought to you by Google Translator =P

_____

The next entry was just so long, it won’t even fit in the bubbles.

But it still just had to win.

Congratulations to Prawlkage!

This week’s material…

Insert possible caption here.

OFFICIAL DEBATE

Ahaha! Lol! OMG…

I’m not even going to pretend like I can find the words to describe that.

This is exactly what I was after when proposed that seemingly lopsided debate. Didn’t think it would work, though. Lol…well…

I won’t bother complimenting all battlers from both sides on a wonderful job, because apart from the fact that everyone else already has, the commendation just goes without question.

However, there still must be a winner.

Conventionally, a debate is not always about who really is better and who isn’t. It is designed for the purpose of persuasion. In politics, the aim is to make the public see your side and take it. There isn’t much difference here. Normally, I would be the sole “public” to be the judge. But considering the magnitude of this debate, I decided it would only be fair to extend that privilege.

So, in consideration of all comments submitted (one, specifically, which I will refrain from naming for the blogger’s own safety. <_<) I declare the winner!

A hair’s breadth is too far too great a space to describe the margin by which this victory was claimed.

But…

Believe me, I know what it’s like to take on the whole blog. Being able to hold your own is difficult enough, let alone swaying others into even considering for a second that you may be right.

Team Orochimaru was able to do that. And for their support, all children they may have in the future will remain undefiled…at least for a while. >_>

There won’t be a debate this week. I think everyone’s earned a break. 😉

_____

And this week’s demotivational:

_____

*sits calmly crossed-legged on a single chair and sips on a cup of tea*

*notices deafening rumble as light from above bursts through the newly marked opening of the panic room*

Captain Pickles: *without taking attention from beverage* “I  knew you were coming…”

Kantonkage: “I knew you knew I was coming.”

Captain Pickles: “?!”

Kantonkage: “That’s why I decided to bring along a little surprise…”

*slowly lifts eyes higher*

*watches as hundreds of weapons ranging from farming tools to semi-automatics are rhythmically tapped against multiple palms, red hot with rage*

*the owners of each hand, with a certain pink-haired four-eyes in front, made no effort in hiding their chests and what was emblazoned on their uniform t-shirts: a single cucumber, circled once, and stroked over with red ink…and below, a very simple sentence…”Pein won, you bastard.“*

Kantonkage: “This is where you squeal.”

_____

See you guys next life.

;____;

But give me love over this.

Fix

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~ by Captain Pickles on August 29, 2010.

221 Responses to “Naruto 507 Breakdown: Lies! All lies!! (De)motivational poster and last week’s debate results inclusive; plus, what I would like to call “comment(s) of the week.” WHOOP! The Naruto breakdown is not last for once!”

  1. First!!!!!

  2. second!!!! Great Breakdown

  3. *gets popcorn while watching Pickle’s demise*

    😈

  4. WOOOOHOOOOOOOO!!!

    Oh yeh, and third!

  5. OMG LOL! This breakdown is HILARIOUS!!!

    @pickles – I’m glad Dad’s ok. Tell him that I’ll do him proud and look after the family while he’s away. You know, when you see him next. Right, Kanton?

    *kanton nods evilly and grunts in confirmation around a mouthful of white, creamy goodness*

    What? He saved me for a Klondike Bar! What’d you think I was talking about?

  6. Sixth!!!!

    DarkSenshi ftw!!!!!!! We did it!!! Even though I didn’t quite expect that outcome. O____O

    *Hi hives Darks and then eats everyone.* @____@

  7. Wait… I am forth. O_o

    Yondaime!!!

    I guess I was just counting the comments, rather than realising some commented twice. Kantonkage is gonna be extra cranky this week, so I should be sure to tease him. ^ ^

    It would have been even better if he shouted first only to see he was second, but this will suffice. 😄

  8. Seventh by the way thx pickles I made a fortune after supplying the mob.
    Also i found a permanent guinea pig that i can test my new weapons on *takes out giant crossbow and points it at Pickles* hey do me favor and run I need to test the accuracy and range as well as the damage.

    On second thought I decided to show you your death well if i used the right code I hope.
    1oFJ87G85-E

  9. Ya know i only joined the mob not because Oro won. I just joined because there was an anti-pickles convention and I needed some cash. Anyway i need a Guinea pig for my newly acquired crossbow wait I know. *turns new crossbow towards Tenrai* My next victim. >:)

  10. oh yeah FIRST!

  11. maybe not… Waaaaaaaaaaah!

  12. *Eats the crossbow* @__@

  13. Bubblition (left to right)

    Bubble 1 – “Keep pushing, Kanton! You’re almost there! Push! That’s it! I can see the hea-”
    *shocked pause*
    Bubble 2 – “…holy f*ck, it’s hideous! PUSH! PUSH IT BACK IN!!!”

    Caption – And from that day forward, contraceptive medicine would make up a third of Kantonkage’s daily food intake. Lesson learned.

  14. *press remote triggers and fires crossbow from inside tenrai then runs and kicks dark into a dango where anko and ferris(densetsu no Yuusha no Densetsu)are their favorite food ans dark falls on said table. Then watches as he gets crap beat out of him*

  15. 7th!

    Its too bad that breakdown was great Pickles, because now it’ll hurt even more when I send you on a one way trip to your maker >:)

    *pulls out flamethrower and points it at Pickles*
    *feels a warm yellow liquid on the floor coming from Pickles*

    You got my feet wet! Now I’ll have to go change. Don’t try to run, the act will re-start shortly

  16. Bubbliton: alright pickles i want to know where you were last night
    bubble OMG, My eyes they burn noooooooo get the brain bleach quick.
    Caption: last night happen to be the darksenshi, pickles and, orochimaru’s very “special celebration.”

  17. @kantonkage

    Ah… Extreme Machosism….

    Reminds me of another purple make-up wearing shinobi you have just recently dreamed about. Don’t worry Kanton, we still love you for who you are. We won’t judge you. O___O

  18. bubelition
    from right to left

    he isent infected h is just a blue person, i can touch him and nothing will happen to me

    i knew it blue people cant be trusted i mean how else could oro win the debate

    blue people-cant live with em cant live without em

  19. @tenrai yup this coming from one of the people who defended him so vehemently. Who defended him in the last debate? Not me you may have said that you voted for orochimaru so that Pain wouldn’t curb-stomp him but I know there was a hidden motive. It’s no problem no one will treat you any different most people already keep their distance anyways.

  20. ROFLMAO!

    Looks like the 7th gate has more uses than just combat 😄

  21. Aah so that’s why i had nightmares he appeared and I was trying to kill him but he wouldn’t die.

  22. @Kantonkage

    I don’t recall ever denying that I was wierd. 😛

    One must embrace their craziness. O____O

  23. @kisu – I think Kanton already knew about that one. 😄

    @kanton – no hard feelings dude we just playin.

  24. none taken I just like shooting people.

  25. Awesome breakdown once again. I Lol’ed when I saw the picture of Pinky and ‘The Brain’. xD

    And I completely see what your getting at with ´Madara´. I too was thinking that when I saw him this chapter. The first thing that went through my mind was “Why would he change his hairstyle?” Then I remembered he wouldn’t. There’s not a single Ninja in the Narutoverse that ever did change their hairstyle (is there?)… Except for Sakura and Ino, but they’re not real ninja’s. They’re filler incorporated into the manga.
    Anyways. I didn’t notice the bandages until you mentioned them and I agree Tobi wouldn’t need those with his ‘Zetsu sperm’ body. The only things that could destroy this theory is the fact that today’s Tobi revealed his face to Kisame and Kisame recognized him as Mizukage Madara and that the ‘Zetsu sperm body’ Tobi wore the same mask as the ‘Let’s party and massacre like Kantonkage’ Tobi that met Itachi. But seeing as we didn’t get even a partial glimpse of Mizukage Tobi’s face tells me there’s something ‘fishy’ going on! Something I’m sure we’ll find it sooner or later…

    *Jumps in front of the firing squad to protect pickles, but forgot having a ‘Zetsu sperm body’ as the bullets pass right through.*

    Sorry pickles, I’ll ask Kabutorochimaru to Edo Tensei you back. It’s the promise of a lifetime!!

    *Kishimoto appears and uses the dreaded lawsuit no jutsu.*

    NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  26. Bubble;
    (From left to right, again)
    I’ll look into his brain.

    Just as I thought, completely empty. He’s like a goldfish.

    Caption;
    Something tells me your reading your own brain. Switch your hands idiot!!

  27. @hairstyle changes Hinata, Jiraiya, Tsunade, Deidara, Neji, Kushina, Haku and, Lee all changed their hairstyles.

  28. Yes, in between different stages of their lives. I meant at the same stage in life. Tobi was first seen with short hair when attacking Konoha, than he had longer hair when he played Mizukage and when he massacred the Uchiha with Itachi and now he’s got short hair again.
    Perhaps Zetsu told Tobi the short hair turned him on. ^__^

  29. First thing I thought when I saw this was…
    Bubble:
    “Sweet, 3D glasses!”
    …!
    “It’s like I can touch you!!!”
    Caption: Naruto will be taking a brief intermission…in the third dimension!

    Classic breakdown, Pickles. I’m going back to my coma now. maybethen the voices will stop…0_O

  30. *logs onto WRA*
    *reads breakdown and silently weeps at debate winner*
    *listens to Feel Good Inc*
    *feels better*
    *logs off*

  31. @urbanvolcano87

    Don’t go!!!! T__T

    *Eats urbanvolcano87.* @__@

    BUBBLITON: (Or however you spell it, seeing as how no-one spells it the same)

    Bubble 1: Now, if you would please just clear your mind and remain calm for a few…

    Middle Frame: *Weird distortion.*

    Bubble 2: Whoa, I just had the weirdest high school flashback. So that’s where I put my locker keys! O__O

  32. Hmmm… we should have had another Gai vs Kakashi debate this week, now that we got another glimpse of Gai’s power. I wonder who people would vote for now… <_<

    *Realizes that his words may create a monster of epic proportions.* O_O

    *Runs away.*

  33. BUBBLE:
    Hold on let me check
    Yep, His parents have mind raped you too

    Caption: Parental Supervision : Kushina and Minato take it to a whole other level

  34. *notices current level of violence. slowly backs away before anyone sees me.

    *tosses Pickles to Tenrai for snack/peace offering.

  35. @ ajd,

    LOL. That is hilarious. ^__^

    Especially with the second frame. Awesome bubble.

  36. 32nd!!!! Maybe?

    WOOT! I won the bubblition!

    And DarkSenshi won the debate… now for THE REAL PRIZE!

    *summons Orochimaru… notices Orochimaru has summoned 2 ball-gags, and a large tub of shortening, a car battery, jumper cables, and wet sponges*

    You boys are in for a long night… watch out for Oro’s tongue-where-it-shouldn’t-be-no-jutsu

  37. BUBBLE 1: I still can’t believe this pickles.

    BUBBLE 2 I mean, how the hell did Maru win in the debate agaisnt pein!?

    CAPTION: Nice try, but don’t change the subject. Everyone can see the way you are touching kisame’s head and enjoying it. The question is unavoidable….

    WTH are you doing?!

  38. BUBBLITION:

    (1st Panel) We tilt his head back slightly to open his mouth… then we take this thing out…

    (2nd) *look of confusion/frustration*

    (3rd) Dammit… I can’t get mine past his lip, get someone bigger over here.

    CAPTION: Yep… ole’ sunglasses’ is hung like a horse… A SEAHORSE

  39. BUBBLE: This thing they found from Gai’s prostate exam .

    BUBBLE: I can’t believe how huge it is.

    CAPTION: . . . . I couldn’t help but notice you said “They” again…

  40. BUBBLE 1: Im gona slip my end to this thing good and then ima wiggle tiggle my undies to like barney used too…

    *stumbles upon better idea*

    BUBBLE 2: OMG I can make it scream baby SCREAM!!

    CAPTION?! : . . . . .

  41. BUBBLITION:

    #1: I sense a great deal of sadness in him… as though he has just lost something….

    #2: *look of sudden revelation*

    #3: My God! I think this means he lost his battle to Gai!

    CAPTION: The shark-whisperer did not fetch the ratings of The Dog Whisperer, and was cancelled after this panel.

  42. *Enters the room*
    *Looks around*
    *Eats Pickles and whatever he is on*
    *Sees scared faces from the audience*
    O__O Ermm.. I just…. Oh look! *Points*
    *Pulls out bazooka and fires in Mitrix slowmotion*
    *Steps*
    *Eats everyone* I don’t like raw meat..BBQ @__@
    *Walks out of the room and hears it explodes but not looking back* *Trips* X__X

  43. BUBBILITIONNNNNN:

    bubble1: Owwwwww… OHHHHH OMG *moans* ohh…

    bubble2: ah……… brainfreeze, sorry. Let me try this again.

    Caption: Get your mind out of the gutter people!

  44. Bubbiltion
    Bubble: Hmm I shall now use Instant transmission
    Bubble: hey it actually works why am I grabbing this guy
    Caption: Kishi plagiarizes Dbz again

  45. I see no-one took me up on my Kakashi vs Gai debate. And here I was hoping for another epic battle.

    Oh well, I guess I will go back to moping and eating people. T__T

  46. @Tenrai Senshi: Okay then. I’ll take Kakashi, you be Gai. We can settle this over a game of rock, paper, scissors.

    1.. 2.. 3… ROCK!

  47. Bubble1: My mind to your mind, my thoughts to your thoughts..
    Bubble 3: Crap a Cease and Desist no Jutsu!
    Caption: Lawyers, the worst of all Kinjutsu

    Kakashi over Gai anyday, Gai beats Kakashi in sheer power, but all it takes is one Genjutsu and he could fool Gai into opening gates and beating the crap out of himself. Lets face it, Gai isn’t the wisest person in Konoha.

