Naruto 499 Breakdown: When giant balls attack. You know things are gonna get hairy. Demotivational poster and official debate inclusive. Oh, we also get a bubblition contest! (Woohoo)

There comes that time in an animal’s life when the emotional outlay is just too much to hold in. A time when simple onomatopoeia just won’t cut it. When human language is the only way to effectively express—to substantially capture the moment with all manner of clarity…

Well said, Kyuubi...well said...

Never mind my incomplete sentences and let’s get on with this introduction!

Welcome, welcome, welcome one and all to this grand stage! ‘Tis your resident captain speaking, and we are just about ready to set off. There will be no detours, so you each get an empty Coke bottle just in case. And if it’s a #2…well, Super’s head could always use new fertilizer…>_>

Puberty: Such a confusing time...

Well, what can I say? If ‘epic’ decided to manifest itself in black and white, the result would quite possibly be chapter 499. You can tell by Naruto’s excitement, that this was certainly one hell of a chapter, and if you thought it was anything short, well I don’t know what manga you were reading.

From start to finish, each page was delivered so fluently, it was almost as if they were hand-picked by the manga gods themselves. I assure you, it was every bit as thrilling as I’m implying it is…which is a lot. Halfway through watching Naruto do his thing, I couldn’t help thinking “Whoa, I’d hate to be the fella that decides to steal this teenager’s iPod. Justin Beiber is just not worth the hurt. X__X”

Here's your iPod back! ;___;

It was that battle cry that really set things in motion, and it was all uphill from there.

And so began the beatdown of the century; and man, was Naruto relentless! What followed was a flurry of nonstop action with him flailing on the poor fox like Mike Tyson on a big, juicy ear. It was just one big slap after the other! So much for diplomacy. And after Naruto pushed that Rasenshuriken blast and shoved the Nine-tails out his face, I’m thinking “Damn, this dude is BEAST!”

Only one person can save the Kyuubi now…

She's evil, I tell you! X__X

Of course, no epic chapter would be complete without some delicious drama to boot, which came in form of some major ‘FTW (F*** the what?!!) moments’ accommodated in the last page to get our blood seriously pumping for the next chapter.

…And then you find out that there won’t be any next week…-____-

Sparkle sparkle *_*

But that’s okay (not really) , because we’re left with so many questions, these two weeks will hardly be enough to discuss them all. Unless, of course we all found ourselves in a building-size Hyperbolic Time Chamber. Or a parallel universe with a name that sounds something like ‘pressy piss’ that has much denser time and a chu-chu train that will eat your soul unless you have really pretty hair and can destroy truth and reason.

That makes no sense? I know, friend…I know…

Mmmm, dinner never sounded quite so tasty. X__X

Besides the fighting (more like a steamy serving of extra hot rape sauce), the real points of interest were mostly in just two pages, those being the 13th page and the very last one,  both making you go “Uuuuuh, shiiinyyyy @__@” and “OMGWTF?!!” respectively, so each contained content that I’m sure left some of us on the same page for a good while.

Looking at them both, I can’t help thinking they’re connected somehow; again, more speculation that Kishi has forced upon us, but I’m not complaining. It’s always good to keep readers guessing, but not for too long; unless you never wanna see your family again. >_>

So anyhow let’s take it from the top then, shall we?

Sticks and stones, Kyuubi...sticks and stones...X__X

It was such a freakin’ cool spread, I could barely contain myself! It’s like friggin’ Super Saiyan over 9000!! ;___;

Naturally, the most prominent feature of the entire page is that telltale symbol around Naruto’s neck, which has now become the subject of a lot of theorizing lately, and for good reason, too.

The first thought that comes to mind (for me, at least) is Madara’s words to Naruto while they were getting busy over at the hotel. Wait, not like THAT! X__X

“The younger was born with the Sage’s ‘body’ and was gifted with his life force and physical energy.” (Madara – One Manga)

I suddenly becomes apparent that we are slowly beginning to see this establish itself in this young Senju; that or Naruto is finally becoming one with the force. Either way, he’s looking pretty badass if you ask me. But the question is: why after the Kyuubi is absorbed?

Some just need it more than others...

And that makes for just one of the questions raised from that one page. One thing is for certain, though, and that is that this happening is far from conventional. We’ve seen that from when Bee has one of his frequent chats with his Bijuu. No gates. No locks. No bounds. This is possibly what Naruto had on his mind when he told the Kyuubi to “wait…just wait.”

Could it be as a result of the combination of Naruto’s heritage and the fact that it was the same Rikudou Sennin who split the Juubi that this strangeness is brought about? Your guess is as good as mine. That means it’s not very good at all.

And remember when Naruto activated this new seal, the Kyuubi recognized it immediately as that of The Sage of the Six Paths. Clearly, this hints to a precedent relationship between the two. You know, kind of like with Kushina, which we’ll be getting to in just a moment. The Kyuubi couldn’t possibly have been referring to Naruto’s Super Saiyan mode since he had obviously seen it long before he made that comment.

So the question is: how the heaven do the two know each other?

At first I’m thinking they naturally would meet each other’s acquaintances when the Juubi was split. But then I realized that didn’t involve any of the Sage’s seals. Besides, that would make for one miiighty awkward conversation. So I made up a few suggestions of my own…>_>

The Nine-tails = The Sage of the Six Paths! You heard it from me first! >_>

Well, whatever be the case, Naruto now officially has control of his Bijuu, which obviously opens up the floodgates to an entirely new bevy of ways Naruto can met out the PAIN. Still, with the introduction of this new ability, there are a few old ones that may be revisited for a little brush-up.

Pa just left a present on Naruto's shoulder. I hope he likes.

There’s also that issue I’ve noticed in the comments about chakra control and how Naruto should be able to form a Rasengan on one hand by now. I think that’s true, but I honestly don’t see any of these happening in the future (near or far). I think Naruto’s unorthodox methods give him that measure of uniqueness and peculiarity that one would expect (or like to see) in a protagonist. I’m actually hoping none of that changes.

But whether or not that’s how it’s gonna be, only time will tell…

Aaanyhow…on to the next one…

Things we do for coupons...X__X

Kishina was the previous Nine-tails Jinchuuriki! Naruto’s mother once played host to the Kyuubi!!

*waits for everyone to finish gasping* *Kisuzachi’s gasping is because of a heart attack he is suffering but no one notices because it blends so well with the others* *he dies* Tragic…

…Anyhow, so OMG! This is such a shocker! And I’m not being sarcastic. So many questions, so little answers!

I think a very crucial piece of information with regards this revelation is the period of time in which Kushina served as a host since it will determine a whole bunch of things.

Did Madara have control of Kushina? Did Kushina attack Konoha (wittingly or not)? Was she the first to give birth to a Jinchuuriki? Is this why her chakra is so special? Did she somehow have her Bijuu extracted without paying the ultimate price? Was she ever a leather-clad dominatrix with a giant power whip?! Am I now stating crazy, masochistic male fantasies?!! AAAAHH!!! X__X

There’s so much to talk about, I don’t even know where to begin, so I won’t even bother and I’ll let you guys do all the visualizing. But remember ye this. With this latest unveiling, only one thing is for certain…

Nothing is true, everything is permitted.

BUBBLITION CONTEST

Here’s your material for the week! Make it count.

Insert possible caption here

Ah, so many thoughts and songs come to mind.

OFFICIAL DEBATE

Here it is! I thought it would be fun enough.

Mr Bones vs. Mr Blood

No illnesses. No holds barred. No screaming fangirls.

________________

And this here is your poster!

Peace!

__________________________________________________

Just waiting till the shine wears off.

Fix

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~ by Captain Pickles on June 19, 2010.

312 Responses to “Naruto 499 Breakdown: When giant balls attack. You know things are gonna get hairy. Demotivational poster and official debate inclusive. Oh, we also get a bubblition contest! (Woohoo)”

  1. I dont usually enjoy the naruto breakdowns as much as the other stuff on the site but I must say:

    Kudos to Captain Pickles. This breakdown was made of pure awesomeness and made me ROFL on a lot of parts. I really enjoyed it. Good job on it : D

    Naruto surely did leave on a nice cliffhanger. Man its gonna be a long wait.

  2. hmm my vote is for zabuza, has more experience and keep skella dude at a distant with his long head chopper!

  3. and gret breakd down 😀

  4. Lol epic brekdown

  5. True Minato! (that means I’m the real 4th, muwhahahaa

  6. Also, EPIC chapter! Great breakdown!

    BUBBLITION:

    Kyuubi: OSCURAS CEROOOOoooooo!

    CAPTION: It’s bad enough when Kubo steals ideas from Kishi…

  7. Great job Pickles! The chapter was pure awesomeness! Cant help but feel sorry for the Kyubi though :(…..but it was fun watching him get a free Rasengan light show 😀

    Debate: hmm. We’ve never seen Kimimaro’s full power because he was sick, so technically, we’d HAVE to think he was sick and dying, just that he wont die from it in THIS battle. I’m on the fence for this debate as well since there are two of my favorite characters 🙂

  8. I pity the fool who tries to fertilize my head! (Someone saw the A-Team) >_>

    Great job Pickles! 🙂

    @Anyone: I think the reason why the Kyubi recognizes the seal Naruto is using on him is because it’s the same jutsu the Rikudou Sennin used on the Juubi’s body (now trapped inside the moon).

    http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/467/15-16/

    Since the Kyubi is part of the Juubi it may share some kind of connection with it even after being separated and therefore may be familiar with the jutsu.

    Since Sasuke is also a descendant of the Rikudou Sennin I wonder if he’ll get a cool looking Sage of the Six Paths necklace.

    The debate…meh… I give it to Kimimaro but I don’t feel like debating the points.

    @Prawl: LMAO! XD

  9. *revives somehow from heart attack*

    Ok, when I made that first comment I only got to read the first three paragraphs, but now that I’ve read the complete thing: SUPER SPECIAL AWESOME BREAKDOWN!

    I say the reason Kyubi said “The Sage of Six Paths'” is because he recognizes it as the jutsu the Sage used to seal the Jubi all those years ago. Darn you superdude!

    @Debate, I think this’ll all come down to experience, so I give the win to Zabuza. Plus, whereas Gaara had to crush Kimimaro, Zabuza could just drown him (sorry Kimimaro T^T)

  10. good job muahahahaha

  11. AWESOME breakdown Pickles!!!

    If the Kyuubi knows about the Rikudo sage and his seal, then wouldn’t that mean the Hachibi knows something too? Maybe a bit less than the Kyuubi, but it probably knows something.
    I hope Bee and Naruto have a talk with their Bijuus and ask them what they know about the Rikudo Sage.

    @Debate: I think Kimimaro will win. He’s not sick so he won’t die one second before killing Zabuza and his tecniques are very strong. He might need to activate his curse seal and if he does I think he’ll kill Zabuza. His Kekkei Genkai can make his bones harder than steel so blades won’t work on him. http://naruto.wikia.com/wiki/Shikotsumyaku

    I don’t think Zabuza can survive this jutsu: http://naruto.wikia.com/wiki/Dance_of_the_Seedling_Fern

  12. AWESOME BREAKDOWN for an AWESOME CHAPTER! “Rikudo” Naruto is pure awesomeness!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    I think that the fox mentioned the Sage of the Six Paths because, since he was a part of the juubi, remembers how the Sage sealed the 10 tailed beast. What i’m wondering about is why naruto told the fox to wait. I don’t think it’s because he wants to become friends with it…i think that when the time comes (probably against madara) he’s going to release it again.

    i think Kimimaro would win.
    1) he’s a better taijutsu user then Zabuza: using his bones he can block the sword and then strike back.
    http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/211/18/
    as we saw, he took out hundreds of clones easily. so if zabuza just charges at him, kimimaro would use one of his dances and kill him.

    2)even if zabuza tried to silently kill him, kimimaro could just protect himself with his bones. can kimimaro even be injured? as we see here, his flesh is ripped off but he’s still alive because he creates bone masks.
    http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/215/12/
    http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/215/13/
    even in this page, we can see him survive thanks to his bone structure:
    http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/216/03/

    3)if zabuza somehow manages to trap him in the water prison (highly unlikely since Kimimaro seems faster and more aware of his surroundings), kimimaro can manipulate his bone structure to either stab zabuza or just shoot him using his drilling finger bullets. http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/213/05/

    4)dance of the seedling fern is a sure kill unless zabuza can fly http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/217/08/
    http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/217/10/

  13. ROFLMAO!!!!

    *Breathes* Pickles, I love your breakdowns.

    Lol and the Beaver kid is worth nothing but stab and kill.

    Well the Kyuubi is the biggest part of The Sage of the Six Paths,so that maybe explains his new cool accessories.
    The Nine-tails inherits it all, sucks for you other tails.