  48. Everyone knows that Kakashi is the most epic great person/sensei/shinobi/hunk….. in his time O_o

    He owns Gai in papar, rock, paper and scissors, we all knew that. @_@
    Gai is indeed good, his power is on a very high level but Kakashi is great, not good, but awesome great. @_@ Plus he has the shirigan, though Gai has learn how to avoid avoid a shirigan-user…..

    Back to Kakashi being awesome O__O (Cause he is) In fact… he has it in the blood, The White Fang Jr. O_O And he had Minato as sensei.

    Gai is a hardworker, yes, but Kakashi still owns. >_> We or I haven’t downgrade him just because of Gai’s afternoon tiger. In fact.. I think there’s more awesome Kakashi moves we haven’t seen yet.

    *Pulls out bazooka and points at everyones who dissagree that Kakashi rules* ~_~

  49. *Pulls out bazooka and points at everyones who dissagree that Kakashi rules*

    Unless you want a face full of Zetsu wing wong, you’d better put it away. ^__^

    Guy knows how to fight a sharingan user so Kakashi won’t be able to hax (genjutsu) his way to victory. Taijutsu is Guy’s territory too so Kakashi can only keep his distance and use ninjutsu and kuchiyose no jutsu. Kamui might do the trick but if he misses he’s done for and Guy can use the Eight Gates to increase speed, strength and senses to avoid Kamui.
    Chidori is a speed attack, if the opponent is faster than the user a counterattack will be enough to cancel it out or the opponent can simply dodge it. To me, Guy seems perfectly capable of dodging Chidori. I say Guy wins using Eight Gates.

  50. @ EVERYONE!

    Why must Gai and Kakashi fight? Why can’t they just have a quick sparring match, call it even (even when it is about as unbalanced as Stephen Hawking fighting Mike Tyson [circa 1990] HA! I know I didn’t say who I favored…)

    Afterwords they go and get drunk over at Jiraiya’s bar and grill.
    That’s right, Jiraiya’s not dead, he gave up the ninja way and opened an awesome bar.

  51. …is waiting for either Supertrek, Uto, Kisu, or Tenrai to pop on and pwn the Kakashi supporters.

    And where on earth is Ahsan?

  52. Gai is not great he is a total badass he pwned an akatsuki member with one move twice albeit the guy was weakened but still in was one move.
    Another thing who save Kakashi from being killed by Kisame it was Gai.
    Another thing Itachi regarded Gai as a threat but Kakashi not so much.
    Kakashi not so much he is always relying on his Sharingan and it costs him dearly nearly everytime either hospitalizing him for about a week or longer to outright killing him.
    Also Gai wins 50 to Kakashi 49!!
    *takes out two BFGS and points it at the Kakashi supporters* PROVE ME WRONG!!!!

  53. Bubblition: Yeah…get that mirror real close…FU*K not that close…Yeah, that’s…DAMMIT! GOTTA FIX MAH HAIR >.<

    Caption: When the Manga Characters are more dramatic than the voice actors in the Anime

  54. yeah its true Gai defeated Kisame but in a shinobi face-off one thing is important and that is information. What Gai has when he defeated Kisame was the element of surprise. Its just like the Naruto vs Pein arc, its easy to defeat Pein if u know his secret but what if you dont?

    Thats the same with Gai, Kisame never thought that the noon tiger was a kind of taijustu rather than a ninjutsu and was not aware that taijutsu is the specialy of his opponent.

    So in the Kakashi vs Gai debate i think Kakashi knows the things he need to be careful of against Gai and Gai would lose his surprise capabilities thus putting Kakashi at a advantage.

    Since Kisame no longer has a tongue i think he is already useless to Akatsuki.. Hehehe will he die? its ok for me… I hope Naruto and Bee continues their training…

  55. Not quite because it’s not like you can dodge it. Plus it goes vice-versa as well as since Kakashi’s sharingan wouldn’t help much since Guy will never make eye contact.

  56. from right to left
    Bubblition

    bubble 1: let’s see what this homosexual asshole is thinking
    bubble 2: that was awkward…

    caption: when you read their minds, everything becomes awkward

  57. Bubble1: Wait a sec…
    Bubble2: I think I just…
    Caption: Yeah, I just had an idea.

  58. One thing I would like to know, is that if the mizukage that Madara was controlling was also the host of the Sanbi, then how did the Sanbi eventually end up in the wild without a host? Surely once Madara had spent his use of the Mizukage, he would have just extracted the Sanbi afterwards and been done with it.

    Unless he was discovered and forced to leave before he could do that. Perhaps the Mizukage lost controll after that because of her state of mind and the Sanbi broke free.

    @Debate.

    That’s the spirit. Now, I just need to decide which side I am going to join…

  59. i think it the Sanbi was in the wild at the beginning and someone made Yagura the host maybe by controlling the host you can also control the Sanbi. I dont know. Hehehe Yagura cannot be the mizukage without a bijuu. He’s not that strong…

    Im not sure about this… hahaha

  60. @Debate – Well, guys and gals, OBVIOUSLY this battle would never happen 😉 Kakashi has shown time and time again he doesn’t want to fight Gai. Just like Pein’s godliness prevents him from using Chibaku Tensei against mere mortals, Kakashi’s absolute indifference to his rivalry with Gai would prevent this match from starting. I guess you could call it Kakashi forfeits since he’d refuse to fight and then Gai would win.
    Debate win!

  61. Im starting to Wish that if the Moons Eye Plan Works and everyone becomes One with Madara. He teaches the Entire world All the Worlds Jutsu so that only the Strongest capable can wield w/e Jutsu which is best suited.
    Which begins the World Ninja War and then Timeskip…I Wish 😀

  62. Spoilers are out.

    http://mangahelpers.com/forum/showthread.php?t=63705

    @urbanvolcano87

    A lot of the battles we have in these debates wouldn’t happen, so that point is void in these circumstances. And besides, chances are that Kakahsi would just convince Gai to settle for a rock, paper, scissors match, in which case Kakashi would probably win knowing Gai’s bad luck with that.

  63. hey, no spoilers yet?
    @kanton: u fire random projectiles at your new guinea pig? :O
    plz tell me u didnt name it “orochimaru” >_>

  64. Indeed, Kakashi wouldn’t fight Gai, but if he did/had to, he will definitely win. I know that we all know that.

    *Points bazooka at Tenrai* Join the Kakashi side, as long as you don’t want to wear tight tights of course. >_> But that’s your choice. ^__^ *has bazooka within a reach*

  65. Bubblition:-
    the guy keeping his hand on kisame’s head:”i will check out what intel can we get.”

    the guy:hehehehe (silently)hohooo! (so any one can hardly hear)

    Yamato Sensie from behind: what is it, what are u seeing?

    the guy in his mind : “THESE HIDDEN RAIN NINJA WOMEN ARE CRAZY HARDCORE”

    CAPTION: SORRY FOR KISAME,THERE IS NO PRIVACY IN THIS FUCKED UP NINJA WORLD!!!

  66. @salamiyo Nope i decided I don’t need a guinea pig.
    @debate hmm true Kakashi doesn’t necessarily want to fight Gai but somehow Gai has managed to get him to compete 99 times.
    *snaps fingers and mountain of cookies follow by a giant bank appears* We *cough*well me*cough* at the Gai side have youthful cookie mountains and money. So join Tenrai!!!
    P.S said mountain and bank are protected by a very powerful force field that only I can deactivate.

  67. “Perhaps the Mizukage lost control after that because of her state of mind and the Sanbi broke free.”

    You mean HIS state of mind. 🙂

  68. Nah. Tobi is a woman. Didn’t you know? ^_~

  69. @Dark: yep, Tobi is Sakura!

  70. Spoiler alert
    Konan’s back
    Madara wants to add Nagato to his Necrophilia eye stealing fetish.

  71. Spoiler alert
    Konan’s back
    Madara wants to add Nagato to his Necrophilia and eye stealing fetish.

  72. Spoiler alert

    How about we all debate who will win, Konan or Madara.

    Please don’t forget to put a spoiler warning at the top of your post when discussing spoiler information of any kind. Some people don’t want to know what is happening until the manga comes out.

    -Tenrai-

  73. i noticed something on this page: https://weareawesomeness.files.wordpress.com/2010/08/wet.png?w=497&h=545

    it shouldn’t be “splash” it’s more like “skit skit skit”.. lol

  74. @Kushin

    *Eats the Bazooka* <_<

    @Redbaron

    The Sanbi Jinchuuriki was a guy? They all look the same, I get so confused… X__x

  75. when is naruto coming out this week?

  76. BUBBLITION! :

    NARUTO:
    if you can’t see only me. i would force you into a corner where you won’t have any choice but to rely only to me… i would force you to love me…and only look at me”

    CAPTION: “in order to have you… i would bind you by any means.. *naruto is the seme this time..

  77. Naruto 508 is out! on mangastream
    http://mangastream.com/read/naruto/72932747/1
    U.u

  78. Ahhhhh!!! Konan!! Does anyone else hope Konan doesn’t die? I hope she manages to escape or someone rescues her… for some reason I doubt she’ll be able to destroy Madara. She deserves some sort of happiness in her life (besides the joy of being a war orphan, being the hostage the causes the death of your best friend, and then watching as your other best friend wastes his life and considerable talent away trying to find his own perverted version of peace and happiness and then dying).

    Don’t you die on me four leaf! I mean Konan!! Dammit!

  79. Awesome chapter!
    Kisame gets some awesomeness points in my book O.o
    although he suicided,.. but alot of members of akatsuki seem to do that >.>
    Konan vs Madara ,… you got to be kidding me.
    thats like tiny vs. hanzo
    well w.e lets see what konan has in mind although i cant think beyond paper flowers

  80. The new chapter was good, but not as epic as the last few have been. It felt like more of a bridging chapter to set things up for what is to come, so I guess we can expect some more epicness soon.

    As for Konan vs Tobi, well Konan seems to be ready for this battle, which may also mean she is more powerful than she lets on, especially if she believes she can “destroy” him.

    However, I suspect Tobi will win this duel, which is sad because I don’t want Konan to die. I was hoping that she would lead Ame to a better future with an alliance with Konoha. I wonder what Tobi will do with the Rinnegan though. Perhaps he will use the Rinnegan in his left eye? Having both the Rinnegan which the manga still refers to as the most powerful eye technique, and the Sharingan, would be quite something indeed. If Tobi really is Madara and the Rinnegan grants him power over life and death, it may even be his ticket to making himself whole again? O_o

    What I really want to see is Naruto in a battle now with his new power. T__T

  81. @wildseme

    Um… Naruto isn’t anywhere in the bubble. Unless he is cosplaying as Kisame. ROFL!!!

    Perhaps this was meant to be in the caption contest on the anime breakdown? X__X

  82. Great chapter!

    … but was Kisame’s death befitting of a legendary swordsman, missing-nin and Akatsuki member? What does his #1 fan Kisu think? 😀

    Konan is going to lose (hopefully not die), but she’ll NEVER tell Madara the location of Nagato’s Rinnegan. In Gaara’s words, she’s “hardcore”. 😄
    Tobi might use a jutsu to enter her mind and get information, though. O_O

  83. I swear, this manga is awesomely awesome and ridiculous at the same time. Great chapter indeed. But is it just me, or is the fact that the two strongest jinchuriki get trapped in a damn water balloon and can’t get out in 1/10th of a second using their bijuu power a bit silly? Either of them should be able to turn on the juice like a coke addict and snatch up that shark like it owes ’em rent. It’s hilarious cuz we can spend all week on this blog reasoning and rationalizing who can beat who, but then stuff like this happens. Doesn’t it all mean that the rationale we use to debate doesnt always umm….hold water? Oh well

    NEway, about Konan vs. Madara its kinda hard to believe they’d go killing off two characters in a row so quickly. I’m thinking konan was really good at using clones. And this is one of em. It makes sense if you consider the fact that she’s fighting him in rain, which puts her at a disadvantage (unless she got waterproof paper jutsu) to the point where her claim to destroy MysteriObi is just a front.

  84. Caption

    1. Its a dream within a dream#

    2. We Need to go deeper

  85. @tenrai..

    ooh, yeah!..*smacks her forehead.. i got confused, i was thinking about my bubblition entry in the naruto anime and then i switched in here right away..

    i’ll post it again..*starts running before tenrai could find her edible to eat..=D

  86. Kisame actually had two haxs instead of just one

  87. SPOILER ALERT

    Anyone else notice how Madara is calling Konan Nagato? I don’t think Nagato and Konan have show all their cards yet.

  88. SPOILER ALERT

    …and where in the shadows is Kabuto is hiding?

  89. @arpotu – it may have been an error in translation. Along the left hand side, the writing clearly says “what will Konan do?”

    For me, personally, I’m just glad she’s back. She’s a rarity, she is – a female ninja who can actually fight. And she’s sexy as hell. Anyone see her concept art? Dayum!

    @kahmix – she’s shown the ability to fight in the rain before. She put up a damn good fight against Jiraiya till he clogged her up with toad oil.

  90. AWESOME CHAPTER! I knew kisame was badass. And I knew he wasn’t afraid of Itachi 😀

    Konan’s back! Awesome! but she really should have cremated Nagato’s body with that blasted Rinnegan. Can’t wait to see what she has in store for Madara

  91. Ko-nan’s back and yer gonna be in trou-ble (Hey Naaaa Hey Naaaa Ko-nan’s back). (sung to “My Boyfriend’s Back)

    Sorry, had to do it.

  92. Kisame’s death was savage. I like it. That’s how a powerful, savage swordsman should go out. If he got a death like Zabuza I’d be banging my head against the wall 😦

  93. Bubblition #1: So… let’s see what you have in your mind.

    Bubblition #2: O…M…G…. You’re even worse than supertrek89.

    Caption: When you think things can’t get worse… it gets pervy.

  94. kisame just went up on my badass meter, because he’s literally like the first person in the anime to act “like a ninja should”. ON like episode 19 way back with Zabuza and Sakura thought Sasuke was dead, didnt she give this whole speech on how ninja are supposed to b devoid of emotions, and its a tough path to choose. Since then, naruto has been one heap of emotions after the other… well him and sarutobi of course

  95. Agreed, Kisame is on a wholenother level of coolness. R.I.P oh great swordsmam. Before the fight i kinda want to know whats going on with Sasuke and kabuto. Overall the chapter was great. Too bad Kisame wont be in it anymore. Salutes Kisame!

  96. truely an awesome death for kisame! konan’s back now…maybe we’ll finally be able to see just how powerful she is. i’m hoping she doesn’t get pwned too much…and it would piss me off if madara uses his sharingan to get her to tell him where she hid nagato.

  97. I don’t understand. Why is everyone saying Tobi/Madara is fighting Konan? This is obviously Tobi/Madara vs. Nagato.

    http://a.imageshack.us/img809/5424/nagato.jpg

    It’s apparent Nagato transferred his soul into Konan as he died then possessed her body. Another magnificent ability of the Rinnengan. Oh, and Killer Bee was the second most badass thing to happen this chapter.

    http://a.imageshack.us/img299/7589/punchashark.png

    Lol, gotta love Killer Bee.

  98. Ok, here’s a crazy prediction:

    Naruto is going to somehow teleport to Konan’s side before she dies. He’ll do this by being signaled by the bouquet she gave him (or related, maybe SO6P senses will tingle). It will be a complete surprise to him that he can do it, but he then discovers he can track/teleport to anything as long as he has touched it (to pick up its vibe).

    Crazy enough? No? Ok, Madara is Konan!! *that* crazy enough? No?! Ok, Madara and Konan were *square dance* partners, not Akatsuki partners!!

  99. @Supertrek: I totally passed up that remark thinking he was being redundant. Is the translation really correct? Is Madara calling Konan’s body Nagato? If so, my head esplode.

  100. @Gavin: It’s a translation error…it has to be…

  101. Guess we’ll find out for sure next week, if Konan starts whipping out the SPOP on Madara o.O

  102. Anyone remember how Akatsukis address Jinchruiki?
    Pain: “Where is the Kyubi, (where is) Naruto?”
    Its a similar case this chapter.
    “Where did you hide the Rinnegan…(where did you hide) Nagato

  103. the spoiler
    Madara: “Rinnegan… It looks like you aren’t going to obediently tell me where you hid Nagato.”

  104. Ah, I gotcha, though I prefer the idea of Nagato transferring his soul into Konan and laughing at how he tricked Naruto so he could escape in a new body and be awesome like he used to be. Oh, that would be funny.

    Ignoring how stupid it’d be.

    @Kanton: Lol, yes. That’d do it. The speech pattern is grand.

  105. “yep, Tobi is Sakura!”

    My guess was Tenten. There’s no way one person could be as useless as she is… Unless she’s hiding something. And when did we see Tenten facing Tobi? Never, exactly. Plus, she’s got dark hair. Proof enough I’d say.

    “If Tobi really is Madara and the Rinnegan grants him power over life and death, it may even be his ticket to making himself whole again?”

    I don’t think so. If it did he would have tried to kill Nagato a long time ago.

    “I knew kisame was badass. And I knew he wasn’t afraid of Itachi.”

    Being afraid can be a good thing too. Against Itachi it would be better to be afraid and run than act tough and fight… And Die.

    “If he got a death like Zabuza I’d be banging my head against the wall”

    Why, before Zabuza died he took out several baddies and killed the real villain of the arc all while being severely damaged.
    Off course I know much better ways to go out with a bang. My pick would be during a foursome with three hot women but IMO it did make Zabuza more impressive than he actually was.

  106. @redbaron, yes, Zabuza’s death was extremely badass. But its what he did BEFORE his suicidal-homicidal rampage. He became the first victim of Naruto’s Make-a-friend no Jutsu, not very awesome. Him crying because Haku died was cool! His manly tears make up for him falling for Naruto’s jutsu >:)

    Also, are you trying to start a Kisame vs Itachi debate?

  107. “Also, are you trying to start a Kisame vs Itachi debate?”

    Hehehe, maybe. Why, you think Kisame would beat Itachi?! Tsukuyomi, Amaterasu, Susano’o… Pick your poison.

  108. itachi pulls out susano with yata mirror and crazy sword and wins… against … anyone

  109. *tries to resist urge to debate*

  110. Sharkboy wins. They make movies about sharks. Jaws, for example. Have you ever seen any Susano’o movies? I didn’t think so. If it was so impressive, Hollywood would have taken notice. They have not, so Itachi loses.

  111. @ Dark,

    Well, they have made several movies of one man that kills you in your dream (Tsukuyomi – Nightmare on Elmstreet).

    @ Kisu,

    Good, I can feel your anger. I am defenseless. Take your weapon. Strike me down with all of your hatred and your journey towards the dark side will be complete!

  112. @Dark not quite because Hollywood butchers everything imported.

  113. @red – Indeed they did, young padawan. I hereby change my vote to Freddy Uchiha.

  114. Freddy Uchiha in A nightmare on Konohastreet. If Sasuke doesn’t wake up screaming, he won’t wake up at all!

  115. @redbaron but that’s not a nightmare.

  116. Waaaah it’s been a really long time since I have been here T.T
    How is everyone doing?? Tenrai, Lulu, Kaichou??the rest? xD
    As for the manga..do you guys think we will have Kisame’s flashback here? Cause I think it’s going there..well dunno >.>

  117. Lol just read the manga…he killed himself.. :O

  118. @redbaron, I have two real arms so the Darkside has no effect on me O_O

    There’ve been way more shark movies though….oh crap, I got sucked in

  119. Lousy jinchurikis! At this rate Tobi/Madara/Hanzō would own them. 😦

  120. @Kisu

    Lol. I find it funny how you play down Naruto’s ability to ‘make friends’ with those around him and then go onto say how it was the only thing that stained Zabusa’s death, and then you go on to say that Kisame was a real shinobi.

    But tell me, did Kisame not kill himself for the sake of his comrades? Did he not die for the sake of the bonds he had formed with the one person he felt loyal to? It seems Madara has his own version of the ‘make a friend no jutsu’ and Kisame was enthralled by it just the same as Zabuza was by Naruto.

    @redbaron.

    I actually have a very easy answer for you challenge and in this regard, I will side with Kisu in support of Kisame.

    The answer to the challenge of Tsukyomi, amatarasu and Susanoo is simple. The Samehada. Let’s face it, it is Kisame’s partner in crime and in battle. We have already seen that genjutsu, even Tsukyomi, is useless against a Jinchuurili with control of his bijuu partner. Well, the Samehada fills the same role, and will be able to easily break Kisame out of any Genjutsu Itachi uses before it can even take effect.

    As for Amatarasu, the Samehada can absorb the chakra right out of it. Kisame’s defense would be even more complete if he assumes his final form, which practically renders all ninjutsu against him useless.

    Susanoo will meet a similar fate as well. All Kisame has to do is absorb the chakra out of it like he takes away the chakra cloak of a Jinchuuriki. If he can absorb seven tails an once with a single swipe against Bee, I hardly think Susanoo will be a problem either. Itachi trying to maintain it would essentially be dooming himself, because of the high strain it incurs already.

    Let’s face it. What is Itachi going to do if Kisame creates a giant sphere of water and assumes his final form, like he did with Bee? Itachi will be out maneuvered, overpowered and even his most powerful three jutsu will be useless, while Kisame simply uses Itachi’s chakra to keep himself sustained and healed. Even if he does somehow get damaged, he can just heal it anyway.

  121. @Tenrai – indeed you are right, Heavenly Warrior. I hereby change my vote back to Jaws.

  122. @babyfox9

    Welcome back. I hope we’ll see you on more often. ^ ^

  123. @tenrai – actually, no. I change back. As much as I like Kisame, I see one glaring hole in your arguments that is practically begging me to enter the fray and make it’s boo boo all better. ^_^

    Assuming the Samehada (that chakra whore whose vocabulary consists of two letters) can identify and disrupt genjutsu in it’s wielder like a bijuu (monstrous chakra beings capable of conscious thought and intelligent conversation) is a bit of a stretch. I don’t think it can, and the problem with your argument is that it is based on an assumption that can’t be proven with the manga (though I’m fairly sure you’re aware of this already and are just debating for the hell of it lol). Itachi is a skilled genjutsu user who would exploit this weakness without the need to resort to the Mangekyou Sharingan.

  124. @tenrai
    are you sure that the sword can help him break out of genjutsu? i’m not saying it’s not true, but we don’t have any proof that it is.

    you said that all kisame has to do is suck the chakra. what if itachi just kills him in one shot? i mean, if susanoo cuts him in half he’s dead. no amount of healing could save him.

    if kisame really can’t be put under genjutsu, then he is the winner. i can’t see itachi beating kisame when he transforms and creates the sphere of water.

  125. @truepain

    The rules for genjutsu are simple. When stuck in a genjutsu, someone can force their chakra into you to break it. With Bee, it was a simple case him using his Bijuu to fill that role. With Kisame, we already know that he and the Samehada share a chakra link and that the samehada can give him chakra in the same manner a bijuu can give its host chakra.

    So, if the principle is the same, why would the effect be any different for Kisame, than it is for Bee?

    As for your question, what if Itachi kills Kisame in one shot, I told everyone how much I loath these instant victory debates, where people seem to think it is that easy to just instantly kill your opponent before they can do anything. We all know it isn’t that simple. Here is a question, what if Kisame kills Itachi in one shot?

    Don’t forget, Kisame has already regenerated mortal injuries before, so I don’t see what attack Itachi could use that would kill him that quickly that he couldn’t absorb or avoid. Also, Susanno needs to be formed first. In the time it takes Itachi to form it and attack, Kisame could have already formed his giant sphere of water, or just absorbed Itachi’s chakra.

  126. @tenrai – you kinda just skipped over my argument there, -_-

    Again, I contest that Samehada is not intelligent enough to recognize the subtle signs of a victim caught in a genjutsu, especially if the genjutsu is so subtle that the victim himself does not recognize he is in one until it is too late (ie. Itachi making Kisame think that Itachi is somewhere he is not).

  127. @tenrai

    samehada can give him chakra IF it steals it from somebody. if he gets put in a genjutsu them he can’t steal chakra from anybody. so where is this chakra coming from? it could come from kisame himself but can one person’s own chakra break them out of a genjutsu?

    this is different tenrai. i’m not talking about amaterasu or some other jutsu…i know that kisame can heal from them.
    if itachi’s susanoo has a normal sword and you are hit, then it’s going to cut through you. just look at the size of it and the power behind the thrust. it cut through orochimaru’s Yamata no Jutsu like a hot knife through butter. as we saw in the sasuke-danzo battle, susanoo is pretty damn fast…i don’t see kisame dodging or blocking the thrusts.
    and if the sword is the Totsuka Sword, then it really is a one hit kill.

  128. @truepein – I think Samehada has it’s own chakra bank. It would explain the massive chakra boost Kisame gets when he fuses with his sword. And I think the origin of the disrupting chakra is irrelevant when someone is trying to break a genjutsu. The important factor is the third party forcing the chakra into the victim.

    But this requires conscious thought and an ability to make decisions. Samehada has neither, which is why I don’t think it will break a genjutsu Kisame gets caught in.

  129. @Tenrai, no I don’t care if someone likes their comrades or w/e. Its the fact that Zabuza let a 12 year old greenhorn’s words change his entire life on the drop of a dime. I can see how Naruto’s words could affect Nagato since they have a common goal, but Zabuza was a certified killer, its just not likely you can change someone’s view of life so easily. So yes Tenrai, Kisame had a real ninja death.

    @Debate, it doesn’t matter if Samehada knows Kisame is trapped in a genjutsu or not (which it will most likely know), its always disrupting Kisame’s chakra. Either by eating it or giving him some. Either way, Genjutsu’s gone.

  130. @kisu – it’s always disrupting Kisame’s chakra? I don’t think you really understand what you just said there. If it’s always disrupting his chakra, then Kisame is continually unable to mold chakra and perform any jutsu whatsoever. What you need to realize is that a steady stream of chakra is not a disruption if the beneficial party adjusts automatically, otherwise by your logic pre-shippuuden Naruto should be genjutsu-proof too. I mean, the Kyuubi’s chakra is constantly mixing with Naruto’s, feeding into him. If that is now classified as a disruption, how come Naruto is so weak against it?

    Intelligence plays a huge part in this equation. The difference between Samehada and a Bijuu in terms of disruption ability is that a Bijuu consciously makes the decision to disrupt the flow of it’s host’s chakra to remove a genjutsu. I’m not satisfied that Samehada can make that sort of decision, and have enough control of it’s own stored chakra to force it to disrupt it’s owner’s genjutsu. I dunno how you’ll prove that point, and unless you can, you may be best off letting it go.

  131. @truepain

    Darks is right. Samehada has it’s own chakra, as even commented on by Kisame who said that Samehada has identical chakra to himself.