  14. Good breakdown two thumbs up!

    BUBBLITION : LEROY JENKINS!!

  15. BUBBLITION : EAT THIS HAIRBALL-RASENGAN BRAT!!

  16. I have a new theory for all of this:

    Madara had perfected some reverse sealing ninjutsu that pulled the Kyubi out of Kushina after giving birth, which in turn killed her, and he had full control of the Kyubi. Now, that’s why Minato was able to seal the fox into Naruto, because he had just been born, and the fox ran rampant due to Madara being a pissworm.

    Bubblition

    Naruto: More FU**ING Eclipse references. Good job, Kishi, I officially hate your guts

  17. Pickles wrote the breakdown? OMG that was so funny and GREATLY worded man 😀

  18. I have one question…. why does everyone assume that Kushina died while giving birth to Naruto? I mean, can’t she die 2 weeks after? You just want her dead as fast as possible dont you?? You Kushina haters >_<

  19. I think that zabuza Would beat Kimimaro, because Zabuza went up against a jounin and lost. Kimimaro looked really tough because he went up against to genin. If he had gone up against kakashi i think he would have lost as well. Zabuza was one of the 7 swordsmen of the mist. They were an elite group of ninja skilled with the sword. Zabuza killed all of the genin in his graduating class. Kimimaro did not use any other forms of justu beside taijutsu. Zabuza was skilled enough to take on kakashi who is a jounin. 2 of the other members of the 7 swordsmen of the mist hold high postions. I cant think of his name but he is the body guard of the mizukage. He was chosen to guard the mizukage at what could have been the most dangerous meeting out there. The other known member is kisamane he is one of the last members of akatsuki, and considering how fast they are dropping thats no easy feat. Zabuza must have been close to the same power level as the other members. Kimimaro looked a lot stronger because he fought two genins. Dont forget that naruto beat gaara, but naruto couldn’t come close to matching kakashi in a battle at the time. In my opinion Zabuza wins.
    If zabuza had been a introduced in a recent arc instead of being the first villain do you think that he would have had unnecessarily large justus.

  20. caption
    What did the fox say when he got to the ball. He choked.

  21. Another great breakdown. Well done.

    I won’t be saying much right now, because my thoughts are all muddle up and I am having a bit of a moment, so all I will say is that I hope everyone is doing well and I hope the next chapter is awesome.

    My mind is poofy… T__T

  22. Heh. I don’t want Kushina dead that quickly. I just figure since everyone says she died after giving birth, and that a flashback in the first episode(?) showed that she died after giving birth…I’m just sayin’

  23. Anybody else make the connection that after Kyuubi’s chakra was absorbed, he becomes anorexic just like Nagato did?

    Does this mean Nagato used up a TON OF PHYSICAL STAMINA STUFF?

    By the way, Naruto doesn’t have control of his bijuu, which I’m glad Kishimoto was quick to point out.

    Kyuubi still has his own will. And his hatred. It’s just that now Naruto has taken away Kyuubi’s chakra – his raw power. And because of that Kyuubi will have more time to sit and think and rest without the corruption of power at his side.

    NO TRUTHS? EVERYTHING PERMITTED??

    Kushina=Kakashi (this could be true)
    Danzou=Gaara (In a way, this might be true)
    Jiraiya=Obito (actually, in a way, this is true)
    Naruto=Sasuke (this is what we all assume)

    DON’T TAKE IT AT FACE VALUE?

    Anyways. I vote Kimimaro because Kimi can do all this bone stuff. I doubt Zabuza would be able to cut through the bones, not to mention new generation is supposed to be better than old generation. Zabuza has going for him that Naruto and Lee were, we can safely assume, not as strong as Kakashi and Zabuza as they could not beat them when they were younger.

    Because of this, and seeing as the adults were a bit more powerful than Gaara, Lee, and Naruto (at least a little) at the time, and Kimimaro was stronger than them, then Kimimaro would probably, without his disease, at least be on par with Zabuza.

    BUT. Zabuza has Haku. By the way. If Naruto can form one-handed rasengans, he’s probably going to start using three clones in order to put WATER into the EQUATION to steal HAKU’S ICE TECHNIQUE.

    Then he might end up using the ice mirrors or some shizz.

  24. BUBBLITION:

    Kyuubi: DR. OCTAGONAPUS…BLAAAAAAAAAHHH!

    CAPTION:
    The lazer collection strikes again!

  25. bubblition: *hawk* *spit* takes this Emo spitball of DOOM!!
    Caption: Kyuubi’s last resort.

  26. Bubblition:

    Kyuubi: WHO NEEDS CHAKRA WHEN I HAVE MY BIG BLACK FUZZY BAAALLLLSSS???!!!!

    Caption: Big black fuzzy balls. Better than chakra

  27. Black Hole Sun, Wont you come? Wont you come….and blow the F*** outta Ya!

  28. i dont even feel it being close, kimimaro is so much stronger, he fought genin,but they weren’t normal genin. remember… he was at the center of orochimarus plan… i dont think kakashi would be able to beat gaara that quickly…

  29. *sigh* I like both characters but I didnt bother going into too much detail above because I figured Kimimaro’s bones could become harder than Zabuza’s sword and that Zabuza’s mist would severely weaken Kimimaro’s accuracy…..I didnt think that would be worth stating cuz its so obvious lol. That’s why I said Zabuza could just drown Kimimaro. Kimimaro’s Seedling Fern can also be dodged because no sane ninja would stay on the ground if it was shaking so fiercely.

    But I think if Kimimaro WASNT sick, he’d be Akatsuki level. Not just because he died at the end, but because during his entire fight he was on his deathbed, imagine how much stronger a fully healthy Kimimaro would be. That’s where the problem arises with this debate…we DONT know how strong he is when he wasnt sick, so we have to assume its the sick Kimimaro

  30. KISU!

    I watched the Naruto 165: BANSHO TEN’NIN IS UNIVERSAL PULL! XD You were SO close…Universal Attraction, lmao

  31. I bet Kimi was a frikkin beast healthy

  32. great as usual, pickles! and let me say here at the beginning, this chapter was THE most epic of naruto so far!!! ^_^

    kyuubi cursing naruto and kushina was really funny….lol i think kyuubi needs a shrink right now 😀 …..that necklace means that naruto……**solemn music plays***……is REALLY into jewellery and shit, huh O_o

    i’d like to see sasuke’s face when he’s confronted by this necklace-wearing being of awesomeness…..naruto sure has come a long way from being pitied by the kyuubi 😀

    now all he needs is kushina’s hairclip to be super-badass O_O

    and i think half of kushina’s chakra was sealed into naruto, who was inside her at the time…whatever that means @_@

    @debate, i’ll go with kimimaro…no illnesses makes kimimaro beast >_>

  33. sorry for the double post, but i forgot:

    CAPTION: Sage-Kyuubi Volleyball. The ultimate badass sport.

  34. Thanks Super. 😀

    And I think that Kimimaro was probably around Sasuke’s level when he was healthy (the older Sasuke that could take down Juugo), because if you remember, Juugo looked to Kimimaro for support and strength, did he not?

  35. BUBBLITION: Say everyone have you seen my balls?

    CAPTION: They’re big and salty and brown.

  36. hey Pickles, I’ve been reading WRA breakdowns every week and finally decided to post; you are pure epic lol seriously! Keep it up~

    BUBBLITION: NOMNOMNOMNOM
    CAPTION: Wait a minute. I thought only rabbits ate their own poo ..but foxes too?

  37. BBBLITION: Now when you have all the blings and are gangsta like me…. wanna play some dodgeball?

    CAPTION: Dodgeball, Gangstah Sages Only.

  38. @truepain: Very true. The kyuubi reckoned naruto used the seal by the rikudou sennin to seal it. He was also able to use that seal because he has become a “partial” rikudou sennin as he has attained almost a perfect body from absorbing the kyuubi’s chakra.

    What might be a little bit wrong on what you said on why he told the kyuubi to wait, was not beause he planned to release it against madara. From the way the frog with the seal explained it, that seal was there to ensure naruto could extract the kyuubi’s chakra/will from it’s body, thereby giving naruto control over the kyuubi, as the kyuubi becomes subservient to whomever extract’s it’s will. The seal used by naruto would also enable him to fully release the kyuubi if he wants, with the kyuubi now subservient to him. With naruto sucessfully extracting the will of the kyuubi the kyuubi has no choice bbut to be controlled by naruto. Actually what naruto meant by saying ‘wait’ was that he was going to make good use of the kyuubi. possibly even change the kyuubi. He meant that through their potential partnership they would enjoy a positive relationship for a good cause. That’s exactly why he stressed he won’t harm the kyuubi, but rather it should wait.

  39. Alright, now to add my two cents to the debate between Zabuza and Kimimaru.

    In this case, I have to go with Kimimaru winning for a few reasons. The first is his ability to resist damage. Let’s face it, when he fought Gaara, he was able to withstand incredible amounts of pressure from his sand by creating a hardened layer of bone just underneath his skin to stop himself from being crushed. He was even able to withstand the pressure of a few thousand tons of earth on top of him compounded by Gaara’s desert funeral.

    I doubt Zabuza could put as much pressure (A few thousand tons worth) into a swing of his blade, even as heavy as it is, so I just don’t see it causing any damage to Kimimaru with his armor being as strong as it is. With his blade ineffective, that is half of his offensive capability lost, if his reliance on that weapon in the manga is anything to go by.

    I doubt his water jutsu would cause any damage either, because, much like Gaara’s sand, water relies on blunt force trauma to cause damage and we know that Kimimaru is very effective at resisting that kind of physical damage. If Zabuza had a lightning or fire affinity, or even wind (which has more penetration and cutting power as apposed to blunt trauma) then I think he would do much better, but with the skills he does have, I just don’t see it going far.

    It’s just a case of Zabuza fighting the wrong opponent for his abilities to be effective, more than his actual skill or experience.

    Kimimaru’s agility would also play a large role in the battle, not to mention he has a good mix of short and long range attacks of significantly varying power. I just see him winning this one based on those factors.

  40. @koaru

    I know I am not Pickles, but welcome to WRA. I hope we see more posts from you as time passes. It is always good to have new minds sharing their thoughts and ideas with us and maybe a laugh as well.

  41. @CP: LMAO… Awesomest breakdown!!! You could really write funny…

    It’s sad that the Kyuubi won’t be cooperating though. It might be of help in dispelling genjutsu just like Bee’s.

  42. @Totalitarian:

    “He was also able to use that seal because he has become a “partial” rikudou sennin as he has attained almost a perfect body from absorbing the kyuubi’s chakra.” (TotalitarianHypnosis)

    Ja, I agree. I have a question though, to anybody really. Since Naruto was able to use the Rikudou Sennin’s seal wouldn’t Sasuke have the same access to it when he…reaches the epitome of his eye powers?

    http://read.mangashare.com/Naruto/chapter-462/page012.html

    It looks like to me they’re both descendants from the Sage of Six Paths, carrying his same diluted blood through the generations, so ultimately they both should be able to use that seal. Access to that seal when they reach perfect body and eyes of course. Naruto got his perfect body and now I believe Sasuke has his perfect eyes. Sounds like I’m hitting on these two guys…>_>

  43. Epic breakdown pickles. An epic naruto chapter as well. To bad we have to wait 2 weeks before the next chapter. T__T

  44. Bubbleton:

    YES THAT’S RIGHT! I’M ADDICTED TO OREOS AS WELL!!!! <_<

  45. @supertrek: Yes, i see the same thing. Actually sasuke’s already had that potential. The kyuubi confirmed it, and madara has him under his wings to study that development. Actually from sasuke’s battle with the raikage, the “thing” behind him was a manifestation of sasuke’s spiritual energy, and not a bijuu as many implied, which wa enveloped in hate as the story of the first son goes. Madara can now see for himself that sasuke has even more hatred than he himself and wants to completely verify it by putting sasuke in more battles. So obviously, as the legend goes, sasuke is enndowed with powerful eyes and immense spiritual energy. Those eyes do not necessarily have to be the rinnegan, but the power sasuke’s eyes possess is foretold by the myth itself, and the power naruto’s body now possesses is also, i believe, a manifestation iof the myth too. Sasuke may not have the rinnegan, but might possess techniques used even by the first son.

    However, from the way the myth goes, the second son was blessed by the sage, which is why hashirama prevailed over madara, which is why naruto will also prevail over sasuke. The thing is naruto has inherited the will of the second son very strongly, even more than hashirama, as sasuke inherited that of the first. The thing with naruto however, is that he is bound to achieve what the second son and hashirama could not achieve- changing sasuke. This is because of the destiny that follows naruto, and obviously when naruto joins powers with sasuke as sasuke would join with naruto against madara we will then see revenge unite with love- ying yang. Dont forget, madara was behind the massacre of the uchiha clan, and was also behind the massacre of the uzumaki clan, so there is a good reason to unite against madara, but more importantly to stop him.