    And, as I said before, once again, if Itachi activates Susanoo, Kisame can just suck it away like he sucks away the chakra cloak of a Bijuu, or he can create a massive water sphere and trap Itachi before that can even happen. Once Itachi is in the water, he is literally shark bait. Kisame doesn’t even have to kill him directly to win the battle, he can just wait until Itachi drowns from a lack of air if he really wants to. If Itachi tries to swim away, Kisame will just follow him and keep him in the center of the sphere. If he tries to use any jutsu, Kisame will just absorb it with while in his fusion form.

    If Itachi activates Susanoo, Kisame can either swim past and absorb the chakra away, or, if he really wants to be safe, he can just use the shark technique he was going to use on Gai, which absorbs the chakra of an opponent’s jutsu to make itself stronger.

    This means that Itachi’s ultimate defense would do nothing more than Make Kisame’s attack stronger and much more deadly when it hits. The best part is that it is a long ranged jutsu that Kisame can use from a safe distance, far from the reach of Itachi’s Totsuka sword.

    @Kisu

    I never said he didn’t. I was just saying dying for your comrades IS a real shinobi’s death and an honorable one. It doesn’t matter how you formed those bonds, that loyalty is what is important to a shinobi.

  132. @Darks

    The Samehada makes the conscious choice to heal Kisame when he is injured, so it is clear that it can sense when there is something wrong. Either that, or it is Kisame’s own control over Samehada that allows him to instigate that reaction himself. Either way, both instances would mean he can just as well free himself from a genjutsu.

    If the Samehada has enough chakra control to heal Kisame (and we all know how much chakra control healing actually takes) then why not to just shove chakra into him to free him from a genjutsu?

  133. One last point, let’s just say that by some chance, the Samehada can’t break Kisame free from a Genjutsu, just for the sake of this debate. Well, even if that is the case, Kisame can still beat Itachi quite effectively. Remember, that when he is in his final form, fused with the Samehada, he can sense his opponent’s chakra and track their movements that way, without even having to rely on his eyesight.

    He showed this ability in the battle against Bee, after Bee darkened his water sphere with ink to cut off his vision. Kisame could literally fight the entire battle with his eyes closed, thus protecting himself from genjutsu, while still effectively knowing exactly where Itachi is.

  134. @Tenrai don’t forget he has a Shark sense of smell

  135. “but that’s not a nightmare.”

    I know, it’s our wet dream. ^__^

    Tenrai aren’t you forgetting one VERY important thing?
    It’s about Tsukuyomi. Even if Samehada can cancel it, it doesn’t matter.
    http://www.narutobase.net/manga/Naruto/257/7
    Tsukuyomi = Itachi wins.

    And about Susano’o and the Totsuka Sword;
    Zetsu says it can seal anyone AND anything. What if it can seal Samehada too? Furthermore, it sliced through Yamata no jutsu with ease. As far as I know Samehada isn’t invincible;
    http://www.narutobase.net/manga/Naruto/471/12
    so there’s a good chance the Totsuka Sword could slice through Samehada as well. There seems to be a limit of how much chakra Samehada can absorb at what speeds.
    But assuming the Totsuka Sword couldn’t pierce, seal or slice Samehada, if Kisame get’s hit by the sword it’s over.

    As for Kisame creating a water sphere. That would give Itachi an advantage as well. The Yata Mirror is an elemental mirror. It can change into any kind of element. So if Kisame creates a sphere of water, the mirror will turn into lightning and Kisame will be electrocuted.

  136. @Tenrai – a gaping hole in your chest is slightly more obvious than genjutsu lol.

    I think maybe I haven’t been clear enough in my examples. When I say genjutsu, I don’t mean something so obvious as Tsukuyomi. I mean a standard genjutsu in which the victim perceives reality as only slightly different than what it actually is, Itachi’s favorite type. A good example of this is where Deidara fought Itachi the first time they met. Deidara thought he’d wrapped Itachi in an explosive centipede and was about to detonate it when Itachi released the genjutsu, revealing that Deidara had actually wrapped himself in explosives and was about to blow himself up.

    The thing about this type of subtle genjutsu is that the victim does not know there is anything wrong until it is too late. If Kisame didn’t know anything was wrong, Samehada sure as hell wouldn’t.

    And you have to remember, genjutsu does not only affect sight. It affects all five of the senses. Sight, smell, taste, touch, and hearing. In effect, it literally alters the victims perception of reality. If caught in a genjutsu, Kisame becomes Itachi’s plaything, maneuvering himself into position for Itachi to deliver the final blow.

  137. Assuming Kisame doesn’t drain all of his chakra first

  138. @kanton – he can use genjutsu on people from a distance.

  139. Havent read all the comments yet, but I’ll do when I have time.

    @Darks, when I say disturb I mean in the sense that it gives him chakra. Genjutsu can be stopped 2 ways (seems everyone forgot), not just 1.

  140. @kisu – yes it can be stopped in two ways. Kisame can dispel it himself, unless the person using the genjutsu is too strong, in which case a third party can dispel the genjutsu by disrupting the flow of chakra in the victim. My point is, a stream of chakra coming from Samehada is not a disruption. It’s just a continual stream of chakra that Kisame has grown accustomed to, like a bijuu’s chakra constantly feeding into the hosts own chakra bank. This alone does not make the host immune to genjutsu (we know this cos of Naruto). The Bijuu has to make the decision to force chakra into the host to disrupt the flow of chakra. More than what the host is accustomed to, or no disruption will occur. Samehada lacks the intelligence to recognize a genjutsu, so it will not bail him out.

    Either way, it’s a moot point. You can’t compare Samehada to a Bijuu, they’re two entirely different entities. And it can’t be proven that Samehada can disrupt genjutsu, thus that argument was null and void to begin with.

  141. @dark true but also another Itachi’s tech only worked because Deidara is a long range-exclusive type fighter.

  142. @Dark, I disagree. Samehada has shown the ability to think. Kisame died, it felt sad. It saw Bee, it happily ran to Bee. It got held by Guy, it attacked him and ran back to Kisame. Just because it can’t talk doesn’t mean its retarded, I mean, just look at Stephen Hawking. You saying Samehada can’t give Kisame chakra to dispel a genjutsu is like saying Neji couldn’t give Lee chakra to dispel a genjutsu just because he isn’t a Biju. Wtf?

    To add: In chapter 388 Sasuke uses the Cursed Seals extra chakra to power out of Tsukuyomi. If Sasuke could do it back then, Kisame easily can.

    The Sword of Totsuka is made entirely of chakra and has no physical form, so it cant hurt Samehada and would be absorbed before it even hit. Also, Samehada can absorb Six Tails in at once, so I doubt it would have a problem draining Itachi, plus he barely has any stamina at all to begin with.

    http://www.citymanga.com/naruto/chapter-392/16/

    “The Yata Mirror is an elemental mirror. It can change into any kind of element. So if Kisame creates a sphere of water, the mirror will turn into lightning and Kisame will be electrocuted.”

    Huh? Where’d you see that? It matters not either way, it is made of chakra and can be absorbed.

    http://www.citymanga.com/naruto/chapter-393/09/

    “If Kisame didn’t know anything was wrong, Samehada sure as hell wouldn’t.”

    Genjutsu disrupts chakra? You’re saying Samehada wouldn’t detect a change in the chakra it feeds off of?

  143. First of all, you have to remember, Kisame’s sword can only give kisame chakra after first stealing it from someone else. It feeds off of kisame’s chakra in the first place. If kisame gets trapped in One of Itachi’s Genjitsu’s, the samada would first have to steal someones chakra and then be smart enough to feed it to kisame and dirupt his chakra flow.

    In other words, one Genjutsu, and the fight is as good as over.

  144. @kisu – LMAO at Steven Hawking

    Seriously though, your post really doesn’t answer any questions. All the scenarios you’ve posted in regards to Samehada can be put down as instincts and nothing more. It runs to the larger chakra source, regardless of who it is. It does not choose to do it, it just does. Survival instincts, you return to where you are safest, like a wolf puppy runs to it’s mother. If a less-potent chakra source tries to pick it up, an automatic self-defense mechanism kicks in (spikes from the handle) and then returns to the higher power source. You don’t need to be intelligent to have instincts. I mean, hell, even plants develop self defense mechanisms and climb high as they can so they can get as much sunlight as possible. But you DO need intelligence to make a choice, and without it, Samehada cannot make the choice to dispel a genjutsu on it’s owner.

    And the problem with your Neji/Lee example is that both Neji and Lee are lifeforms with superior intellect. Of course Neji can dispel a genjutsu that has caught Lee. Neji is not an animal with basic survival instincts. He can think for himself and act accordingly. He can choose to disrupt a genjutsu.

    Itachi vs Sasuke. Come on dude. Sasuke has a Sharingan and excels at genjutsu. Totally different story. If all it takes to break out of a genjutsu is a chakra boost then by rights Naruto should be immune to them. I mean damn he has more chakra than anyone else in the entire damn anime.

    Again, all this means nothing because it can’t be proven that Samehada disrupts genjutsu. Unless you can prove without a doubt that it can, your theory is just an assumption with no real weight behind it. And unfortunately for you, genjutsu is Itachi’s strong point. Without any way to defend against it, Kisame loses.

  145. i think the lot of you guys are really underestimating itachi

    here is the deal , tell me one battle which he lost except for the one he lost on purpose ( sasugay)

    furthermore we havent even seen that guy fight at full potential and he isnt the type of guy who would only go around spamming ms (like sasugay) he would fight with everything he has in well timed and well chosen attacks .

    and kisu darks is right the yata mirror can change it’s characteristics to defend against an attack

  146. @ahsan – kisu is saying that in Kisame’s final form, an elemental attack is worthless because Kisame sucks up chakra like a sponge.

  147. i quote dark “My point is, a stream of chakra coming from Samehada is not a disruption. It’s just a continual stream of chakra that Kisame has grown accustomed to, like a bijuu’s chakra constantly feeding into the hosts own chakra bank. This alone does not make the host immune to genjutsu (we know this cos of Naruto). The Bijuu has to make the decision to force chakra into the host to disrupt the flow of chakra. More than what the host is accustomed to, or no disruption will occur.”
    this is what i was trying to say to you tenrai. samehada’s chakra is the same as kisame’s because it just takes his and then gives it back. just like blood reaches our finger tips and then comes back, kisame’s chakra passes through samehada and then comes back to him.imagine it as an extension of his body.

    the Totsuka sword to be absorbed would have to be touched by Samehada. so there would actually be contact and Samehada would get hit.
    http://www.citymanga.com/naruto/chapter-470/13/
    http://www.citymanga.com/naruto/chapter-470/14/

    the damage it would take is debatable but, as i said before, a slash that can cut off orochi’s snake heads would at least break kisame’s arm if not completely knock samehada out of his hand.

  148. “In chapter 388 Sasuke uses the Cursed Seals extra chakra to power out of Tsukuyomi. If Sasuke could do it back then, Kisame easily can.”

    It’s more like Itachi stopped the Tsukuyomi himself and pretended Sasuke overcame the technique. Tsukuyomi’s effects happen within an instant. Even if there’s a partner to snap you out of it, you’re a goner before the genjutsu is dispelled.
    The first time Itachi used Tsukuyomi on Kakashi all Kurenai and Asuma noticed was Kakashi telling them not to open their eyes and right after Kakashi fell to his knees mentally exhausted. Itachi can control time and space in his Tsukuyomi, meaning he can make it last as long as he wants. A sharingan offers some resistance to the technique. Kisame can’t.

    “The Sword of Totsuka is made entirely of chakra and has no physical form, so it cant hurt Samehada and would be absorbed before it even hit. Also, Samehada can absorb Six Tails in at once, so I doubt it would have a problem draining Itachi, plus he barely has any stamina at all to begin with.”

    Well, first off all, that’s assuming Kisame blocks the swipe with Samehada. Susano’o slashes at high speeds. If Samehada doesn’t block the attack Kisame will be sealed. Also, like I said before, the Totsuka Sword can seal anyone and anything. What if it can seal Samehada?
    And Itachi doesn’t have barely any stamina. The Mangekyö uses a lot of chakra which drains Itachi quickly. And when Itachi fought Sasuke he was already gravely sickened. That doesn’t exactly do wonders to your stamina. But even then he was able to defend against everything Sasuke had, use the Tsukuyomi, the Amaterasu twice and Susano’o to it’s fullest. Sasuke never even laid a finger on him, not even with the added chakra of Orochimaru.
    Besides, low stamina isn’t an indicator of how fast someone will run out of chakra. If a ninja is excellent at molding chakra, he/she will barely use any stamina.

    And the Yata mirror thing was from narutopedia. It says the mirror counters every attack by changing its nature to the opposite of the attack. Water > Lightning.

    “Genjutsu disrupts chakra? You’re saying Samehada wouldn’t detect a change in the chakra it feeds off of?”

    Genjutsu doesn’t change chakra, it changes the way it flows through a persons mind. So in that aspect Samehada wouldn’t notice it.

  149. Oh and the electrocution still holds ground. The Yata Mirror is made out of chakra. The electric discharge it sends through the water is just electricity, not chakra. I don’t think Kisame and Samehada can absorb electricity. Unless Kisame touches the mirror, he won’t absorb the chakra.

  150. it also sems like a lot of u are forgetting that tsukoyomi is not a genjutsu that can b broken with chakra or some1 else…as redbaron pointed out it works instantly unlike other genjutsu. and i dont think kisame or samehada can absorb all the chakra of a legendary sword that as far as we’re concerned has infinite chakra… and tenrai, saying that u hate instant victory debates means u havent seen itachi’s previous fights. He beat deidara, and ur beloved orochimaru INSTANTLY, and Kakashi… these are three of the best ninjas we’ve encountered in the manga… one of whom apparently can defeat pein.