    I have to say, good story by kishi afterall.

  46. Great breakdown Capt. like naruto u surpass yourself every week.

    About the rikudo sannin being Naruto and to what the fox replied, I am on the same page as Totalitarian.

    But I have one question to u Super, if Naruto has indeed achieved the perfect body, doesn’t Sasuke have to achieve the rinnegan in order to have the perfect eyes, cause even if it sounds stupid from the very first time we’ve heard it, the byakugan is supposed to be stronger and a more purer form of the rinnegan than the sharingan, I know that’s a load of crap seeing as byakugan can only give u xray vision and 360 degree vision.
    While sharingan can help u copy ninjutsu and genjutsu, it can slow down time and also unlock a shit load of unbeatable jutsu.

    Then wouldn’t it be common sense to think that the level after the EMS will be the byakugan. It’s crap I know, but all we were informed from the start points to this Sharingan<Byakugan<Rinnegan.

    Now I know vegeta jumped from SSJ2 to SSJ4 and skip'ed SSJ3 so it can be said that u can jump from sharingan to rinnegan, but what I don't get is, why did people say that the byakugan is stronger then sharingan when it clearly isn't.

    Anyway I also spotted something that I believe Tenrai said a few posts up, and it was about Naruto forming the rassengan whit one hand and the point u tried to make was he doesn't need to do that any more because he's so skilled whit shadow clones now that it's almost his trade mark now.

    I say he dose need to use it whit one hand and that it was the fox's chakra that interfered with him not being able to do it in the first place.

    Recently I've started reviewing the Naruto anime before the skip ,and we clearly see him at the valley of the end before the final clash with sasuke forming "easily I might add" a one handed rasengan while he had the fox cloak on.

    So that means that without the disturbance of keeping the fox a bay and now fully embracing it's power, Naruto can finally do the shape manipulation easily on his own.

    Keep in mind how crowded it gets when he forms the FRS, wouldn't that be easier to do whit no clones or at most just one.

    What i'me most eager to see is how will Naruto extend the sage mode, I really am opposed the whole Ma & Pa frogs on Naruto's shoulders and I'me hoping he can do it with the help of the fox.

    While he moves the fox can gather almost indefinitely natural energy because it doesn't move at all.

  47. @supertrek: about the seal, if you’re generally implying sasuke should be able to tap into an equivalent degree of power from attaining perfect eyes then i agree with you. Obviously sasuke is a descendant of the first son, so he inherits the will of the first. However if you talk specifically of the seal then there’s no way of reckoning sasuke should be able to use the same seal naruto used. I don’t reckon sasuke possessing powerful eyes in accordance with the legend is a basis for him using exactly the same seal used by naruto. There just might be other techniques yet to be seen.

  48. @Eugen: Like Totalitarian said, being blessed with the Sage’s “eyes” doesn’t necessarily mean having the Rinnengan. Look at the link and see how it describes the “eyes”.

    http://read.mangashare.com/Naruto/chapter-462/page012.html

    It’s the strength of chakra and spiritual energy. It’s more of an attribute devised from being a descendant of the 1st son, rather than a certain required doujutsu. If you look at the picture the 1st son didn’t even have the pure Rinnengan but a mutated version of it.

    As for the Byakugan being stronger than the Sharingan, I don’t know who claims that but as I understand it the Sharingan only derives from the Byakugan. That doesn’t really make it stronger. Mutations are usually stronger than their origins because they’re made to adapt and take on new challenges.

  49. @ super, this was the part I was reffering to:

    http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/78/13/

  50. @Eugen: Hmmm… I understand the origins of the Sharingan lie with the Byakugan but that doesn’t necessarily mean Kakashi was saying it’s stronger. He was commenting on how in dealing with “insight” the Byakugan surpasses the Sharinagan and I agree.

  51. Hmmm…now that I look at it over and over again maybe Kakakshi meant the Byakugan and Sharingan have the same history together. Both coming from the same source (Rinnengan). Their history lies together.

    Just a thought.

  52. I wonder what would happen if an hyuga and a Uchiha had an offspring. Would there child have the Rinnigan? O_o

  53. Maybe they will have both Byakugan and Sharingan O_o you know, one eye is Byakugan and the other is Sharingan. But I dont think they will have Rinnegan.

  54. @Sharingan vs Byuakugan

    If you read a little further, on this page in particular, you see more examples of how the Byuakugan surpasses the Sharingan in terms of insight.

    http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/79/17/

    But I think with the Byuakugan, it is more about the perception of chakra, although the ability to see for great distances around yourself is great as well.

    Being able to see through solid objects, as well as detecting chakra points on a level that even the sharingan cannot match and the ability to see over great distances in a 360 degree arch is pretty much the ultimate form of perception. Where the Sharingan trumps the Byuakugan is in the ability to read and copy an opponent’s moves perfectly as well as the ability to cast genjutsu and other more powerful techs with the evolved MS.

    So to me, it almost seems like the Sharingan is a mutation of the Byuakugan which lost some of its broader perceptive abilities in a trade off for other unique and deadly powers. I guess you can’t have everything. You have to play fair after all. *Cough…* <_<

    I mean, if the MS can cast Amatarasu on the location that the caster looks upon, imagine being able to look through a solid wall at an opponent on the other side who cannot see you and burning him to a crisp through whatever defense he might try to conjure. Byuakugan + Sharingan powers combined = overkill.

    Then again, who knows what the EMS grants its user? If that is indeed the perfect form of the Sharingan, we may see a lot more with regards to what it can actually do, perhaps even above the normal MS.

    Only time will tell.

  55. @Superdude, I doubt Kakashi meant that. Remember he didnt even believe in the Rinnegan until Pain threw a nail threw his head.

  56. @kisuzachi

    Actually, I believe that nail was nailed by Kamui. lol!

    And even after that battle, Kakashi claimed that Nagato’s Rinnegan was nothing more than a mutation when Madara tried to feed them the story of the Sage of the Six Paths.

    So I guess even then, he still had his doubts as to whether it was real…

  57. @Kisu: Aye, my paragraph may have been a little confusing. @_@ I wasn’t implying Kakashi knew about the Rinnengan back then. I was saying maybe Kakashi was telling us the Byakugan and Sharingan shared a similar source of history together

    “The Uchiha Clan’s origin lies with the Hyuga Clan”.

    Not that he knew the source was the Rinnengan. I put “Rinnengan” in parentheses just to name that certain source Kakashi may have been referencing, though unbeknownst to himself but evident to us.

    Though, of course this is just an unlikely thought and most likely Kakashi was simply stating the Sharigan derives from the Byakugan. 😉

    On a side note we should remember Kakashi doesn’t even seem sure himself of this information. He starts off as, “They say…”

  58. @eugene: I abbsolutely love your take on naruto traning the fox to gather natural energy. I’m looking forward to that too.

  59. Oh, and it seems people are already forgeting that naruto was in sage mode with samehada on killerbee. That means, potentially, naruto should have been able to sense kisame’s presence in samehada. Does that mean kisame get’s to be the first recipient of naruto’s new found might? If that is, kisame would be rueing the day he was asked to go bijuu hunting.

  60. Bubble;
    REVENGE DEATH BA..
    ..uhh.. I mean..
    HAPPY THOUGHTS BALL!!!

    Caption
    Yeah, right… How dumb do I look. >__>

  61. @holymandy: I think you are wrong when you say naruto does not have control of the kyuubi. Actually he does. From the way the frog with the seal put it, naruto could only control the kyuubi if he extinguished the hatred from his heart and filtered the kyuubi’s chakra from it’s mind and turned the filtered chakra to his, which is exactly what he has done. Doing exactly this has given naruto control over the kyuubi’s power, and about the kyuubi’s hate you insist still remains, yes you’re right but with time and with constant training the kyuubi would learn to work with naruto and like him like hachibi has with killerbee. In fact that exactly what naruto meant when he told the kyuubi to wait.

    onemanga.com/naruto/490/11.

  62. actually let me put it this way, and here’s a good one. The kyuubi would be a big challeng for naruto as changing the kyuubi, which would be a huge task, would help him change sasuke. Obviously, to fight sasuke, naruto would have to work closely with the kyuubi like hachibi does with killerbee.

  63. Bubblition:

    Kyuubi: Prepare for my BIG BANG……..like ATTACK!

    Caption: Its not copyrighting if you put like in the middle.

  64. What if the sharigan really did come from the Byakugan. The Hyuga clan might have been the original descendents, and the shaigan might be a mutation caused by the blood line being contamainated. It even says “Even as time passed and the bloodline faded”. I take this to mean that the Uchiha are the result of the Hyuga not keeping there bloodline pure. Didnt it say some where that the Hyuga were only allowed to marry another Hyuga or some thing. My guess is that there was a split in the Hyuga family (tends to happen when dealing with emo people). One side of the family kept the blood line pure. The Uchiha side could have been the result of the mixture between the Hyuga and uzamaci side (i know i destroyed that last name). The uchiha can make the kyubi do what they want because of there eyes, and didnt they say that the Uzamaci charka excelled at Taming the tailed beast.
    http://read.mangashare.com/Naruto/chapter-462/page013.html

  65. Bubbleton:

    How about YOU fetch this time?!?!?

  66. @Totalitarian. That hatred is Kyuubi’s essence basically, and if that essence changes from hatred to love, he will still end up having his own will, but it’ll just be drawn to a different affinity, na?

    I have more I’d love to say, but I can’t totally put it into words, which sucks. I might be just tired.

    Kyuubi’s chakra is his stamina and power, not his will. If Naruto filters the hatred out of the chakra, it doesn’t just disappear, because it still belongs to Kyuubi, doesn’t it?

  67. @holydemonandy: True, the kyuubi has it’s own will…but let me try demystifying it this way. This is never going to happen, but say you and your mother are family. You personally, even without your mother, feel positive and fulfilled because of that great personality of yours. But then, mentally for you, your mother coming into the picture makes the equation complete for you, hence making you feel complete as a human being. If i took your mum from you, something would be missing. I could ask you to do whatever i wanted just to ensure your mum was safe. Given you had your will, you could choose to refuse my offer, but from your mental viewpoint you’ll be forced to accept my proposition because you feel you’ll lose a “part” of you if you did not comply. The mere fact i’m able to get you to act against your will means i have control over you at the time because i have a trump card- a part of you you don’t want to lose.

    That’s how it is with naruto and the kyuubi, except naruto does not control the kyuubi from blackmail like that, but because he accepts the fact he is the jinchuuriki host, does not want to run from that, and needs the powers of the kyuubi to fight sasuke.

  68. I have a theory by the way. It seems naruto was able to create a lot of clones with sage chakra whilst fighting against the kyuubi because the kyuubi was not interfering. The mere fact naruto faces limitations like three sage clones max, needing two clones to make a rasengan and the 5 min time cap for sage mode is all because of the kyuubi’s chakra interferance. When fighting against the kyuubi the kyuubi was not interfering in anyway, giving naruto the ability to mould chakra properly and hence create more than 3 sage clones. Also, with naruto having control over the kyuubi’s powers he would be able to control his chakra better, making him last longer in sage mode(exceed the 5 min time limit). Because the kyuubi’s chakra is also not interfering he would also be able to mould the rasengan with a hand. He should even be able to fuse with the kyuubi in sage mode which would be hell. Should be interesting.

  69. “The mere fact naruto faces limitations like three sage clones max”

    Well that’s indirectly the Kyubi’s fault. Its because the Kyubi prevents Ma and Pa from fusing with Naruto (THANK GOD! IT looks hideous when they fuse) so Naruto has to leave two clones to gather nature chakra and creating more than a few clones would disrupt the chakra of the two clones gathering Sage Chakra and they’d poof away.

  70. Anyhoo, Sage Mode is totally useless now that Naruto has the Kyubi….err the Kyubi’s chakra under his control.

    Frog Katas- Chakra Arms, they go farther and are stronger
    Sage Chakra- Kyubi Chakra, living chakra and way more destructive than Sage Chakra
    Sage Healing- Kyubi healing, its a hell of a lot faster
    Sage Speed and Strength- Chakra cloak, with so much offense, a little defense is called for instead of more power, plus the chakra armor is also toxic
    Sage Sensing- Kyubi-enhanced senses, you decide which is better.

  71. Kisu if u think about what Total said you come to the conclusion that all those point u made for sage vs kyuubi can be fused and make Naruto almost invincible.

    Think about it, twice the speed and power, twice the healing power, and an ability to sense someone at a hell of a long range, he’ll be like a byakugan user, only instead of the eyesight he’ll use nature to detect people he need’s to find.

    Back too you Total, and actually anyone that has any thoughts on the matter.
    When Naruto fought the kyuubi he was in his own mind, do all the tech that he used inside his mind reflect the ones he can do normally, or is the mind a place were u can extend your own power via willpower.
    Anyway Naruto had his mind set on prolonging the sage mode until he was reverse summoned by Pa, but just as Total said and with my theory in mind I think Naruto will achieve a very long period of time in with he can stay in sannin mode with the help of the kyuubi, that is if the fox decides to help out at least.

    Only thing is, and I’me not sure this is right, will Naruto have to balance 3 chakras in his belly now:

    – his own chakra
    – sage chakra
    – kyuubi chakra

    In order to make the taboo sage+kyuubi eyes that we’re all so eager to see in action.

  72. I like how there’s this new relationship between Naruto and the Fox. 🙂

    If you all remember that the toad sage said the more chakra you have the more nature chakra you can draw in. So basically he can use his sage technique longer and more powerfully. He can probably draw it in faster maybe even instantaneously? It seems his chakra pathways have changed. He’s been upgraded with an industrial military grade chakra system! =_+

  73. Muhahahahahahaha! I can’t wait until Sasuke destroys Naruto and all his upgraded goodness. It’s going to be routine for him. Naruto screams his name, talks about bonding with Sasuke, and Sasuke smacks him around a bit to remind him who’s superior. I’m going to laugh and I’m going to laugh hard. 😛

    *sigh*

    Then again, the manga is named Naruto so we can’t avoid the inevitable. I’ll just have to savor the moments. 😉

  74. @Super’s evil comment: O_O you sasuke lover. XD

    Anyway, Sasuke can’t just smack Naruto around like a rag doll, he’s the main character!!!!
    Lol, seriously I don’t think his new eyes will give him that much power. Naruto has just conquered the Kyuubi!!! It has near limitless chakra!!!!
    Sasuke can’t possibly defeat a Nine Tails + Sage Mode combination, right?

    Right???

    RIGHT????????

    *grasshoppers chirping*

    O_O

  75. Lets ask kishi. T__T

  76. “It’s going to be routine for him. Naruto screams his name, talks about bonding with Sasuke, and Sasuke smacks him around a bit to remind him who’s superior.”

    You mean like when they fought last time? Only one I saw getting smacked was Sasuke. And in all fairness, I can’t possible see HOW Sasuke could be superiour to Naruto. I’m sure the EMS will gift Sasuke some awesome new power (that was supposed to be Itachi’s, the coolest ninja around BUT NO!!!! That little brat of a whining little brother just had to end up with the EMS…”I don’t need my brother’s eyes, I’m EMO King bla bla bla”,… “I’m gonna need my brother’s eyes cuz I wanna be the EMO Emperor bla bla bla”… I hate Sasugay…. >__>), but there is no way some shiny new eyes will be able to best a Kyuubi-Sage swirly combo with Sage-of-the-6-paths sprinkles on top.
    Besides, the only reason Sasuke has the EMS is because Madara will penetrate him in a really nasty manner that you don’t even hear about in prison and take over his body like a puppet. Sasuke is Madara’s bitch. Just like he was Orochimaru’s bitch before that,… And Naruto’s bitch before that.
    Anyway, in a nutshell, I agree with Dragon…

    Bubble;
    O.K. WHO DIVIDED BY ZERO!!!
    Caption;
    There’s only one person capable of such greatness,..
    The sage of the six paths of Pain, justice, law and order…
    That’s right, the Texas Ranger.

  77. Sasuke will have the power of EMoS!

  78. Naruto has the power of the fox, but he doesn’t have his friendship which is what he needs if he’s going to defeat the mangekyo.

  79. LMFAO!!! XD

    Surely we remember the last time they fought right?

    http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/485/12-13/

    Sure Naruto could have won…I think…>_>

    http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/488/12/

    But that would have been the only way Naruto could have beaten Sasuke at that point. Taking advantage of his exhaustion. The last time they seriously fought Sasuke did the routine smackdown on Naruto.

    http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/308/04/

    I remember it like it was yesterday. And in all fairness the only reason Naruto got control of the Kyubi is because he had help from Killer Bee and mommy. Right? ^_^

    *skips over Sasuke sparing Naruto’s life at the Valley of End*

    Sasuke has always pwned Naruto and- no wait! I’ll give this to Naruto, he did molest Sasuke here with a surprise attack.

    http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/3/13/

    Kudos Naruto, but molesting your opponent doesn’t count as a victory. Track record is still in Sasuke’s favor. Don’t forget. 🙂 But hey, as I said before the manga is named ‘Naruto’ so his day will come. For now though… uhhh…close but no cigar.

    *whistles and walks away*

  80. @super you forgot to mention favoritism since he is Kishi’s favorite character. Who knows he might pull off an Aizen.

  81. This is very funny, I usually would have some kind of detail reason on why or how something is happening just to be crush by Supa and Tenrai in the end. But I have nothing!!!!!!!!!! Damn you Marksman, damn you to hell!!!!!!!!!

  82. BUBBLE CONTEST:

    “Are 9 tails enough to tantalize your gaping arse Sasukeeeee!!!!???!?!!”

  83. “The last time they seriously fought Sasuke did the routine smackdown on Naruto.

    http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/308/04/

    You mean the fight right after Naruto fought Orochimaru. You do know Naruto was already seriously exhausted due to the fox taking over his body. Sure, Sasuke was ahead of Naruto at that time but it’s not like Sasuke was miles ahead of Naruto. And for the valley of the end. Naruto never really tried to kill Sasuke there. Sasuke did, twice!! Both attempts resulted in failure. Naruto only tried to show Sasuke they were equals and that he could scratch Sasuke’s forehead protector. If he’d directed the fox powered rasengan at Sasuke instead of blocking the chidori with it so he could lash out at Sasuke’s forehead protector we wouldn’t be talking about the Emperor of EMO any more.
    And before Sasuke got his free gift card to power from Orochimaru Naruto was ahead of Sasuke. Sasuke failed badly against Gaara but Naruto won. In fact, that’s where Sasuke’s quest for power began. He always claimed to want power so he could kill Itachi but it became obvious he only wanted more power so he could surpass Naruto. He did after training with Orochimaru but Naruto is now, again, ahead of him. He already was when he completed his Sage training.

  84. Lol, yeah Sasuke failed at killing Naruto once but the second time he spared him his life so I wouldn’t call that a failing. I call that Naruto getting lucky again. 😉 Naruto failed at bringing Sasuke home two times in a row but this is all…irrelevant. ^_-

    What it comes down to it both Naruto and Sasuke could have aimed for each others faces here.

    http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/233/02/

    But Naruto aimed for the headband and Sasuke aimed for Naruto’s chest knowing the Kyubi chakra can heal him and a protective cloak surrounded him. Afterwards Sasuke could have easily dealt Naruto a finishing blow but spared him on a whim. xD

    Let’s not talk about free gift cards. The reason why he beat Gaara when Sasuke couldn’t. The reason why he beat Haku. The reason why he beat Neji. The reason why he was even on par with Sasuke. You know the answer to that. 🙂

    Naruto was a good motivation for Sasuke to get stronger but in the end Naruto was never Sasuke’s ultimate goal. He hardly knew the guy. Itachi was his ultimate goal and he just used Naruto as a challenge to gauge his own power.

    Please don’t stop. Any other Naruto supporter can jump in too! ^(^_^)^

    P.S. Sasuke would own Naruto right now as per usual. 😛

  85. @ super, dudeeeee u really can’t spot a calamity right in front of u, can u ??

    Nice one man, the fact of the matter is, Sasuke gets loads stronger right after Naruto achieves a power up.

    It happened after the haku fight when Sasuke unlocked the sharingan, it happened during the chunin exam when he achieved the chidori and it happened again when he went to Orochimaru.

    I admit Naruto did put to shame the techs that Sasuke learned prior to him, but after Sasuke found himself yet again further away from naruto in the power department.
    One thing is for sure, Orochimaru was a far better sensei to Sasuke in than Jirayia was to Naruto in the power and jutsu department, and this is why:

    While Sasuke learned all there was to know about the curse mark and almost becoming a master at lightning jutsus among other cool shit, Jirayia tried to hard to teach naruto how to control the fox, it was a great idea, but to waste so much time on that sort of training that didn’t even give Naruto control over his own body to me is a waste of time.

    What he should have been doing was to teach Naruto nature manipulation so he too could develop the kaze to a much more advanced level, and after that try and teach control over the kyuubi to Naruto.

    That to me was the point in the manga were Naruto lost his edge and got quite a bit behind Sasuke, and he tried like hell to catch up and almost made it thx to sage mode, but after that Sasuke gained the MS and it was Sasuke one step in front yet again.

    I’m curtain that this two are now evenly matched, Sasuke and Naruto, and the only thing that will determine the winner is gonna be Itachi.
    His gift to Naruto will be the decisive blow needed to take down Sasuke.

  86. “Afterwards Sasuke could have easily dealt Naruto a finishing blow but spared him on a whim.”

    Not if Naruto had attacked Sasuke to kill. That was my point. Naruto wasn’t fighting to kill, Naruto was fighting to try and change Sasuke’s mind. I would have definitely killed him, but hey not everybody is perfect. It’s just a minor character flaw of Naruto. Here’s hoping he’ll learn to do it right in the future.

    “You know the answer to that.”

    The Fox, yes. But it’s also a burden. It’s given Naruto more pain than Sasuke’s loss ever will.

    Let’s compare that to Sasuke’s bag of tricks.
    Sharingan, free gift card to power. Cursed seal, free gift card to power. Itachi’s eye techniques, free free free. EMS, same deal. It seems every day is Sasuke’s birthday. I’m sure he’ll get some more powers gifted to him as soon as this arc is over.

    And you say Naruto wasn’t Sasuke’s goal, well he sure seems to be now. Or did Sasuke decide that too,.. On a whim. Haha. Besides, he didn’t know Itachi AT ALL as well.

    “P.S. Sasuke would own Naruto right now as per usual.”

    How,… If Nagato can’t bring down the Fox how will Sasuke defeat Sennin Naruto with full Kyuubi chakra? Enlighten me. Or do you really believe Sasuke will now be stronger than Nagato or perhaps even Madara. Whahaha, don’t make me laugh. Sasuke wouldn’t have lasted ten seconds against Pain and he can’t even lay a finger on Madara.
    Face it, Sasuke has been lifting on other peoples powers since day one. The last time he worked hard to achieve something was before he went to the academy and tried to learn his first katon jutsu. After that it was copy, gift, copy, gift, gift, gift and more gifts. The only thing he has going for him is a major superiority complex. But in the end he is going to end up just like Neji or Gaara. Down on the ground with Naruto standing over him and lecturing him.
    After that he’ll be reduced to a background character or perhaps, if he’s lucky, he’ll play a role in a filler arc. Where he belongs… The little crybaby…

  87. @super do you want to start a war? lol. Anyway lets talk skills in general. Naruto did not have a super ninja (itachi) to tech him skills like sasuke did andhe still was able to battle proficiently with sasuke. (before shippuden). Super i think you are basing your arguement off of the fact that naruto is super weak to genjustu. He cant really defend against normal genjustu so EMS genjutsu would destroy him. Other wise they are equal or naruto is better. with sage mode and the kyuubi power up naruto > sasuke. He is faster stronger and has powerful summons, while sasuke killed his most powerful summon against diedora… if thr kyuubi does gather natural energy for naruto then he would whoop sasuke.

  88. “Orochimaru was a far better sensei to Sasuke in than Jirayia was to Naruto in the power and jutsu department”

    What Oro taught Sasuke was different from what Jiraiya taught Naruto. I would like to reiterate that Oro taught Sasuke jutsus and Jiraiya taught naruto not only some jutsu but both the basics and the way of the shinobi life. Yes Sasuke got a lot of jutsus on his arsenal but look at this:
    http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/137/13/

    Just like what the 3rd is saying you can master all the jutsu in the world and end dying in the end. What Jiraiya taught Naruto was the will of fire. In the end we all know that all this power upgrades will cancel each other out in the end, and the only thing that will surface is what jiraiya taught naruto, the NEVER-GIVE-UP attitude.

    About the Sasuke vs Naruto: They should never be compared at the moment because they have different intentions.

    Sasuke wants to kill Naruto; and
    Naruto wants to SAVE Sasuke…

    Its just like Pain vs Naruto where Pain cannot really kill Naruto because of the Bijuu inside him. We all know that the “intention to kill” is important in any battle we saw this in a lot of Mangas already.

    Now think about this, what if Naruto did resolved to kill Sasuke do you think he will still hold back? i think a “killer-Naruto” is much much more dangerous. And scary as HELL…

    P.S. Eugen i misread ur point your right because you said the “power and justu department” i just cant change my post anymore im tired as hell… hehehe peace!