  151. @ omar

    LOL i sure hope your’e joking man !

    kakashi lost to pein
    deidra lost to kakashi
    oro lost to itachi[in an instant i maysay]!

    all of these guys have nothing on pein yes not even the legendary itachi …. well maybe he has a chance but not the three you named ! not a chance , just like kisame has no chance against itachi

    GOD CANNOT BE DEFEATED 😀

  152. u r correct ahsan, i was being sarcastic… i was saying that itachi defeated kakashi oro and deidara in an instant… and according to the debate last week oro can even beat pein (which i disagree with… pein is my favorite character, followed by itachi then jiraiya) so u can’t say that itachi can’t beat good shinobi in an instant…

  153. LOL oro beat pein 😄 lol i just saw it! 😄

    lol as for as i know oro doesnt have anything on pein xD

  154. don’t even start that debate again… the wounds are still fresh lol…

  155. no way you lost man ! i had such high hopes for you 😄

    now who’s gonna defend kakashi when im not here xD

  156. That would be me, Ahsan. @_@

  157. @debate ok so why couldnt kisame suck up this magical chakra sword? it practically took away all of the hachibi’s chakra easily and wanted more. THE SWORD IS MADE OUT OF CHAKRA. we know it seals normal objects that dont absorb chakra (like oro’s snakes head) but we have no evidence to suggest that it wouldnt be absorbed by a chakra sucker like samehada. because the amount of chakra may be too much to absorb at once this may happen instead.
    http://www.citymanga.com/naruto/chapter-471/12-13/
    in which case kisame would be sealed. itachis sussanoo is also made of chakra, seems like fair game too. The only thing left for itachi is his amazing genjutsu. i doubt samehada can disrupt a genjutsu just because that isnt one of the things it been shown to do. unlike absorb absurd amounts of charka.

  158. guys i can’t wait for the next chapter…Konan vs Madara….i’m putting my money on sasuke appearing with his MS.

  159. Are You serious Tenrai, come on man, itachi getting beat by kisame?! No way.

    First off leave all the genjutsu and tsukuyome and susanoo aside, Itachi is a fighter that has his sharingan always activated, so any hand seals Kisame is inclined to make are instantly seen by the sharingan, so the water sphere u guys are so inclined to use is instantly observed by Itachi, remember that the sharingan also slows down time for the user giving him the time to effectively counter any jutsus. This u can take from the Kakashi fight with Zabuza or the Sasuke vs Deidara fight. Kisame is moving at slug speed for itachi and any decisions he tries to make on the battle field are gonna be seen by Itachi in record time.

    So beside that using Tsukuyome, Amaterasu or Susanoo are just over kill for Kisame.

    I’m not saying kisame isn’t a great ninja, he’s actually a awesome fighter but not against a uchiha and especially not one of Itachi’s caliber.

    Oh and about the Susanoo taking time to be formed, remember the time Sasuke first activated it. Raikage came at him in his lightning armor witch gave him a speed close to that of Minato and Sasuke was able to activate the Susanoo just before he got body slammed to the ground at light speed. Now that to me says only one thing, Susanoo + activation = fast perfect defense.

  160. “Raikage came at him in his lightning armor witch gave him a speed close to that of Minato and Sasuke was able to activate the Susano’o just before he got body slammed to the ground at light speed.”

    Or Itachi defending against Sasuke’s Kirin by activating Susano’o.
    He did that in 1/1000 of a second.

    But what I think Tenrai was referring to is the time it takes for Susano’o to be completely formed. That does seem to take some time. Not that it matters, Kisame can’t overcome the Tsukuyomi and Samehada won’t snap Kisame out of it in time. Seeing as how Tsukuyomi is the first power play Itachi uses the fight will end with it too. Itachi won’t need to try Amaterasu or Susano’o.

  161. First, I’d like to state that I think Itachi, and Kisame were awesome characters… nobody will deny that. *slashes tenrai-rib sword at everyone*

    I do feel that Itachi has this one in the bag, and have to agree with redbaron, it’s gonna go down like this:

    ITACHI: Tsukuyomi!

    KISAME: *to samehada* What are you saying?

    SAMEHADA: gigigigigigi *yer gonna get stabbed dummy*

    KISAME: What? I swear, nobody can understand this goddamn sword!

    SAMEHADA: GIGIGIGIGI!!!! *Hey F*ck you to! You F*cking fish-f*cker!

    KISAME: HA! I’m dead! At least I didn’t have to bite my tongue off this time!

  162. bubblition: Okay Pickles it’s time for your psych evaluation.
    It seems that you have been under the influence again.
    Caption: Stay Away from the cookie jar.

  163. Wow this place is deader than chatroll lol.

  164. just one thing for Itachi and Susan`o,
    even if samehada would absorb a chakra from susano`s sword it would automatically sealed away samehada due to contact with Sword of Kusanagi.
    Regrding Tsukuyomi,only another sharingan user that is an Uchiha blood can brake it,so samehada is helpless…thanx to @Tenrai for making this debate much interesting.

  165. @1redbaron1

    Kisame doesn’t have to look at Itachi, so he doesn’t have to get caught by Tsukyomi in the first place. I have already given a reason as to how he could battle against Itachi blind and he could do it quite easily, to be honest.

    Also, Sasuke is not Itachi, so it isn’t wise to use Sasuke’s battle with the Raikage as a comparison for what Itachi is Capable of. Sasuke was able to defend himself quickly because he was able to partially form Susanoo. Now, some people may assume that because Sasuke could do it, Itachi could as well, but was Itachi able to use shape manipulation with his Amatarasu?

    No… it was specifically mentioned that because Sasuke was able to, he may have surpassed Itachi in that regard.

    Also, I don’t see why the Samehada cannot overcome Susanoo. If it can absorb chakra and Susanoo is made up of chakra, then why can’t the Samehada absorb Susanoo? When you think about it, Kisame could win this battle very easily, actually, if he uses the right strategy.

    Firstly, all he has to do is create a giant water sphere and trap Itachi within his turf, all the while fusing with the Samehada, just like he did with Bee. He won’t look at Itachi, because he knows about Itachi’s genjutsu threat, but because he has the Samehada, he can sense Itachi’s chakra and smell him in the water without needing his vision. If Itachi tries to counter with any ninjutsu, Kisame’s perfect defense will just absorb it and make him an even greater threat.

    So now Itachi is stuck in the water, subject to drowning and unable to swim as fast as Bee (who was able to make use of his octopus side to him), which means he will be completely outmaneuvered. None of his katon jutsu will be effective and even if Amatarasu could hit, it would just be absorbed. His genjutsu wouldn’t work because Kisame could literally battle with his eyes closed and Taijutsu with a monster that can absorb your chakra just by touching you is a stupid idea.

    So, what is left? Ah yes, Susanoo. The trump card everyone resorts to when Itachi cannot win a battle any other way. The jutsu that everyone seems to suggest has no weaknesses. Well, it does have a weakness, and that is the fact that it is made up of chakra. Kisame has an attack perfectly suited for that very purpose, and that is the shark missile jutsu he was using on Gai. It becomes stronger and more powerful by absorbing the Chakra of the opponent’s jutsu to increase its own size. That means Kisame could actually just shoot one of those off if Itachi forms his Susanoo and the best part is, he can use it from a safe distance, far outside the range of Itachi’s mythical weapons.

    The jutsu will simply absorb Susanoo, making itself stronger, and Itachi will be pwned.

    There, I have covered all three bases. Genjtsu, taijutsu and ninjutsu. Kisame has the advantage here.

    Oh, and just so that everyone knows, I actually believe that Itachi is stronger than Kisame overall. It is just simply a case of Kisame having the right abilities to defeat Itachi, that’s all. It doesn’t mean that I am trying to make Itachi seem weaker.

  166. @afisharingan

    Actually, Bee was able to break the Tsukyomi as well, which was the basis of my original theory that the Samehada could assist Kisame in breaking it as well, just like the Hachibi broke Bee out of it.

    However, I decided to give an alternative to how Kisame could combat Itachi’s genjutsu, just so that no-one could argue with me about whether Samehada could fill that role or not.

    I don’t know why people seem to believe that the Tsukyomi is unbreakable unless you are an Uchiha when the manga has already shown that that isn’t the case.

  167. @Tenrai

    Bee wasn’t able to break Tsukuyomi, he broke a normal genjutsu.

    http://www.narutobase.net/manga/Naruto/413/9
    http://www.narutobase.net/manga/Naruto/413/10

    And even if it was Tsukuyomi, Danzo stated that Sasuke’s version is extremely weak compared to Itachi’s and he had no problem breaking it.

    http://www.narutobase.net/manga/Naruto/478/3

    So there is no proof that a Biju can break Tsukuyomi, so Samehada probably can’t either.

  168. @ Tenrai, you should reread my last post.

    Itachi is among the fastest ninja out there, not to mention he can form hand seals faster then Sasuke’s sharingan can see.

    You keep bringing that water sphere up, dude Itachi would see that coming a mile away, do you think he’ll just stay there and be sucked in the water.

    No bro, this guy see’s a hell of a lot faster the kisame thinks, so there’s no way any of those jutsu will work on Itachi, plus you seem to be forgetting that the sharingan sees quite a bit including chakra networks.
    Even if Kisame was a stranger to Itachi he’d have him and samehada figured out in a blink of an eye. So falling for the whole chakra stealing trick won’t work on Itachi ether.
    Theres a lot of stuff I could bring up but this debate is just not balanced. We all know that the Uchiha, bitch asses as they are, they’re the best shinobi clan out there and Itachi was a prodigy among them.
    I dare say he was the 3rd strongest in akatsuki behind Pain and Madara.

  169. @eugen you also forgot to mention that they’re total idiots minus Obito.

  170. @Eugen

    1: Where does it say that Itachi is one of the fastest ninja ever? I have seen notable references to Sasuke’s speed in the manga, but never Itachi’s. If you can show me one part in the manga that does make such a reference to Itachi’s speed, please show it to me.

    2: Yes, Itachi would see the water sphere coming, but how will he outrun it? Kisame can cover a battlefield in water in seconds, so unless Itachi knows the Hiraishin or another similar space-time jutsu, I don’t see him getting away.

    3: Seeing your opponent’s chakra doesn’t mean you can figure them out in the blink of an eye. It just means you can see that they have a lot of chakra, but you CANNOT see what their abilities are just by seeing their chakra network.

    Also remember that seeing an enemy’s jutsu and being able to avoid it are not the same thing, as pointed out before in the manga already. It is very difficult to avoid a jutsu that covers an entire battlefield and, as mentioned before, you have no evidence to show that Itachi is significantly faster than Kisame, so unless you can show me such evidence, or evidence that shows that he is one of the fastest shinobi ever, that point is based purely on your opinion and nothing more.

    That means that my previous points still stand largely uncontested.

  171. @kanton

    Obito’s an idiot too if he’s Madara 😉

    O_O

  172. @Dragon

    Um… your link actually just proves that Sasuke was using Tsukyomi and that Bee broke through it.

    Note: In the first page, you see Sasuke using his MS to cast the jutsu, the same eye he uses for Tsukyomi. On the second page, you see him holding his eye, suffering the same aftereffects of Tsukyomi as is normal.

    So, Bee can and did break the Tsukyomi. Whether it was weaker or not is irrelevant, because it still means that Tsukyomi was broken by a non-uchiha. It also means that Itachi’s can be broken as well, because the same principle applies (disrupting the victim’s chakra) for all genjutsu. If Itachi’s is stronger, it just means it is more difficult to break, theoretically, but that doesn’t mean it cannot be broken.

  173. @Tenrai – hey dude, your back! Finally the debate starts to pick itself back up again lol.

    All right, I think there is some confusion as to the way Samehada works. People seem to have the idea that Samehada can absorb chakra, like a live vacuum cleaner similar to Preta Path. This is not the case. As commented by Kisame, Samehada shaves chakra it physically comes into contact with. If Samehada was swung at a fully formed Susano’o, it would not absorb the whole thing, only what it comes into contact with. It’ll leave a pretty dent in it’s shield, maybe shrink it a little, but eat the whole thing in one bite? Nahh, not happening. Besides, you don’t wanna get too close to that thing anyway.

    But enough about Susano’o. Itachi doesn’t need his MS techs to take out Jaws.

    Two, genjutsu. To cast his favorite genjutsu, Itachi doesn’t have to have Kisame look into his eyes. He merely needs to point. How exactly do you defend against an opponent who only has to point in your direction for you to be under his spell? There is no defense.

    Water spheres and Fusion Dances. I believe Kisame said something along the lines of “the stronger my opponent, the stronger I myself become” during his battle with Killer Bee. This also includes his final form and all his jutsu. The last time he performed his fusion and water bubble jutsu he was running hot with his own chakra and several whole freaking tail’s worth of Hachibi chakra. Even his great chakra-absorbing shark missile was performed after sapping Bee of most of his chakra. He won’t have the same reserves of chakra on hand so these techniques become a lot less powerful than what we’ve seen them to be. As far as we know, he may not have enough chakra to pull them off at all. It would explain why we’ve only seen a technique as bloody deadly as the water prison technique and also the Kisamehada fusion used only once in the manga, during his fight with Bee.