  89. Perfect! 😀

    @1redbaron1: It matters not that Naruto wasn’t going for the kill because neither was Sasuke (flip the page). That’s the point I was trying to convey. It’s not like Naruto was holding back in the fight either.

    http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/228/19/

    If I understand you correctly you’re saying being given an unsurmountable amount of power is worse than having your entire clan slaughtered by your brother, feeling alone and inadequate all your childhood, and being led purposefully down a path of hate? Makes sense to me…>_> Hey, I’m not saying being a Jinchuuriki is easy but I’d rather take that than have my entire family murdered by my older brother. Oh, and Sasuke knew Itachi for around 7-8 years before he left. He knew Naruto for how long? 1 year, maybe less before he left him and Naruto went chasing after him yelling, ‘Sasuke please don’t leave me. Let’s make bonds together!’. T_T

    As I said, Itachi “was” Sasuke’s goal, now he’s dead. Better yet, I’d say revenge is Sasuke’s ultimate goal. Now that Itachi is dead Sasuke is moving down his priority list and Naruto is up next. He’s gotta take care of business you know. xD

    Ah, the gift card thing again. If you insist then I must say the Kyubi is the biggest free gift card to power you could ever get. All Naruto needed was 1 tail to be on par with Sasuke using both the Cursed Seal and the 3 tomoe Sharingan. Let’s put it this way. Sasuke got a multitude of $1 bills for “free” while Naruto immediately got a $100 bill for “free”. Then Naruto gets Itachi’s power. Lol, is that not a sweet power deal or what? 😉

    Honestly, I never liked calling these things “gifts” or using the word “free” when regarding them. To me they’re burdens (helpful nonetheless) causing pain to both Naruto and Sasuke. The entire Uchiha Clan for instance is a cursed and hate filled bloodline.

    Consequently, I feel no need to go into how hard both Naruto and Sasuke have worked to get to where they are and the burdens they both carry. You say Sasuke has been living off other people’s powers this whole time? You say that while you’re defending the boy who’s been winning battle after battle thanks to the Kyubi’s power mind you.

    *shakes the Kyubi’s hand*

    @Anyone: You know why Sasuke would pwn Naruto right now? LMAO! XD He wouldn’t, I just said he’d pwn Naruto to get more people into the discussion. I’ve been saying this entire time Naruto would win in the end. I only added that last minute “P.S” message in my last post because I wanted a few other opinions (Naruto support). 🙂

    Regard this for instance.

    “Then again, the manga is named Naruto so we can’t avoid the inevitable. I’ll just have to savor the moments.”

    Bingo! ^_* My first statement regarding this entire Naruto vs. Sasuke discussion was not comparing them. I was simply stating what I wanted to see. If you want my honest opinion on who’s stronger I’d say it’s a tie with a slight edge to Naruto thanks to the recent development. It’d be a boring fight if either of the two were twice as strong as the other, so Sasuke isn’t far behind at all. Track record of pwnage still goes in Sasuke’s favor though. XD

  90. So super, you think sasuke would own Naruto eh?

    I smell a debate brewing. @_@

    Let me hear your reasons as to why you think this.

  91. Who knows maybe in the 500 chapter maybe Kishi would change the name to Naruto and the Ninja Warrior.

  92. I say it is still up for grabs. We don’t know what knew power Sasuke or Naruto got know or what they can do. Just some months ago everyone was jumping on the Naruto ban wagon be his Sage mode was the best thing since minute made rice. Same thing was done when Sasuke got MS. So until they settle it one on one I am not saying who is stronger. Also who owned more really don’t means nothing. Kishi could have made Kiba owned more people then Sasuke and Naruto but we still would know who would beat in a fight.

  93. We should have a contest on what power Itachi gave Naruto.

    I say its the spirit sword!

  94. I say it is still up for grabs. We don’t know what knew power Sasuke or Naruto got now or what they can do. Just some months ago everyone was jumping on the Naruto ban wagon because his Sage mode was the best thing since minute made rice. Same thing was done when Sasuke got MS. So until they settle it one on one I am not saying who is stronger. Also who owned more really don’t means nothing. Kishi could have made Kiba owned more people then Sasuke and Naruto but we still would know who would beat in a fight.

    So for the double post just had to correct somethings

  95. A Sasuke vs Naruto debate would be a bit pointless right now, because they have both just received new powers that we know very little about right now.

    Sasuke has the EMS and Naruto just absorbed the Kyuubi’s chakra and went super sage. That tells us nothing really. We still don’t know the limits (or lack of thereof) of the Kyuubi’s chakra or how it acts under human control. We don’t know to what degree Naruto can push himself with it or if his human body may limit him in some way and we don’t know if he will use it in conjunction with his sage mode.

    In the same breath, the only thing we know about the EMS is that you don’t go blind while using the MS and that it is apparently the pinnacle of the Sharingan and immensely powerful. But we still don’t know the limit of that power (or, once again, a lack of thereof). So, we just have to wait a bit longer to see both of them in action before we can have a nice cozy debate that will tear the blog asunder. ^ ^

    As for Sasuke’s track record, yes, he has beaten Naruto, but Naruto has defeated opponents Sasuke couldn’t, like Gaara and Haku. Does that count towards the track record? O_o

  96. I was also thinking about the origins of the Sharingan and one thing came to mind. When you see the sage, you see that he has the Rinnegan, but when you see the Juubi, you see that it has tomoe in its eyes much like the Sharingan.

    So the only thing I can put together, is that the Sharingan’s power originated from the Juubi itself. It is possible that when the sage divided his power between his sons, that the eye powers he gave his oldest son might have been corrupted by some the Juubi’s chakra that mixed with the Sage’s (He was the host of the Juubi, so the Juubi’s chakra had no doubt mixed with his own to some degree). Over time, that corruption might have grown as each new generation came to pass, until eventually, the Sharingan was born from it.

    It would explain the tomoe in the Sharingan, as well and why the Sharingan would be able control the Kyuubi’s chakra, because it was born from the same chakra that the Kyuubi was. The Kyuubi also mentioned that the chakra he sensed in Sasuke was more sinister than his own and what could be more sinister than the Kyuubi’s chakra other than the Juubi’s own chakra? That’s one way I can explain why the Uchiha have the Sharingan and not the Rinnegan, because their eye powers are corrupt. It would also explain why the Sharingan is as powerful as it, because even if it was infused with only a bit of the Juubi’s chakra, I am sure it would have a great effect.

    I think that is the best theory I have thought of so far. O_o

  97. actually i agree with super on the NARUTO V.S SASUGAY DEBATE

    its kinda pointless you know

    all sasugay has to do is yell and his sharingan will evolve into rinnengan . if that aint enough he’ll shout and get unlimited chakra . if that aint enough either then he’ll shout a little louder and he’ll get rinnengan along with the eternal sharingan ( mixed ) O_o….. and so on ….

  98. @Tenrai: The track record of all their battles in general? o_O Lol, I was just keeping a track record of battles between the two, personal battles. Between the two Sasuke trumps Naruto. Btw, Sasuke would have bested Haku if it wasn’t for Naruto…>_>

    But no need for a Sasuke vs. Naruto discussion. I haven’t the faintest clue where it sprung up from. ^_^

    Would your theory also say the sharingan should be able to control any tailed beast since they all are parts of the Juubi? Your theory would also help support the theory of Naruto being part Kyubi, or the reason to why he has a naturally large chakra capacity. If the Sage’s chakra mixed with the Juubi’s and passed on to his son then there’s no reason why Kushina’s chakra couldn’t mix with the Kyubi’s and pass on to her son as well. It also makes me think on an older discussion of whether or not the Sage had the Rinnengan before or after sealing the 10 tails in himself.

    http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/467/14/

    As we can see the Juubi has both the Rinnengan and Sharingan in his eyes. The seal required to trap the Juubi does not require the Rinnengan either because we can see Naruto using the same seal on the Kyubi.

    http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/499/15/

    All in all, it’s an awesome theory! xD I wonder though, when does the Byakugan come into all of this…

    @Ahsan: L.M.F.A.O!!!!!!!! XD

    @Debate: *Achoo*

  99. i dunno why, but i always ROFLMAO on hearing the word “JUUBI” 😀 . kishi was definitely outta ideas when he wrote that. lets hope there isn’t a 13-tailed beast who can control all kekkei genkai and doujutsu 😛 . wait, is THAT the “darkness” thingy inside sasuke that karin was talking about O_O

  100. Well if we are not going to count stipulations in these grudge matches we are stacking up in naruto vs sasuke, of course we know the outcome.

    The first fight, naruto aimed for sasukes forehead protector to scratch it, Sasuke aimed for narutos heart to kill him. Fight ends in sasukes favor of course.

    The second fight cant even be considered a proper battle. It was more of a small talky scrap to be called a battle where one can no longer fight.

  101. @Katz

    Actually, Juubi litterally translates to “Ten tails” just like the Kyuubi litterally translates to “Nine tails”. All the Bijuu’s names are really just the number of tails they have.

    It wasn’t about running out of ideas, just following the same trend.

  102. @supertrek89

    It would also explain why Karin felt the same darkness in Naruto that she felt in Sasuke. If the Kyuubi’s chakra and the Sharingan both originate from the Juubi, then they would feel the same.

  103. And the Ten Tails looks like it has a rinnesharingan or some sort of dojitsu.

    I wonder what it does and if or not the Complete mongekyou or the rinnegan can tame it.

  104. Meh, If Nagato is the Sage’s reincarnation, and the Sage DIDNT possess the Rinnegan BEFORE he absorbed the Jubi, then why would Nagato have the Rinnegan? It makes more sense that he had the Rinnegan, and using its powers it aided him in beating the most powerful beast to ever walk the Naruverse. As for the Sharingan, I say it all came down to natural selection and evolution instead of emotions physically changing the body. Plus if you look at the Sage’s son’s eyes, you can see that it is NOT a Rinnegan, so evolution had already started lol

  105. “If I understand you correctly you’re saying being given an unsurmountable amount of power is worse than having your entire clan slaughtered by your brother, feeling alone and inadequate all your childhood, and being led purposefully down a path of hate? Makes sense to me…”
    You don’t understand me,.. At all. Due to the Fox being sealed inside him Naruto never could be with his parents. The villagers detested Naruto because of what the Fox had done. He was left out in pretty much everything. In my book, Loneliness is much worse than loss. People who’ve never been alone will never understand that. Loss is painful but one learns to live with it. Loneliness is something one can never get adjusted to. It only inflicts more pain every day.

    “As I said, Itachi “was” Sasuke’s goal, now he’s dead. Better yet, I’d say revenge is Sasuke’s ultimate goal. Now that Itachi is dead Sasuke is moving down his priority list and Naruto is up next. He’s gotta take care of business you know. xD”

    Fair enough, the revenge thing I agree with. But taking care of business? Never gonna happen.

    As for the whole gift card comparison. I think everybody agrees the Fox’s power is the biggest power one can receive. But, like I said earlier, it’s what has given Naruto his pain which imo are greater than Sasuke’s or even Nagato’s losses. AND it always came at a high price. Not like the Mangekyo (jerk off to much and you’ll) go blind price but more like the-Kyuubi-taking-over-and-killing-everyone-including-the-people-he-loves-or-cares-about price. Besides whereas Sasuke relies solely on the powers of others Naruto did try to fight without the Fox’s help. Lastly, the whole cursed bloodline is the Uchiha’s own fault. Their everlasting campaign to convince everyone they were superior has brought them into a circle of hatred and revenge. Better yet, everything that has happened to Sasuke is Madara’s fault. So I’m still at a loss as to why Sasuke wants to kill everyone EXCEPT Madara.

    “You know why Sasuke would pwn Naruto right now? LMAO! XD He wouldn’t, I just said he’d pwn Naruto to get more people into the discussion.”

    Ha! Wrong again… Well not about getting more people into the discussion…But… If I’m honest…Sasuke would win against Naruto right now. Naruto would probably be able to defeat/fend off or at least defend against Sasuke’s Susano’o arrows but he doesn’t stand a chance against Tsukuyomi. even though Sasuke’s isn’t anywhere near as powerfull as Itachi’s.
    The only way for Naruto to win is to fight with Kyuubi’s WILL on his side. Just like Hachibi cancelled the Tsukuyomi on Bee when they fought Sasuke. Or with teammates or summons who can snap Naruto out of it.
    Perhaps Itachi has given Naruto some counter for the Tsukuyomi but before that’s confirmed I won’t speculate on Itachi’s gift to Naruto.
    In terms of power (chakra/stamina/resilience) Naruto is way ahead of Sasuke.

  106. sorry red but your’e wrong . after absorving the kyubi and using that awesome seal jutsu (lol) id say naruto will beat sasugay. (if you ignore the fact that sasugay will yell and get powerups ) i doubt susan’o can hold up against rasen shurikan’s and then again that would put load on sasugay ( chakra wise and soul wise ) but meh … i agree with you now … kishi will just give him unlimited chakra … certainly give him all of itachi’s expertise (via his eyes) (gave him all itachi’s eye tech’s before_) and whatever is needed to beat naruto just pointless i dont even know why i started countering your points . all this bs of sasugay and kishi and you still support sasugay against everything super i ask why ? 😉

  107. There is something missing in story about byakugan and sharingan.
    It`s been told that sharingan comes from byakugan,but in story of founding Konoha there is nothibg about byakugan.
    Madara said that at this time there was 2 powerful clans:Senju and Uchiha.
    So if Hyuuga is most noble clan from Konoha,then where their were 80 years ago?
    If sharingan is mutation of byakugan then when its happend then?

  108. I actually have to agree with Ahsan on this one.

    Sasuke wouldnt pwn naruto, and as a matter o fact, i dont even think he would beat him now hat he can willingly control the fox.

    And whoever said loneliness is worse then the pain of loss, i have to disagree. It is only a matter of opinion in this case, and it depends on how severe the circumstance are. However, if one has truly gone through both ordeals with at the same extent, its pretty hard to choose one over the other.

    Its true, naruto had nothing to began with, but he eventually gained friends and a status even at a young age. So he wasn’t completely lonely. Sasuke had something everything at first, then it was all taken away from him at a young age which is devastating and traumatizing. Then he had to endure the pain of loneliness along with it.

    Well, there is my 2 cents. <_<

  109. @ Ahsan,

    No I don’t support Sasugay. I only said Naruto wouldn’t beat Sasuke simply because of Tsukuyomi. Naruto is far ahead of Sasuke in every other field; Chakra, stamina, resilience, summons, taijutsu.. you name it. He’ll need to work with Kyuubi to counter genjutsu. Right now that doesn’t seem to be the case but Naruto told Kyuubi to wait so Kyuubi will most likely team up with Naruto after some time.

    @ Marksman,

    Naruto worked hard to get those friends and his status. Sasuke did loose what he had but the loneliness is something he chose for himself. Sasuke had plenty off people who cared about him. He just didn’t want to admit it because he thought friends would keep him weak.

  110. @1redbarno1: Meh…you’re right. I wasn’t understanding you. I overestimated. I thought you knew Naruto and Sasuke shared the same feeling of loneliness.

    http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/228/08/
    http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/230/03/

    If years of feeling neglected and alone are the most painful things in your eyes that’s all fine and dandy. Sasuke has experienced that in magnitude plus his entire clan was slaughtered by his brother. Both loss and loneliness. What would Naruto know about that compared to Sasuke (this is where someone brings up Jiraiya ^_*)?

    http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/229/10/

    It’s harder to lose something you know and love than to lose something you never experienced. Naruto later admits his lack of understanding to Sasuke’s pain. He was ignorant (no offense I suppose) to Sasuke’s pain and that’s probably the reason why he failed in his first two attempts to bring him back.

    Regarding the Kyubi power do you know the saying, “With great power comes great responsibility”? It’s only fair the risks equals the level of such an enormous power. It was Naruto’s own fault for relying on the Kyubi so much which hurt others. You say Naruto doesn’t rely on the Kyubi as much as Sasuke relies on his sharingan. Lol, true but when’s the last battle Naruto won without the Kyubi? You can say the same for Sasuke and the sharingan. Guess what? Sasuke will use his EMS and Naruto will use the Kyubi some more when they battle! XD You see my point here? Pissing on a point such as this is irrelevant when both parties do the same thing. No shame in it either.

    As for it being Uchiha Clan’s fault they have a hate filled destiny. Lol, sounds like inherited sin. Those with special blood lines are often hated and feared. The entire Uchiha Clan was ostracized and secluded to the outside of the village by the beloved Senju then setup to die. Is it any wonder their hate still festers? It’s not Madara who chose Sasuke’s path remember? It was Sasuke’s choice and if you believe in fate then destiny might have played a hand (contradicting aren’t they? Fate and Choice. Unless you choose your fate. ;)).

    Lastly Naruto vs. Sasuke fight. Lol, I’m pretty much set on Naruto winning Sasuke over in the end. If you think Sasuke would own Naruto that’s fine by me. 🙂 Opinions differ but I wouldn’t say it’s wrong. Anyway, Sasuke already took care of business twice already. It’s not his fault Naruto keeps chasing after the guy. >(0_0)> Anything else? ^_^

    @Ahsan: Because Sasuke pays me in emo-bills to defend him of course. >:D

    @Afisharingan: I’m guessing the Byakugan was a lesser clan power wise than the Uchiha and Senju so they weren’t mentioned, but the Sharingan still could have evolved from the Byakugan. The mutation could have happened at any time period before the Uchiha came to be known in the Ninja World. The Hyuga being the most noble clan doesn’t necessarily mean being the most notable.

  111. Like I said before the series shall be changed to Naruto and the Ninja Warrior.

    @marksman I seriously doubt that Kishi would elaborate on the Hyuuga’s look at how much panel time they’re getting. Hinata hasn’t really been seen since her confession. Neji roughly since Naruto return from Gokage. Hiashi and Hanabi hasn’t been seen since the Chunnin Exams. Then there the random Hyugas like Ko and Takuma.

    Bubblition: Naruto your balls are as big as mine.
    Caption: Its not what it’s sound like.
    or
    Bubblition: take this Aura Sphere err no. Ok then Spirit bomb no wait I’m too evil for that. Terra Destroyer ok where did that come from.
    Caption: The trial and error of naming attacks.
    ____________________
    Lol, Pokemon references will get you EVERYWHERE!

  112. @Super & 1redbaron1

    I find it interesting how these debates always pop up about who had it worse. Naruto or Sasuke. Well, let’s just say they both had it pretty bad but each in their own way. Both have lived through loss, both have lived through loneliness.

    For Naruto, it was being detested by the entire village and living a childhood of loneliness. He also did lose Jiraiya, who was like family to him. Some people might argue that it isn’t the same as having your entire family slaughtered, but it is the same. Whether you only have one person in your life who is family, or more, they are still all you have got. Jiraiya’s loss was no doubt just as painful for Naruto as it was for Sasuke losing his family. You also need to consider that Naruto has also lost Sasuke in a way, someone he considers to be a brother. You may argue that it isn’t the same, but the truth is blood isn’t all that connects families together.

    To Naruto, Sasuke was as much his family as anyone could claim through blood and the feelings were just as strong. Imagine having your brother trying to kill you.

    As for Sasuke, you could apply many of the same feelings. He lost his family and it was a severe loss. So he also had it pretty bad. What also made it bad was the fact that he was led to believe his own brother was responsible. Was he lonely after that? Well, that depends on how you look at it. Sure, he didn’t have a family anymore, but there were plenty of people who wanted to be close to him. He chose to turn those people away so most of his loneliness was self inflicted, whereas Naruto’s was not by choice.

    The real difference comes in their different choices. When Naruto was finally offered a way out of his loneliness, he accepted it with open arms. When Sasuke was offered a way out, he rejected it and showed hatred instead. Does that suddenly mean Sasuke had it worse, or does it just mean he made it worse for himself?

    Even still, you can understand those trepidations. Even up to now, Naruto was still alone in a way, because he still didn’t feel the villagers trusted him. His own teammates, people he considers closest to him, have hurt him quite severely and his mentor and father figure was killed as well. So, in a way, you can’t blame Sasuke for harboring feelings of resentment either. It is simply human nature to struggle to let go of that pain (something I discussed in my anime breakdown).

    Even still, Naruto is choosing to try his best to let go of those feelings. Sasuke is choosing to be consumed by them. I don’t like it when people excuse Sasuke’s actions because he was offered a lot of love and friendship and he betrayed that by trying to kill both of his own friend and teammates and his sensei, most of whom were trying to save him from being hunted by Konoha.

    Imagine how hard it was for Itachi. He not only lost his own family, he had to kill them with his own two hands. Imagine how he felt and yet he still chose compassion and peace over hatred and death. Sure, he wasn’t perfect and there are a lot of things he did I don’t agree with, but at least he didn’t excuse his actions with blind hatred.

    A lot of shinobi in Konoha have lost family. Naruto never had one, and when he finally had a father figure, that person was killed. Kakashi lost his father, his mentor and both his teammates, Anko was betrayed by her own mentor, Neji’s father was killed for the Hyuuga clan, Hinata lost her mother, Iruka’s parents died in the Kyuubi attack, Konohamaru lost his grandfather and uncle, Tsunade lost her brother and lover, etc, etc….

    The list just goes on, so loss isn’t something that is uncommon in the world of shinobi. Yet most shinobi learn how to move on and deal with that loss. If they can do it, why can’t people like Pein and Sasuke?

    Imagine if Iruka decided to hate Naruto for his parent’s death. Naruto would probably be dead right now if that was the case, either at Mizuki’s hands or Iruka’s own. The way Sasuke wants to destroy Konoha for the actions of three elders would be the same as Iruka wanting to kill Naruto for the actions of the Kyuubi.

    When we compare these examples to one another and ask ourselves who had it worse, the answer eventually comes down not to what happened to each of them or how much it hurt, but rather how THEY chose to deal with it. That is all it comes down to at the end of the day, because it is we who choose if we accept the love of others or not.

    *Passes out and goes into a coma after insanely long comment* X__X

  113. Take a look at this trailer for the new Shippuuden Ultimate Ninja Storm game. @__@

    *Dies*

  114. @Tenrai: Naruto Shippuuden Ultimate Ninja Storm 2 will be AWESOME!!!
    All of Pain’s paths will be playable, there will be Sage Naruto, Sage Jiraiya, Mangekyo Sasuke, Susano’o Itachi and maybe even Nagato!
    Not sure about Nagato because he would have all the paths’ abilities even though he didn’t use them in the manga (yet).

    There’s also Lars Alexandersson from Tekken 6 because Kishi drew his design in the new game.

  115. Oh, I forgot the link. 😀

    http://naruto.wikia.com/wiki/Naruto_Shippuden:_Ultimate_Ninja_Storm_2

  116. @Superdude, “Those with special blood lines are often hated and feared.”

    Only in Kirigakure. Most likely it was because of Yagura and Madara, but since the Mizukage has TWO kekkei genkais, I guess things are changing (dumb Kirigakurians lost the Hyoton AND SHIKOTSUMYAKU!!!!!!!)

    “Lol, true but when’s the last battle Naruto won without the Kyubi?”

    Kakuzu.

    Why would a Village get rid of the best non-dojutsu kekkei genkai ever (Shikotsumyaku)? With the power to control your bones your virtually indestructible. If I lived in the Naruverse, I’d want to have the Rinnegan, if I couldnt, then I’d want the Shikotsumyaku 😀

  117. @kantonkage “Bubblition: take this Aura Sphere err no. Ok then Spirit bomb no wait I’m too evil for that. Terra Destroyer ok where did that come from.”

    Blackwargreymon FTW :D. I give you 3 awesome points

  118. @Tenrai: Exactamundo on that first paragraph! Lol, more people should understand both Naruto and Sasuke have have had their fair share of pain. The difference is Naruto seems to try and identify with every character in the manga…>_> Unfortunately, he couldn’t identify with Sasuke’s pain no matter how hard he tried (for obvious reasons) so indeed, they both went through their separate paths of loneliness and loss.

    As for the pain in their losses, I would say they’re not the same. Sasuke’s loss is dramatically different from Naruto’s in more than a few key ways. I’m not even talking about how much of a loss it was (though that plays a big role) I’m referring to the situation first. Naruto lost Jiraiya to someone he didn’t know. Of course, that hurts. Sasuke lost his entire clan to his own older brother who he looked up to and loved. To have your mother, father, and everyone you ever loved and cared for slain by your older brother then tortured in the same night to relive the events. On the other hand there’s having your mentor killed by a stranger. There’s a dramatic difference in that. Situation.

    Yeah, Naruto lost Sasuke who he tried to make bonds with and he wondered if that was what it’s like to have a brother. Well, Sasuke could have told him how it’s like to have a brother betray and leave you in the worse kind of way. In Sasuke’s case his brother did ‘just bit’ (sarcasm) more damage to his psyche before leaving.

    And Naruto didn’t lose everything like Sasuke. The one biggest person he had in his life that was still alive after Jiraiya died was none other than Iruka. In fact, didn’t Iruka stop by and comfort Naruto after his loss? Jiraiya was closer but Naruto and Iruka shared a unique and unbreakable bond too. We can’t undermine that bond. Naruto didn’t lose everything that was close to him when Jiraiya died. That right there is the biggest difference.