    Oh btw, Itachi isn’t helpless in water. Remember, water is one of his elemental affinities. Trying to drown Itachi or any other water-affinity ninja in water is about as clever as trying to kill Gaara by throwing him into a pool of quicksand. You’ve just placed him inside a large tank of water which he is able to manipulate. He can copy kisame’s normal water shark missiles for movement, or even make an army of explosive water clones and set them off near Kisame. If I remember correctly, explosives were used against Kisame before in a debate…something about how the explosions themselves were pure force, not chakra, and thus couldn’t be absorbed. Oh, and how water amplified the range and damage of explosives…hmmmmmm… 😄

    The one thing most people are forgetting in this fight is just how hax the Sharingan actually is. Any movements (handsigns, toe twitching, MJ-style groin-grabbing) are slowed down and taken in by a sharingan wielder, meaning he kniws what moves his opponent will make long before he actually makes it, meaning that of Kisame tries to perform his giant water balloon jutsu, Itachi will see it coming before it happens and put him in a pointy-finger genjutsu before that happens. Any jutsu Kisame performs are instantly perceived by Itachi, who can then copy the hand signs and use it from then on. So what if Kisame fires a chakra absorbing shark at Itachi, Itachi could just fire one back and watch them cancel each other out.

    Itachi is not quite as helpless as you make him sound, Tenrai ol’ buddy ol’ pal. He has several tricks up his sleeve which make him an excellent match against the Monster of the Hidden Mist. 🙂

  174. Ah, Darks, a worthy opponent come to battle me. Very well, I will counter your points.

    “If Samehada was swung at a fully formed Susano’o, it would not absorb the whole thing, only what it comes into contact with. It’ll leave a pretty dent in it’s shield, maybe shrink it a little, but eat the whole thing in one bite? Nahh, not happening. Besides, you don’t wanna get too close to that thing anyway.”

    Actually, if that was the case, Kisame wouldn’t have been able to absorb the chakra out of Bee’s lightning imbued pencil before it hit him, because the pencil did not tough the Samehada. It was just in the vicinity and it was still rendered useless. Secondly, the Samehada absorbed Bee’s chakra cloak completely, not just the part it touched. So that point is invalid. I even gave the shark missile jutsu just for that anyway, so yeah.

    “Even his great chakra-absorbing shark missile was performed after sapping Bee of most of his chakra. He won’t have the same reserves of chakra on hand so these techniques become a lot less powerful than what we’ve seen them to be. As far as we know, he may not have enough chakra to pull them off at all.”

    Kisame has bijuu level chakra even without absorbing his opponents, so I doubt he would have any trouble performing those techs.

    I will type more soon…

  175. @Debate
    well Itachi is stronger because Kisame himself acknowledge it
    itachi/Kisame stats
    Nin Tai Gen Int Str Spd Chakra Hndsls
    5/4.5 4.5/4.5 5/2.5 5/3.5 2.5/5 5/4.5 2.5/5 5/3.5

  176. @darks

    Continued from earlier.

    Alright, now to adress your comment on Itachi fighting effectively in water. I have to say, that was very contrived, even for you. Just because someone can use an element, that doesn’t mean they can fight effectively or survive in it. So, just because Kakashi can use water, that doesn’t mean he can breath in it or swim better in it. That’s like saying because Kakashi can use katon jutsu, he cannot be burned. Kisame can only breath under water because he has gills. X___x

    You comment about the explosive clones, however, was clever, so I will give you credit there. However, they are NOT water clones. They are shadow clones, which means Kisame can avoid the as easily as he would avoid Itachi, unless Itachi sprouts fins and starts swimming a lot faster. If you don’t believe me, just research the jutsu.

    And please show me where Itachi has used a water jutsu. We are saying he is proficient at using it even though we have never actually seen him use one. He could try and copy one, but remember that you need to meet the requirements of a jutsu to perform it correctly even if you copy it and I haven’t seen Itachi use any ninjutsu outside of the fire element or his sharingan. If he doesn’t have a water affinity, that option is not considerable.

    Last point. I never said Itachi was helpless. Kisame just has the right abilities to defeat him.

  177. @darks.

    As for you genjutsu argument, I already have long since mentiond that kisame could effectively battle with his eyes closed, but perhaps you didn’t read that.

    @kantonkage

    Kakashi’s stars are also higher than Naruto’s but that doesn’t mean he would beat Naruto in a battle. Let’s face it, a lot of those stats are either outdated or lopsided and hardly determine who is a better contestant.

  178. and when kisame activates his dai Bakusui shoha it’s as if you expect itachi to grow wings and fly or something to avoid

  179. @tenrai I’m on kisame’s side.

  180. @Tenrai – Whatdya meeean, i’ve come to battle you!? More the other way around! I was waiting freaking days for a Kisame supporter to raise their head and charge at me with all the debating power they could muster lol.

    About Samehada absorbing Bee’s entire chakra cloak…Buzzz! Wrong, Tenrai!
    http://www.citymanga.com/naruto/chapter-471/04/
    The chakra pencil? Buzzz, wrong again! He didn’t absorb the chakra, he just dodged!
    http://www.citymanga.com/naruto/chapter-470/12/
    The chakra that he was able to absorb however, was the knife that went THROUGH Samehada. See below:
    http://www.citymanga.com/naruto/chapter-470/14/
    Again, only what it touches is absorbed. These pics above prove it.

    “Kisame has bijuu level chakra even without absorbing his opponents, so I doubt he would have any trouble performing those techs.”

    As opposed to having enough chakra for two bijuus. So what’s that, 50% effectiveness? 😄 And I think him having bijuu level chakra is a bit of an overstatement. I’m not denying that he has a huge – no, ENORMOUS chakra bank, but to compare his chakra to that of a pure chakra being such as a Bijuu based solely on his reputation of being called a Tail-less Tailed beast (an oxymoron if ever I heard one) is surely a bit of a stretch.

    I will wait for your response lol…

  181. @Tenrai – Ahhh, you’ve already finished your response. Shtoopid iPad needs to keep up. :/

    Ability to fight underwater – You said several times that he is helpless underwater. I’m merely trying to demonstrate that he is not. No, he cant breathe underwater, but he sure as hell can fight. We know he can perform water jutsu because of this one right here:
    http://naruto.wikia.com/wiki/Water_Release:_Water_Fang_Bullet
    It is shown in the manga (during Itachi and Kisame’s fight with Kakashi, Kurenai and Asuma), I just cbf’d finding it lol. So, we know that he can use water jutsu, therefore he can copy Kisame’s techniques. This means he can use Kisame’s water shark missiles for movement as I’m sure he’s seen Kisame do before, means his explosive kagebunshins (thanks for the correction ^_^) have a way to move around inside the water sphere and detonate at close range to Kisame.

    Your argument for Kisame battling genjutsu hinges on him being in final shark form. So, if he doesn’t transform, he’s susceptible, no? I’m sure he can pull of a pointy finger before Kisame has the chance to fuse with Samehada. Even if he is in final form, I don’t think you realize how much of a disadvantage Kisame puts himself in when he fights with his eyes closed. Itachi can create a few explosive clones and share his chakra around. A nightmare for someone who hunts by chakra detection alone. Kisame has several targets to go for now, not just the one anymore. If he chooses the wrong one, KABOOM.

    Heyyyy, leave my contrived comment alone! It’s 2am and I can’t sleep lol.

  182. Wait up, found the water tech reference.
    http://www.citymanga.com/naruto/chapter-142/09/
    And the page after has just one of many references to Itachi’s speed, Tenrai. You could find more if you looked. ^_^

  183. darkavater you’re wrong about about the knife. it was infused with chakra and passed near samehada, not through it. kisame blocked the knife/sword bee was holding while the other one effectively hit him. unfortunately for bee, it passed near samehada and had the raiton chakra absorbed.
    in the following picture we see a sword flying at kisame while bee is charging at him with another one.
    http://www.citymanga.com/naruto/chapter-470/13/

    here we see the sword stuck in kisame
    http://www.citymanga.com/naruto/chapter-470/14/
    http://www.citymanga.com/naruto/chapter-470/16/

    here’s a great example of kisame asborbing chakra without the sword coming into contact with the victim.
    http://www.citymanga.com/naruto/chapter-470/16/

    and dark, kisame didn’t absorb all of bee’s chakra in the following image because it can absorb up to 6 tails. bee even says it. http://www.citymanga.com/naruto/chapter-471/04/

    one last thing: i’m on itachi’s side. i think that he’d beat kisame through genjutsu before sharky even has time to transform or use the water sphere. samehada can’t break him out of a genjutsu… i agree with tenrai on one thing though- if itachi somehow gets caught in the water sphere then he’s done for.

  184. @Darks

    “The chakra pencil? Buzzz, wrong again! He didn’t absorb the chakra, he just dodged!”

    I made an incorrect reference to the pencil, which I suppose is my fault. It was actually a sword he threw that I was referring to. One was blocked by the Samehada (which Bee was attacking with close combat), while the other thrown sword hit Kisame in the shoulder. However, it didn’t pierce right through his body because *waits for it* the Samehada absorbed the lightning chakra out of it before it even hit Kisame, even though it wasn’t toutghing it.

    So my point still stands.

    http://www.citymanga.com/naruto/chapter-470/14/

    “About Samehada absorbing Bee’s entire chakra cloak…Buzzz! Wrong, Tenrai!”

    http://www.citymanga.com/naruto/chapter-470/16/

    That proves otherwise. Once again, Kisame didn’t even move the Samehada towards Bee. It was simply within the vicinity and Bee’s chakra was absorbed. In the later frames, you even see how the chakra almost seems to be attracted to the Samehada, like a vacuum cleaner, as you so eloquently put it.

    Wrong? I think not. <_<

    "As opposed to having enough chakra for two bijuus. So what’s that, 50% effectiveness?"

    Kisame coverred a battlefield in water at 30% effectiveness to his original body. Much less 200% effectiveness as you are suggesting by logic of your math, so yes, I still doubt he would have a problem.

    "We know he can perform water jutsu because of this one right here:"

    Thank you, I didn't realise he knew water jutsu, so it was good of you to show me. So far, your biggest trump cards are those Kage bunshin explosives, which to me sound like the greatest threat to Kisame since this debate started.

    However, once again, there is a possible counter and that is the shark missile jutsu itself. If it absorbs the chakra out of the clones, the clones are as good as gone. Also remember that shadow clones split the users chakra in half, or evenly between clones depending on the ammounts used. For someone who doesn't have Bijuu level chakra reserves, that is a huge hinderence. So Itachi using explosive shadow clones, only to have them end up as shark bate, would actually cause him to lose the battle twice as fast.

    Also, your point about vision hindering him, he wouldn't be able to see the difference between the clones regardless, so no, closing his eyes doesn't make him less effective. If anything, him detecting multiple chakra's will already allert him to the fact that Itachi is using clones, so he will know to avoid them, all the while Itachi weakens himself by cutting his chakra reserves in half every time he creates a clone.

    Next. If Itachi copies Kisame's jutsu, that doesn't mean he will be more effective with them. Remember, Kisame has more chakra than Itachi, which means he can put more power behind his techniques. When two jutsu of the same type clash, the stronger one will win and Kisame has the chakra to overpower Itachi in that regard. Itachi would be a fool to play to Kisame's strengths rather than sticking to his own jutsu, which he is more efficient with. I also find it funny how you doubt Kisame's ability to use some of his own high level techniques, and then you go on to say that Itachi, who has even less chakra, could. You kinda contradicted yourself there.

    As for the finger pull genjutsu, remember that is normal Genjutsu, not Tsukyomi. Kisame is hardly an ammateur and I doubt he would have trouble avoiding it or breaking out of it. Remember that Akatsuki members are partnered with someone they are on a similar strength base to, so it is hardly in question that Kisame is at least on Itachi's level. And, as I said, I never mentioned him being better than Itachi, just more suited for this particular battle.

  185. “And the page after has just one of many references to Itachi’s speed, Tenrai. You could find more if you looked. ^_^”

    It’s not my job to look for support for your side of the debate. So you could find more if you like. ^ ^

    And even still, that means he is just fast at casting jutsu. That doesn’t speak for his actual physical movement speed so much as his speed with hand seals. It is also a comparison to Kakashi, not anyone else, so it still doesn’t mean he can outspeed Kisame in water of all things.

  186. Well, I am going to go off for the night. I will continue debating in the morning, but I am enjoying this so far, so thanks for keeping it up. @__@

    I was hoping for the Kakashi vs Gai debate to take off, but this was a good substitute.

    See you all in the morning! ^ ^

  187. “Kisame doesn’t have to look at Itachi, so he doesn’t have to get caught by Tsukyomi in the first place. I have already given a reason as to how he could battle against Itachi blind and he could do it quite easily, to be honest.”

    The only ninja we know who can fight without ‘facing’ his opponent is Guy. Kisame being able to track Itachi is nice and all but it will get him nowhere in a fight. Itachi is quite skilled with Kunai. It would be a real shame if ‘the great’ Kisame lost because of a Kunai to the forehead. ^__^
    Furthermore, Itachi doesn’t need to use his eyes to cast a genjutsu. I’ll quote Itachi himself now: If I just have one finger, that’s enough. Off course that wouldn’t create the Tsukuyomi but it will still cast a genjutsu on Kisame and create time for Itachi to use whatever technique to kill Kisame.

    “Also, Sasuke is not Itachi, so it isn’t wise to use Sasuke’s battle with the Raikage as a comparison for what Itachi is Capable of. Sasuke was able to defend himself quickly because he was able to partially form Susanoo. Now, some people may assume that because Sasuke could do it, Itachi could as well, but was Itachi able to use shape manipulation with his Amatarasu?”

    Sasuke was nowhere near Itachi’s level when Sasuke fought the Raikage. Itachi had full control over Susano’o when he fought Sasuke, Sasuke finally unlocked the full Susano’o against Danzou. Sasuke’s only more skilled with the Amaterasu seeing as how he can extinguish and manipulate it. But you’re saying Sasuke is more skilled than Itachi because of that. First of all we don’t know whether or not Itachi could do that too. He never had any reason to do so. Second, Itachi’s Tsukuyomi was FAR superior to Sasuke’s. Itachi’s Tsukuyomi leaves a non-mangekyou sharingan user mentally destroyed. Sasuke’s version is just a suped-up genjutsu which immobilizes the target. Remember how fast C was able to recover from it and how Danzou easily overcame the technique? So looking at Tsukuyomi, Sasuke will never be as skilled as Itachi.