    Sasuke had no one that close to him for comfort. They were all dead. The village was there for him? The village couldn’t comprehend his loss because no one in the village has ever lost as much or in depth as Sasuke (save for Itachi the culprit who left the village and definitely wasn’t there for comfort). Heh, I’d leave the village too after mass murder. The village that shunned his clan to the outskirts, feared their power, and set them up for genocide. Btw, Kisu that’s what I was referring to when I said,

    “Those with special blood lines are often hated and feared.”

    It wasn’t only in Kirigakure. The Uchiha were a special case in Konoha. Their power was feared and they were never trusted especially after the Kyubi attack and everyone knows what happened to them because of that. Thanks for the Kakuzu mention. Chapter 341 (158 chapters back).

    So the pain they felt from their losses was indeed different. It hurt for both of them but nothing hurts the same. Sasuke chose loneliness? Ultimately, yes it was his choice but what shaped that choice? While looking at the choices, the different situations also have to be looked at. The situations influenced their choices afterall. Itachi shaped and manipulated Sasuke into a vengeful and hating person. When a blank slate is painted on with darkness what’s the most likely outcome? The most likely choice? Instead of just looking at the outcome I like to look at the factors that influenced whatever the outcome might be. Call it nitpicking. 😉

    Naruto chose to become Hokage because he wanted acknowledgement. Of course he would, the village ignored him and he wanted acceptance. Sasuke chose vengeance because he wanted to avenge the Uchiha Clan. Of course he would, who wouldn’t? Different situations influence different choices and with those choices follow varying outcomes. Those are the basics of what it boils down to.

    In the end it’s not about “who had it worse” because there’s no definite answer to that. At least not to me because no matter who debates on it it’ll all be left to matter of opinion. ^_- I look at the situation. We talked about this before didn’t we Tenrai? 😉 I look at what happened to Naruto and I look at what happened to Sasuke. Then I ask myself whose position would I want to be in. Would I want my family murdered by my brother or be made into a hated Jinchuuriki? Without a doubt I always pick Naruto, but it’s all about personal choice right? +_+ Just like which is worse, loss or loneliness. People tend to forget loss leads to loneliness…>_>

    I know the pain a Jinchuuriki goes through but something about having everyone I ever loved killed by my brother doesn’t sit too well with me. Then feeling alone and hated for 13 years (counting baby years?) just doesn’t seem so bad especially if the other party also felt alone for a number of years.

    *goes back to killing* >_>

  119. Wow there have been some really long post recently. AHHH “gets stabbed in the back and dies”
    \ / \ /
    \/ \/
    /\ /\
    / \ / \

    ————–

  120. … how can you write such a long post with the sole purpose of defending sasugay ? …

    *gets shot in the head*

  121. *see’s Ahsan’s dead body and puts a sign up* SASUKE YET AGAIN TOO OUT ONE OF HIS HATERS!!! small print *with the power of fangirl/boy*

  122. I totally agree with Tenrai on this. Although I do feel Naruto has had it worse it all comes down to the choices they make. Naruto chose not to give up and fight for acknowledgment whereas Sasuke chose to be alone… I guess he needs his privacy…>__>

    “The Uchiha were a special case in Konoha. Their power was feared and they were never trusted especially after the Kyubi attack and everyone knows what happened to them because of that.”

    And who kick-started all that? Right, Madara. The leader of the Uchiha clan who didn’t like it that Hashirama got chosen to be Hokage (superiority complex which Sasuke has displayed several times as well). And what does Madara do? He attacks Konoha,.. twice. He also failed twice… So much for Uchiha superiority. >__>
    Anyhow, if it wasn’t for Madara’s quest for absolute power the Uchiha wouldn’t have been shunted or feared. Tobirama wouldn’t have placed them under ANBU surveillance and Danzo wouldn’t have had a reason to plan the massacre with the other elders. So it really does come down to the Uchiha (in this case Madara) steering the clan into a circle of hatred, vengeance and death.

    But back to your argument as to why Sasuke’s actions are correct. You say the pain caused by Itachi is what makes Sasuke’s pain unique. Well, what about Gaara. Almost everyone in his family has tried to kill him which turned him into an emotionless monster. So Gaara was alone from day one (like Naruto), feared and shunted from day one (like Naruto) and assassinated multiple times either by the people he thought cared about him or by orders from the people he thought cared about him. Doesn’t that make Gaara’s pain greater than Sasuke’s?

    And you say loss leads to loneliness… Only if the person choses it. Naruto was forced to be alone, Sasuke chose it… And seems to enjoy himself just fine (probably why he went blind,… Played with himself too much…<__<).

    And about your choice. What would you choose if you had to choose between losing your family but being worshiped by everyone or never having a family and being hated by everyone in your world. Seems to me like a double downer on that last option…

  123. @Ashan: Muhahahahaha! It’s as easy as A, B, C…1, 2, 3. >(^_^)><(0_-)<

    @Pein: LMAO! The emo-no-jutsu was just to strong for him. You should have worn an orange mask Ahsan. XD

    @1redbaron1: Lol, if you wanted to talk about Madara all you had to do was ask. 😉 He's an ass but I wouldn't put the entire blame on him for the Uchiha's punishment. Why should an entire clan suffer for the actions of one man? The Uchiha turned their backs on Madara and when he acted on his own accord they were punished for his actions. Sound fair? The blame for the Uchiha's punishment does not rest solely on Madara's shoulder but also on the harsh actions of Senju Clan. Their actions only helped in reigniting the cycle of revenge and hate. Also, the cycle of hatred and revenge between the Senju and Uchiha was going on long before Madara was even born.

    You seem to be confused about one thing. If you can point out to me where I was defending Sasuke's actions that'd be helpful. I know he's on the wrong path. I'm only giving reasons to "why". I'm not saying this is "ok" or that's "ok".

    Now as to Gaara's pain yes, you are correct in saying his pain is unique. I did say, "nothing hurts the same" so everyones pain is unique. When you say almost everybody in his family has tried to kill him do you mean his uncle and his father? Because those were the only two people in his family that tried to kill him. His brother and sister were always there but they never tried to assassinate him.

    So you want my answer now on who's pain is greater between Gaara and Sasuke? Well, seeing as how I believe there's no definite answer to "who had it worse" it's strange you ask me that. If I had to pick the situation I'd be Gaara. At least then I'd still have my brother and sister by my side.

    Loss leads to loneliness for the simple reason of when you lose people you don't have them anymore. When you don't have them anymore then you are alone. Simple really. As for my choice I already chose it. Surely you won't try to change my mind and I won't try to change yours. 😉

  124. It only depends on who you ask concerning who had it worse?

  125. “As for my choice I already chose it. Surely you won’t try to change my mind and I won’t try to change yours.”

    When my moon’s eye plan has come to fruition you won’t have a choice. @__<

    Seriously though. I just don't see why anyone could favor Sasuke over Naruto. But i guess all that EMO crap appeals to some people.
    And again loss leads to loneliness when the person chooses it. Sasuke lost everything but gained back some of that loss a few years later. He chose to abbandon that:
    http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/133/12/
    Here he clearly mentions Naruto and Sakura as those dear to him.
    That's what he abandoned. He could have worked to gain back most of what he lost but instead he decided to turn down the path of the dark side. I guess,.. In the end… He was just weak minded and easily persuaded.
    It didn't take much for the sound 4 to convince him.

  126. @Kantonkage: I’d say so. Not everyone has the same opinions and people look at things differently. Who had it worse? It all depends on who you ask and I’m guessing the majority of this blog would say…Naruto. xD

    @1redbaron1: Hehe, somebody has to advocate for Sasuke. If everyone took one position and looked at this from one perspective there’s no debate, mixing of ideas, or discussion. That’s just boring to me.

    As for Sasuke being “weak minded and easily persuaded”. I’ll save that for another debate. >_>

  127. @Supertrek

    “If everyone took one position and looked at this from one perspective there’s no debate, mixing of ideas, or discussion. That’s just boring to me.”

    Well, I have to agree with that, which is why I like debating. No opposition = no debates. Anyway, once again I will say that a lot of their suffering and how they overcame it has to do with how they reacted to it. You claim that Naruto losing Jiraiya isn’t the same as Sasuke losing his family, but how is it different?

    To Naruto, Jiraiya was family. To Sasuke, his mom and dad were his family. And, to be perfectly honest, they both reacted to it the same way… at first. Naruto also learned what it felt like to feel hatred towards someone and what it felt like to be consumed by revenge. The part where the road splits, however, was when Naruto decided to think about the consequences of his revenge and how many people would possibly get hurt by it.

    He realized it would only cause more of the same suffering. I mean, let’s face it, Madara’s thirst for revenge is what landed the Uchiha in the position they were in and although there were a lot of people to blame from all sides, it was still a selfish desire on his part that ended up getting a lot of innocent people killed.

    Is pride more important than a human life? To Madara it was and he put his pride and the pride of his clan before peace and understanding. Right now, I believe Sasuke is doing the same thing. He is putting his own feelings before everyone else, and he is fully aware of it. If he just wanted revenge on those responsible, I would have even understood that. If it was just the elders and Danzou he was after, I wouldn’t have actually blamed him at all, but it isn’t just them he is after.

    He wants to kill everyone in Konoha, even those who had no knowledge of what was going on and his own friends who are trying so hard to save him. Even Tsunade, the current Hokage, didn’t know about the Uchiha incident, that is how secretive the elders were. It isn’t their fault that Konoha’s elders decided to hide that knowledge from them, so you can’t say they deserve to die simply because they were not told the truth.

    Also, as I said before, Sasuke had an opportunity to stop being alone. Many people held their hands out to him and he pushed them away by his own choice. You can say that his circumstances were different, but what about Iruka? He didn’t shun Naruto because of the Kyuubi, even though if he adopted Sasuke’s mindset, he could have just as easily killed Naruto in order to kill the Kyuubi and get his revenge. He lost his mother and father as well, which would have been just as painful as Sasuke losing his family, but in the end, he didn’t chose to isolate himself or become bitter because of it.

    He had no family, but he did have others like the Hokage who were there for him and he accepted that. He welcomed the company instead of allowing himself to become hateful.

    In the same vain, Sasuke could have stayed in the village and continued to grow stronger without hurting his friends. I mean for all his betrayals and his turncoat to Orochimaru, Naruto has still became just as strong as him in the end while still remaining loyal to his friends and his village. I think Sasuke is just allowing himself to be blinded and controlled, in the end. First by Orochimaru and then by Madara. If someone offers him a way to gain power, he is all too willing to accept it, even if it means hurting those close to him.

    In the end, I do understand why Sasuke’s character is written as it is. There needs to be that contrast between him and Naruto, because that is what drives the story forward. Sasuke is exactly how he is meant to be for the purpose of the manga and in saying that, I don’t hate him like some people seem to, in that they can’t wait to see him die or disappear. I don’t agree with his choices or ideas, but then, that is what an antagonist is mostly meant to represent, isn’t it? The story needs an antagonist, just like it needs a protagonist, and I think Kishi has done a good job of showing how different mindsets can attain different outcomes.

    In the end, Naruto and Sasuke are simply on different sides of the same coin. I am glad that contrast has been shown, and I understand it, because in the end we as humans decide our own paths, they are not determined solely by our circumstances.

  128. *gets summoned back to life and immidiately puts on emo resistant face mask *

    kabicumaru will be the ultimate villian and kakashi will kill madara XD

  129. @Ahsan, And Tenten and Ino will actually get character development X_X

  130. well that’s the thing with sasuke and naruto. One could always blame sasuke for not patronizing the will of fire, and blaming him for the path he’s chosen, but then it seems to me sasuke is only a pawn of the uchiha- not saying he’s a pawn naturally, just saying he’s fufilling the hate filled destiny of the first son, and of madara, and of the uchiha. However, there’s potential for sasuke, and he might just be the first to change that hate filled destiny of the uchiha clan with help from the child of prophecy- uzumaki naruto. So at the end, it’s all down to the child of prophecy bringing about peace to the ninja world, and sasuke would just be one of the many conformists ready to comply when he comes down to it. Thats why he has the blessing of the S0T6Ps, why he is going to get the kyuubi to work with him like killerbee did, why he is the child of prophecy, why he is uzumaki naruto.

    Speaking of power, one thing that frightens me is what naruto is going to become. In fact i feel he should be given a deeper voice like the first’s or nagato’s because of the overwhelming power he now has. Speed even more terrifying than what we’ve already seen, power enough to kill one person 10 times and 10 people at once with a punch, terrifying chakra that will terrify even the raikage he knelt before to beg for the spread of emo religion, and so much. He could use sage mode to the limit, it would almost be unbelievable. I look forward to that.