    “Also, I don’t see why the Samehada cannot overcome Susanoo. If it can absorb chakra and Susanoo is made up of chakra, then why can’t the Samehada absorb Susanoo? When you think about it, Kisame could win this battle very easily, actually, if he uses the right strategy.”

    Because apparently (I discovered this while looking up the Totsuka Sword and Yata Mirror) the Totsuka sword can seal anyone and anything!! it touches. If Samehada absorbs Susano’o BEFORE Susano’o manifests its sword than Kisame might have a chance.

    “Firstly, all he has to do is create a giant water sphere and trap Itachi within his turf, all the while fusing with the Samehada, just like he did with Bee.”

    Itachi can cast genjutsu like Kisame can swim. It doesn’t matter what Kisame tries. End result Itachi wins. Besides Itachi is smart enough to stay out of Kisame’s grasp. Furthermore, the speed at which Itachi uses handseals is not noticeable by someone without a sharingan. Kisame will most likely attack an explosive clone before he even realizes Itachi made a clone. But like I said before, Itachi will cast a genjutsu on Kisame. It’s not a question of if or when but how.

    “2: Yes, Itachi would see the water sphere coming, but how will he outrun it? Kisame can cover a battlefield in water in seconds, so unless Itachi knows the Hiraishin or another similar space-time jutsu, I don’t see him getting away.”

    By staying on top of it, most ninja’s are able to stand on water. Other than that he could form Susano’o to keep the water away and fry Kisame inside the water by changing the Yata Mirror into a Raiton Shield. The electricity in the water is not chakra but electric discharge so Kisame will aid Itachi by creating a water sphere.

    “3: Seeing your opponent’s chakra doesn’t mean you can figure them out in the blink of an eye.”
    Yes it does, Itachi will see the chakra flowing between Kisame and Samehada, bye bye Chakra stealing surprise. And the sharingan CAN see what type of chakra nature someone uses. Sasuke knew from the moment he met Deidara that Deidara used earth…. Or the head protector gave it away. ^__^

    “you have no evidence to show that Itachi is significantly faster than Kisame, so unless you can show me such evidence”
    The first fight with Kakashi, dodging Sasuke’s Chidori by grabbing him at the wrist behind the technique, fighting Kakashi again through a body of a sand ninja, versus Sasuke at the Uchiha shrine/temple/whatever it was. He doesn’t move a lot but when he does he moves at great speed. He easily dodged Kakashi’s katon during their second fight just by moving his upper body around it. He moves at the most efficient way. Furthermore, it says a lot that he doesn’t have to move a lot to fight. He’s just that powerful.

    “Kisame has bijuu level chakra even without absorbing his opponents, so I doubt he would have any trouble performing those techs.”

    Like I debated before a few breakdowns ago. Kisame has Jincuuriki level chakra. Powerful? Yes, Bijuu powerful? Hehehe, no. I’m not going to debate about that again. I already destroyed Kisu during that, I hate to do the same to you.

    “I don’t know why people seem to believe that the Tsukyomi is unbreakable unless you are an Uchiha when the manga has already shown that that isn’t the case.”

    I already made a comment about that. If you’re gonna ignore my comments again than I’m done right now. If there’s one thing that annoys me to no end it is repeating myself over and over again.

  188. i agree with everything u said redbaron except one thing… i dont think u destroyed kisu in that debate… jinchurikis have more chakra than bijuus end of story… a jinchuriki is by definition a person that is the host of a bijuu and we know from the manga that a wild bijuu is weaker than a jinchuriki… example being naruto being more powerful than the kyuubi and its just the fact that its more controlled

  189. Chill out Red, as a person who reads every comment on this blog I can safely say we got this one in the bag, even if Tenrai is putting up quite a fight.

    @Omar, you need to understand something and this is for everyone.
    Can you look into my eyes and tell me Naruto with only the sage mode can defeat the kyuubi Minato and Kushina fought.
    Yeah you think about that.
    The jinchurikis are only so strong because of the chakra given to them by there beasts. If they didn’t have a bijuu inside them they’d be just like a normal shinobi.

    And no the bijuus are not just mindless beasts as you and Kisu like to point out only because Deidara said so. These beasties don’t sit @ analyzing the battle field and making up a game plan, no they blast there way through because they have they shit to do so. That doesn’t mean that they can’t think of other methods to destroy someone. If you were as big as a bijuu I would think you wouldn’t want to be losing time with a Girl looking dude like Deidara, am I wright.
    A jinchuriki isn’t a jinchuriki without a bijuu so saying that a jinchuriki is stronger with the bijuu inside him then the bijuu itself is just like saying Muhamad Ali with a Shotgun is stronger then Muhamad Ali, @_@ ,if you didn’t understand from that example what this is all about I can’t help anymore.

  190. Oh and name one jinchuriki that has more chakra then it’s bijuu.
    The only man that was considered on that level, and even so it probably was an overstatement, was Kisame and he gained that reputation because he had the unique ability to steal and store massive amounts of chakra, him and his sword Samehad.
    There are no Jinchurikis that started out with more chakra then there bijuu, otherwise what’s the point of having a chakra monster when you all ready have shinobi with more chakra then the beasts themselves. You guys should really think before saying something like that.

  191. Oh hell. The posts are getting longer and longer…O_O

    @Tenrai – there were a couple of mistakes in your post, more to do with understanding my post than anything. Probably my fault, considering I was tired as hell when I typed them. I still am tired as hell, but I’m gonna try to explain myself a bit more.

    Firstly, that sword he threw…come on dude! Look how close it was to the sword. The raiton sword was only absorbed as it passed within the vicinity of Samehada. Maybe the dumb chakra whore has a little range, but it’s only demonstrated the ability to absorb chakra that’s close enough to it.

    As for absorbing all of Bee’s chakra cloak…Bee was directly touching Samehada through the sword Kisame blocked. That may have something to do with how easy it was for him to suck up his chakra cloak. You can see from the next time Bee gets close, Samehada only manages to absorb 6 tails at the most.

    Neither of which I really care about. Samehada has thus only been used as a counter to Itachi’s MS jutsu, and I for one have stayed clear of those. If someone else wants to debate Tenrai on the sword, be my guest.

    Instead, I wanna focus on the explosive kagebunshins. You see, splitting his chakra between his clones is actually beneficial to him. It doesn’t matter if he splits his chakra between his clones, so long as he wins the fight, no?. With his eyes closed, Kisamehada is at a huge disadvantage BECAUSE he can’t tell the difference between the real Itachi and the clones. Which of them does he go after? He doesn’t know, and if he chooses the wrong Itachi, he dies. So then, are you saying that after he’s transformed into a giant shark monster and created a huge dome of water for the field advantage, the best Kisame can do is swim away? Pffft, hardly seems that menacing anymore.

    Even if he does try and keep his distance, as I said before, the Itachi clones can use normal shark missiles to maneuver themselves to surround him. The thing about the normal shark missiles is that they don’t actually absorb their targets chakra, at least they haven’t been shown to. Only the big one does. Them explosive clones would be fine lol.

    Kisamehada finds himself surrounded by explosive kagebunshins, what can he do? Itachi can detonate them far faster than Kisame can pull off the hand signs for a giant water shark missile. He’s a goner, and this debate goes to us. 😄

    Sharingan copy ability. You know, Itachi may have less chakra, but he is by far more efficient with it than Kisame. You can see that in his fight with Sasuke. He uses all three of his MS jutsu (which we know are major chakra drainers) while half dead. Imagine what he could do at full power. It’s a classic example of quantity vs quality.

    Oh, and one last thing. Your genjutsu comment. That there, sir, is pure speculation. To break free of genjutsu, you must have excellent chakra control and an affinity for genjutsu. Kisame has not been shown with either. To say that Kisame would have no trouble breaking free of a genjutsu based on nothing but the fact that they were partnered together is patchy at best, downright silly at worst. And as I explained days ago, Kisame won’t try to break out of a genjutsu he doesn’t know he’s in, till it’s too late. The moral of the story is Kisame is susceptible to genjutsu like any other person with poor chakra control (*cough* Naruto *cough*), especially one cast from a ninja as skilled in the field as Itachi.

    Oh yeah, and Itachi’s speed. I didn’t bring Itachi’s speed up, just thought I’d show you in passing lol.

  192. ive been reading a little there seems to be a kisame itachi debate going on im gonna see whats about but my money is on itachi 1 word AMATERASU!!!

  193. @darks

    “Firstly, that sword he threw…come on dude! Look how close it was to the sword. The raiton sword was only absorbed as it pa ssed within the vicinity of Samehada. Maybe the dumb chakra whore has a little range, but it’s only demonstrated the ability to absorb chakra that’s close enough to it.”

    actually you are 100 % correct , the dumb sword has a “range” , as stated by kisame himself when he breifly fought the “water guy in sasugay’s team”

    still he cant win against itachi sama though 😄

    btw just to piss off some kakashi haters …

    you know when we debated kisame v.s kakashi how you over so keen to suggest kisame would win , well guy beat kisame . it’s commonly known guy = kakashi . so ZING!! 😉

  194. @sage mode freak

    actually forget amertasureu [ spelling god help me X_X ]

    one word tsukyomni …. and pwned

  195. YEAH i just read a few older coments and gotta say it woud be one great figth but still all itachi i tink we are understemating itachis abillities i give you the amaterasu but no way hes escaping susano yata mirror and the K.O.F.sword kissame will be history before the second swing of the great samehada in my opinion

  196. @debate what makes you think he will look into itachi eyes. He could perform Kirigakure and go in for the attack. plus he could just drown Itachi. Also since he can drain youki what’s so special about Amaterasu.

  197. so ur saying something that doesnt make sense…. ur saying can naruto without the kyuubi beat the kyuubi… the answer is no…. but naruto without the kyuubi is no longer a jinchuuriki… the perfect example of a weak bijuu was the 3 tails…. The jinchūriki (人柱力; Literally meaning “Power of Human Sacrifice”) are humans that have a tailed beast sealed within them. They exhibit extraordinary powers, and in some cases are more powerful than their tailed beasts, because they have the intelligence to use the beast’s powers effectively.

  198. @Redbaron

    Very well, let me reply.

    “The only ninja we know who can fight without ‘facing’ his opponent is Guy. Kisame being able to track Itachi is nice and all but it will get him nowhere in a fight. Itachi is quite skilled with Kunai. It would be a real shame if ‘the great’ Kisame lost because of a Kunai to the forehead.”

    Um, that wasn’t a very convincing argument. Kisame has already shown that he CAN effectively fight with no vision and he showed this in the battle against Bee. And a lot of shinobi are skilled with the kunai, not just Itachi. Hell, Bee is a master swordsman who is probably more skilled with kenjutsu than Itachi, so why didn’t he just stab Kisame in the forehead?

    “Furthermore, Itachi doesn’t need to use his eyes to cast a genjutsu.”

    I already countered that comment earlier by someone else. For someone who likes to accuse others of not reading their posts, you seem to do the exact same.

    “Itachi had full control over Susano’o when he fought Sasuke, Sasuke finally unlocked the full Susano’o against Danzou. Sasuke’s only more skilled with the Amaterasu seeing as how he can extinguish and manipulate it. But you’re saying Sasuke is more skilled than Itachi because of that. First of all we don’t know whether or not Itachi could do that too.”

    You said exactly my point when you said “We don’t know whether or not Itachi could do that to.” Because we don’t know whether Itachi could partially form Susanoo. Until you have evidence that shows that he can, I don’t see what was wrong with my point.

    “Because apparently (I discovered this while looking up the Totsuka Sword and Yata Mirror) the Totsuka sword can seal anyone and anything!! it touches. If Samehada absorbs Susano’o BEFORE Susano’o manifests its sword than Kisame might have a chance.”

    I gave an argument about how Kisame could stay out of range of Itachi’s Susanoo and use his shark missile jutsu to overcome it. Once again, you are not countering my comments at all.

    “Itachi can cast genjutsu like Kisame can swim. It doesn’t matter what Kisame tries. End result Itachi wins.”

    I also already countered the genjutsu argument. Once with samehada as a means to break it, another with Kisame fighting with his eyes closed. If you want to counter me in a debate, try to counter those points, rather than just ignoring them.

    “Kisame will most likely attack an explosive clone before he even realizes Itachi made a clone”

    If Kisame can sense chakra, then why wouldn’t he know Itachi created a clone? He will immidiately notice more than one chakra level, in fact him being blind in this battle is more suitable than relying on his vision.

    “Other than that he could form Susano’o to keep the water away and fry Kisame inside the water by changing the Yata Mirror into a Raiton Shield. The electricity in the water is not chakra but electric discharge so Kisame will aid Itachi by creating a water sphere.”

    Eh? Since when could susanoo use lightning? Please, if you are going to counter me, at least use an argument based on what you actually know what Itachi CAN do, as Darks showed me with the water jutsu.

    “nd the sharingan CAN see what type of chakra nature someone uses. Sasuke knew from the moment he met Deidara that Deidara used earth….

    Actually, that statement is false. Sasuke only figured out Deidara’s element because he saw him using an earth seal in his hand signs. He only figured that out after seeing the seal, not the moment he saw Deidara’s chakra. Also, seeing chakra flow between the Samehada and Kisame is no proof that the Samehada can absorb chakra. A bijuu also shares chakra with its host, but does that mean a bijuu can absorb chakra? Hell a normal shinobi can transfer their chakra into another shinobi, does that mean they can absorb it as well? That gives no indication as to Kisame’s abilities, it only hints at a partnership between him and Samehada, nothing more.

    “The first fight with Kakashi, dodging Sasuke’s Chidori by grabbing him at the wrist behind the technique, fighting Kakashi again through a body of a sand ninja, versus Sasuke at the Uchiha shrine/temple/whatever it was. He doesn’t move a lot but when he does he moves at great speed.”

    Great, so you used everyone else in the comarison except Kisame. That still doesn’t prove that he is significantly faster than Kisame, or faster at all.

    “Like I debated before a few breakdowns ago. Kisame has Jincuuriki level chakra. Powerful? Yes, Bijuu powerful? Hehehe, no. I’m not going to debate about that again. I already destroyed Kisu during that, I hate to do the same to you.”

    Um… last I recalled a Jinchuuriki has their own chakra AND the chakra of a bijuu. So that means they have more chakra than a bijuu alone. So that point only hurt you more than helping you. Besides, you failed to see the point of my comment and that was Kisame had enough chakra to perform his techs without needing to absorb his opponent’s chakra.

    As for my comment about Tsukyomi, it still stands. You obviously didn’t read my counter either and besides, I wasn’t replying to you when I made my comment “I don’t know why people seem to believe that the Tsukyomi is unbreakable unless you are an Uchiha when the manga has already shown that that isn’t the case.”

    I have already proven, and shown evidence from the manga, that shows Tsukyomi can be broken by a non-uchiha. Show me your evidence, from the manga, that disputes it without question.

  199. @debate

    To be honest, I really need to say that some of you seriously need to calm down when debating others. Right now, all I see is far too much pride and not enough respect and humility.

    When Darks made a good comment against me, as he did with the explosive bunshins, I commended him on it because he deserved that recognition and after that, I tried to find a way to counter it, because that is what debating is about. It isn’t just about winning, you need to show respect for your opponent as well, because win or lose, this is still a game.

    If people are going to allow themselves to become upset or act in a way that is condescending towards others, then there really is no point of debating at all. If you can’t enjoy the game or treat other players with a shred of decency, then why are you debating in the first place?

    If winning is all that is important to some of you, to the point where it allows you to treat others poorly, then fine, you are welcome to your victory. I won’t be taking part in a debate with too many inflated egos. I hope your self proclaimed victory is worth that kind of behavior, but to me, it isn’t worth ruining friendships over.

  200. I concur, Tenrai. Not that I should talk, considering my first few debates…O_o

    Now let’s all shut up and drink something decidedly alcoholic!

  201. @Darks

    I can’t drink alcohol, but I do like cheesecake. @__@

  202. Cheesecake, eh? Well, luckily for you…

    *opens up deep freezer and looks inside*

    We got strawberry cheesecake, chocolate cheesecake, boysenberry, caramel, human limbs…take your pick. ^_^

  203. i want some cheesecake too…

  204. CHEESECAKEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  205. Oh… and just for the record…

    HAPPY 1 000 000 HITS WRA!!!!!!!!!! We’ve officially his the seven digit numbers!!!!

  206. *wakes up* did somebody say cheesecake I’ll take one of everything minus the human limbs. *receives the cake then disappears into a rift*

  207. WOOHOO!!!

    *takes out scouter*

    WRA is… OVER ONE MILLION!!!! *scouter breaks from too much awesomeness* +__+

    *takes some cheesecake* <__>

  208. “Kisame has already shown that he CAN effectively fight with no vision and he showed this in the battle against Bee.”

    No that was tracking an opponent without seeing him. Did he exchange punches with Bee? Did he fire a jutsu at Bee? Didn’t think so.

    “I already countered that comment earlier by someone else. For someone who likes to accuse others of not reading their posts, you seem to do the exact same.”

    Yeah, by saying Kisame will just keep his eyes closed. Good tactic. And you’re debating against me but ignoring my posts. That is what annoys me. And for your information I did read the other comment. I just repeated it for good measure.

    “You said exactly my point when you said “We don’t know whether or not Itachi could do that to.”
    Because Itachi never had to use it.

    “I gave an argument about how Kisame could stay out of range of Itachi’s Susanoo and use his shark missile jutsu to overcome it. Once again, you are not countering my comments at all.”

    Shark Missile is a jutsu. Itachi can copy it and fire it at Kisame’s. Stalemate.

    “I also already countered the genjutsu argument. Once with samehada as a means to break it, another with Kisame fighting with his eyes closed. If you want to counter me in a debate, try to counter those points, rather than just ignoring them.”

    So now I’m the one who’s ignoring comments. You’ve got nerve. I already commented why that won’t work. Not gonna repeat myself.

    “If Kisame can sense chakra, then why wouldn’t he know Itachi created a clone? He will immidiately notice more than one chakra level, in fact him being blind in this battle is more suitable than relying on his vision.”

    A reference to the speed of Itachi using jutsu.

    “Eh? Since when could susanoo use lightning? Please, if you are going to counter me, at least use an argument based on what you actually know what Itachi CAN do, as Darks showed me with the water jutsu.”

    “The mirror is considered one of the three sacred treasures and is endowed with all nature transformations, it can change its own characteristics depending on the characteristics of the attack it receives, making the technique ineffective.”
    Source; Narutopedia

    I’m not pulling things out of my ass.

    “Great, so you used everyone else in the comparison except Kisame. That still doesn’t prove that he is significantly faster than Kisame, or faster at all.”

    OK. Compare Kisame to the opponents he fought. Asuma was about the same, Guy and Bee are faster… Seeing as Itachi was the prodigy of the Uchiha I seriously doubt he’s slower than Kisame wielding the no doubt heavy Samehada.

    “Um… last I recalled a Jinchuuriki has their own chakra AND the chakra of a bijuu. So that means they have more chakra than a bijuu alone. So that point only hurt you more than helping you. Besides, you failed to see the point of my comment and that was Kisame had enough chakra to perform his techs without needing to absorb his opponent’s chakra.”

    I meant a Jinchuuriki that’s NOT using it’s Bijuu’s chakra’s. Re-read the debate between me and Kisu about it because I’m not going to type everything on here again.

    “As for my comment about Tsukyomi, it still stands. You obviously didn’t read my counter either and besides, I wasn’t replying to you when I made my comment “I don’t know why people seem to believe that the Tsukyomi is unbreakable unless you are an Uchiha when the manga has already shown that that isn’t the case.”

    I have already proven, and shown evidence from the manga, that shows Tsukyomi can be broken by a non-uchiha. Show me your evidence, from the manga, that disputes it without question.”

    Not gonna do it, already made an unbreakable comment about it earlier. If you don’t feel the need to read it, fine. I guess that means we’re done here.

    That respect you preach about works both ways.

  209. i’m gonna have to agree with redbaron here tenrai… i think u both are being rude to eachother, the only difference is that u say… we need respect on this blog, and then use sarcastic comments to put him down… i think the best thig would b for u both to take a chill pill, and remember, this blog is for fun, not for insulting… i think something key in all debates are red herrings… people tend to ignore comments that go against their position, and thats jsut a part of it… it is annoying to repeat comments occasionally but, u just have to deal with it… and just to repeat somehting Dark said tenrai.. i really feel that ur reaasoning for kisame breaking itachis genjutsu is all speculation… regular genjutsu is still powerful genjutsu…. or else, people that specialize in genjutsu and don’t have a sharingan like say kurenai… would be useless characters… Genjutsu are meant to trick opponents… and they work. mangekyou is just the highest level of genjutsu… thats all

  210. its like saying… hes only gonna b hit with a katon, so it wont affect him , amaterasu is the only ninjutsu that matters

  211. @everyone – that’s enough. Don’t wanna have to start moderating comments.

  212. thx dark… i think this debate needs some moderating lol… i’ll shut up as well

  213. before we close id just like to add one last thing >_> dont kill me >_>

    tsukyomni is breakable

    itachi’s tsukyomni is not breakable , in sasugay’s battle we all know he himself stopped it .itachi’s tsukyomni pwned ninja’s with sharingans there’s no way in hell kisame or samhahaha can break it . it only take a second for itachi’s version to do the damage because he can controll everything from space and time to mass .

    besides guy > kisame , kakashi = guy so kakashi > kisame and itachi > kakashi so itachi > kakashi 😉 [ a(n-1)+ d ahh wait >_>]
    sasugay’s version was maybe 1/1 X 10^99999999999999999 % of itachi’s version

  214. @omar

    Woah, how was I being rude? You really seem to have something against me, because I can never say anything without you lashing at me for it. And you are really jumping to conclusions by assuming that my comment was specifically directed at redbaron.

    Please show me where I was putting him down anyway. My comments were countering his, but I didn’t make him feel like an ass for debating, did I? Well, darks and I were nmade to feel stupid for debating for orochimaru, maybe go and read some of those comments and see what I mean. We were made to feel like idiots for trying to have fun and yet we still ended up winning. My comment from earlier was actually more in reference to how quickly people lose their cool in a debate and start getting angry or start to tell others off. Where did I get angry in my comment? Please show me where I lost my temper and turned a game into a war.

    @redbaron

    My reference to my comment about tsukyomi was that I was not replying to your comment when I was talking about tsukyomi. I was replying to someone else. I don’t actually read all the comments on the blog because I don’t actually have the time to, because I work all day. Now, if I was replying to your comment, and you felt you had adressed this issue, then please just quote the part you wanted me to read, because I can’t go comment searching through hundreds of comments just to find one. I don’t understand what is so difficult about that.

  215. To be honest, I always try to apologize at the end of a debate inb case I have been overly zealous during debating and I apologize in case I ever came across as harsh. Its not like I can’t admit that I have my faults and I am not afraid to say sorry for them. My comment was truly and honestly not intended to point fingers or to try to come across as arrogant.

    I don’t know why these accusations are suddenly being thrown my way, but you know what, fine. I guess winning a stupid debate is more than friendship after all. I mean, isn’t that what this blog is for? I was trying to prevent fighting, but sorry for trying. You know, I am having a really crappy time right now and I am really stressed, I don’t actually have time to come here and feel even crappier.

  216. @tenrai – there was, I think, a bit of a negative tone with your last few comments directed at redbaron. At least that’s what I picked up. Omar felt so too, thus he wrote what he wrote. Fair enough that you may not have meant it like that, but that’s how people have interpreted it. Which I think is why red posted what he did.

    @redbaron – however, I also think that your comments (both in this debate and the last one) have caused a few tempers to flare. I believe I commented on it during the last debate. Tenrai reacted to what he saw as an insulting comment, and I can’t say I blame him. If you were to read over your previous comments, red, do you think maybe you’d agree that you sometimes come off as a bit aggressive?

    @everyone – I think we all need to calm down a bit. We’re all reacting to each other and it’s making matters worse than they originally were. These debates are meant to be fun (at least, that’s what I participate in them for), and they still are, they’re just being spoilt by a few careless words. Let’s just work on it for next time.

    @Omar – tenrai does have a point lol. Next time if you have an issue with another blogger on WRA, please bring it up with an admin or editor first. We’ll sort it out:)

  217. @Darks

    I know my comments are harsh sometimes, which is why I try to apologize. But I never resort to insults and I never try to make people feel bad. That wasn’t the point of my comment.

  218. @tenrai

    I really didnt mean to b offensive with my comment, all i was trying to say was that we all need to respect each other. I felt that when u said “for some1 who says so and so, you do the opposite” sounded kind of insulting or like when redbaron says something like…uve got nerve. But i guess i didnt filter myself either. I mean honestly ur one of my favorite contributors to the debates here and u are good at taking the opposing view, the difficult view, which is commendable. I just think that, not just you, but a lot of people on this blog take debates really personally, and start saying things like “ur stupid if u think this” and thats when all the comments become bitter. manga is a form of entertainment and we should think about it that way. and i didnt know i could contact that admins before, but i will keep that in mind. I have nothing against anyone in this blog personally. i just happen to usually b on the side opposite to tenrai in the debates and i guesss sometimes the heat of the debate gets the best of me.

  219. *Takes deep breath.*

    @Omar

    I know that I am harsh sometimes and yes, I did feel that redbaron’s comment was becoming quite aggressive, which was why I responded the way I did, but I normally try not to get angry and I still never resort to insults, but once again I will say that my comment following my reply to redbaron was not actually directed at redbaron specifically. So no, I wasn’t trying to label redbaron or call him disrespectful and I have no idea why I was being targeted for that. If he chose to take a comment that was made in general, personally, then that is his choice, not mine. It is also your choice to share that view, based on a pure assumption.

    In fact, it wasn’t even redbaron’s comment that set of my comment in the first place, otherwise I would have just added that part in my reply to him in with regards to our actually debate. I know that people get heated in debates and I try not to take it personally. It was actually some other comments and, in a way, a cumulation of my feelings, that set off my comment.

    It’s not my fault if someone chooses to take it personally and it wasn’t right for you to jump onto that wagon and also assume that my comment was directed specifically at redbaron either.

    I know I am not perfect. People make sure I know it. They tell me more than often enough for me to know it, so yes, I make mistakes and I make stuff-ups. At least I can admit them and say sorry for those times when I am wrong. I just felt like you chose to look past what I had actually said without really considering it and yes, it does feel like you are targeting me, because I can’t see any basis for your earlier accusation.

    In any case, just ignore my current ramblings, because right now I am just upset and when I am upset, I tend to say things without thinking. Next time I will keep quiet about it, I am sorry for trying.

  220. @Omar – supers email is on the front page of WRA lol. Otherwise there’s Tenrai, Pickles, me and a few others that I don’t remember lol.

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