  131. Wild theory: Nagato is a red head, Kushina is a red head, Naruto has a connection to the sage of six paths, could their somehow be a connection between Nagato and Kushina? Just a thought.

  132. After reading through the comments I think I’m the only one who isn’t expecting Naruto’s “power up” to amount to a drastic change. Sounds crazy, I know, but I’m still picturing his need for kage bunshins to complete his jutsus. Not only that, but Kishi seems to love giving sasuke all the tricks in the bag and leaves naruto to make do with one or two techs that he can gimmick his way through fights with.

    I’ll be disappointed if it turns out that way but something tells me that sasuke’s new arsenal will be larger in whole than naruto’s, who’ll have to rely on slick execution vs. over-powering technique.

  133. @kizu andahsan. and Hinata will get more panel time, sakura won’t be useless and Ass-uke will be kill by Udon’s snot dripping techinque.

  134. Lol, thanks, people. 🙂

    *notices ongoing war*

    *quietly grabs an Oreo and steps out, munching away*

  135. “As for Sasuke being “weak minded and easily persuaded”. I’ll save that for another debate. >_>”

    Damn it, you’re smarter than you look. Most people would have walked right into that trap… You even ignored my EMO crap insult… Impressive, most impressive…

    *Walks off to work on a new evil master plan*

  136. Has anybody yet contemplated the idea that Naruto could have killed Kyuubi with all the power he gained from him, and because of the power he gained from everyone else?

    Remember when Sasuke has memories of Naruto and Sakura and Kakashi run through his mind while battling Hachibi/Killer Bee? Killer Bee Hachibi Killer Bee (I just noticed how that rhymes)… Well, what if it was at that point he contemplated going backward, but chose to keep going into the darkness instead because he believed that would make him stronger?

  137. BUBBLE: Time to taste Naruto’s special CHOCOLATE JAWBREAKER BALL[S]!

  138. @Tenrai: Well, I already explained how Naruto losing Jiraiya was different to Sasuke losing his family and clan. Sasuke lost everything. Naruto didn’t. Let’s say Naruto lost both Jiraiya and Iruka and let’s pretend all his friends died in a fire. 😦 Would he be hurting worse than just losing Jiraiya or will he feel exactly the same either way? Eh, no matter…that’s just one of the differences really. Just check my post. In the end I believe we’ll have to agree to disagree on this subject anyway.

    Sasuke is on the wrong path due to the choices he made. Lol, I understand that. I also understand how he came to those choices, how he was purposefully manipulated into darkness, and the reasons behind those choices. For we all know choices just don’t come out of thin air. There are reasons and whether one agrees with them or not doesn’t change the situation and how the person affected feels about it. I understand his situation, so while I may not support his choices I understand how his situation led him to those choices. Tis’ is all. ^_- Oh no, his circumstances don’t excuse his more extreme actions. That’s no way to think, but no one should ignore them either. 😉

    @Iamnotreallyhere: I’ve heard that one before actually and it isn’t to bad. They’re both from water countries and they both have red hair. Coincidence? >_>

    @1redbaron1: “Damn it, you’re smarter than you look.”

    NANI!? O_O I got the Wrath gravatar to make me look B.A. and in commemoration of the final FMA chapter, but I didn’t know it’d make me look dumb! xD

  139. I think if Naruto lost both Iruka and Jiraiya, he would feel numb for at least a little bit, as though in denial, until he finally lost it. Similar to the moment before he believed he lost Hinata.

    And thanks for combining my posts, Super.

    No problemo.
    -Super

  140. Wow, Tenrai sure can write some wordy comments ->-‘

    Well, I think if Naruto lost Iruka, he’d go into a ballistic, yet rather subdued state of insane. I think it would hurt more than losing Jiraiya did, or even IF he lost, say, Kakashi or one of his best friends, like Shikamaru (yes, they ARE best friends). Irukla meant the most to him in the beginning, because he’s the only one who cared for him, nurtured him and protected him in the beginning, so it would put a permanent black hole in the place of his heart, where the wounds of losing Sasuke and Jiraiya would be cut up into nothing that could compare to his immortal sorrow.

  141. @Superdude, I really didnt want to resort to using this, but your love of all things (Sasu)gay have pushed me over the edge! 🙂

    http://i643.photobucket.com/albums/uu151/Cruherrx/2549809582_8b8fa23956.jpg?t=1277524665

    Let’s see you like Sasugay after that >:)

  142. @ Kisu, =))=))=)) LOLLLLLL, super u have to admit that was one well timed attack by Kisu :))):))

  143. Man 500 better be extra long…

  144. Pfffft, another mere cheap shot at the awesomeness that is Sasuke. T_T

    @Devour: I have a feeling it’s going to be the regular amount of pages but it’s most likely going to be awesome!

  145. Sasugay/Sasuke = Sassy uke of gay sauce.

  146. hey i was wondering do you guys think PAIN/NAGATO could be put in a genjutsu? also who do you think would win, pain or sasuke?

  147. Yes, pain can be put in a genjitsu, as we have seen in his battle against Jiriya.

    And i personally think susake would lose to pain. Naruto barely beat him, and that was with the foxs help, intell, and pain not trying to kill him.

  148. let me correct you marks

    “”Naruto couldn’t beat/kill pein”, and that was with the foxs help, intell, and pain not trying to kill him.”

  149. . . . .

    Thank you?

  150. @marksman But through sound not visual. I think ass-uke(is what you get when you switch the first two letters of sasuke’s name) could be put in the same genjutsu as well.

  151. Will, In the filler arc Ibiki used a Genjitsu on the female pain.

    It didn’t get him very far though. <_<

  152. Just being Random but I bet ya Danzou is in Kabutos last coffin.

  153. @Marksman, that was a ninjutsu, or more accurately, a summoning lol

  154. @Dricedt: Actually, we had one debate like that a few breakdowns back. I think Pain took it based on votes, too. I also think it’s just because people hate Sasuke like that. >_>

    @Kisuzachi: Whoa, what are you doing out of your casket?

    *watches him pop out of the ground like a zombie, screaming*
    *stares*
    *grabs shoulders and pushes him back down*
    *proceeds to pick nose*

    Oh! Congrats on your graduation, jo!

  155. I think if it was Sasuke as strong as he was when he was fighting Danzou, he would have probably lost to Pein. I am not sure about now, seeing as how he has just most likely attained the EMS, but we will have to wait and see how much power that grants him before we can really tell.

    I don’t think there are many shinobi one could actually list that could beat Pein, if any can be fairly listed right now. I wouldn’t put names like Madara or Hashirama forward either, because we still don’t know the full extent of their power when they are at full strength, so it would be a debate built mostly upon assumptions at best.

  156. Since this whole Sasuke vs Pain debate started AGAIN, I do have something on my mind that could beat Pain.

    If Sasuke has the EMS now there’s no more blinding to be afraid of is there, so amaterasu, tsukuyome and susanoo are jutsu he can use a hell of a lot from now on without looking at the risks, but theres one more thing Sasuke could gain that could put both Nagato and Naruto in trouble and that is Izanagi.

    If I remember wright one could use Izanagi for 30 or 60 sec before this jutsu rendered your eyes blind from use. Well Sasuke won’t have that problem seeing as he has the EMS and can no longer go blind, so he can use Izanagi for as long as his chakra permits him to, without thinking of the effects of the jutsu.

  157. @tenrai: we also haven’t seen Nagato’s full power.

    @pain genjutsu debate: the six paths of pain can be put under genjutsu. sasuke though can only put get one of them at a time…and, even though we don’t have proof, i’m pretty sure that the pains could break out of it if nagato severs the link for like a second: http://naruto.wikia.com/wiki/Genjutsu

    @kisuzachi: LMAO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  158. @ Eugen,

    No, Izanagi closes one sharingan eye every time it’s used. It doesn’t matter if that eye has the eternal mangekyo. Izanagi closes the eye permanently.
    http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/479/04/

  159. @BlackBusterBoom: I’m going for Madara’s real body residing inside that coffin. That or Kabuchimaru revived Dracula…or even worse…a Twilight vampire. They’ll sparkle and blind you. That’s why the Uchiha are extra afraid of them. ~_~

  160. @ redbaron, actually that’s the whole point I was trying to make, that in the case of the EMS, for with only madara was know’en to have, the effects of this very harmful jutsus might be less then nothing.

    It clearly states that the EMS doesn’t go blind by madara himself, maybe he didn’t refer to the izanagi in particular, but is prolonged use of the Susanoo, Amaterasu and Tsukuyome don’t provoke blindness why would the Izanagi do it.

    It is said that the Izanagi was the Uchiha’s forbidden jutsu a jutsu not even they used, but just as I’ve said before Madara was the only EMS user out there so people can’t know the risks of Izanagi on the EMS unless Madara used it and talked to somebody about it witch is unlikely.

    So for my part I keep to my theory that the EMS can’t go blind at all no matter what jutsus are used.
    Sure there are always risks when using powerful jutsus, just like Nagato’s summon or Tsunade’s Creation Rebirth jutsu or even Narutos close kombat rassen shuriken.
    But the point I’m trying to make is that no one knows the extent of the EMS, and if u ask me, when u reach perfection of the sharingan you can be for damn sure that’s gonna be an Awesome power with few drawbacks.
    Just like the jinchuriki’s perfect host, just take a look at Bee and from now on at Naruto. This guys can defeat there entire villages on there own if they wanted to and no one would come close to stopping hem, just like Sasuke, there’s no point in achieving something so powerful if theres something u can’t do with it.

  161. @Pickles, I do Bleach now. That means previously established facts (plot) are disregarded when something needs to get done, so my previous death means NOTHING!

  162. “or even worse…a Twilight vampire.They’ll sparkle and blind you” ROFLMAO!!!!!! Superdude, you need to remember that sparkling skin is the skin of a kille- BAHAHAHA! *wipes tears from laughing so hard* Sorry, I couldnt say that with a straight face lol

  163. @ Eugene, the sharingan eye closes after using the forbidden eye technique. It is just a theory that it doesn’t effect those with eternal Ms. If it didn’t, am pretty sure Tobi would have mentioned it while describe the Izanagi.

    After the tech, the sharingan eye closes, period. It doesn’t have the same effects as the ms technique do that make you go blind.

    Actually, the effect is alot worse. And to be honest, i still think pain would beat sasuke even with his ems. But only time will tell.

  164. Maybe that’s what happened to Madara perhaps when he was beaten by the first he used the Izanagi to escape leaving him with only the one eye.

  165. hmm… i was just wondering that did anyone else notice this weard “coincidence”:
    1. http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_7u9gMhrSm6Y/TBksNorsmhI/AAAAAAAALnc/rMqPdT8RE4Y/s1600/13.png
    2. http://naruto.wikia.com/wiki/Sage_of_the_Six_Paths

    in both pictures, naruto and sage of the six paths, have the same pendant pattern… the six of those dots around his neck…. Weard, ha? But is there some deeper meaning….? 😀 Can’t wait…..

  166. …since kimimaru is already almost a chick, zabuza would win hands down as he would manipulate kimi into a slumber party where they can paint their toes black and red.

    then zabuza would unleash a hidden mist and rip them bones out of kimi and thus win beast wars..

    😛

  167. Does anyone else feel that the qb’s chakra pool isn’t as much of an ‘upgrade’ to Naruto’s powers as it used to be?
    The kyuubi’s chakra used to be a very strong feature that made naruto at least ‘double’ as strong, but now that he has beaten the qb, the powerup can’t possibly make him double as strong since he’s now stronger than the qb himself. Obviously there’s hundreds of possible things that are (partially) (un)true about this.. I just feel that, although the fox’s power has been possibly his strongest feature all throughout the series, it no longer is so now that he aquired it. It’s a nice upgrade, nonetheless :p

  168. cifixier, yeah dude, that’s the sage of 6 paths necklace and both Naruto and God realm aka Yahiko had them on @ the neck.

    http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/499/13/
    http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/438/14/
    http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/438/17/

    I’m not sure but I think even Nagato had one too. the represent all 6 paths of something, pain, chakra, nature elements and yin yang, what ever. So for someone who can use all the 6 paths of this elements he is granted this necklace.

    So I guess from now on Naruto can use all natural elements plus light and dark just like Yamato said here: http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/316/09/

    I’m guessing that the yin and yang are what you would call shikamaru’s shadow jutsu if I’m not mistaken, in regard that it use the shadow instead of an natural element.
    Guess we’ll just have to wait and see.

  169. “since he’s now stronger than the qb himself” There’s so much wrong with that sentence lol. I’ll let someone else tell ya though, FB NEEDS ME!

  170. @zz: It’s not so much a battle of who has stronger chakra, but more of willpower, resolve, and love conquering hate – all the attributes that make up the younger son of the Rikudo Sage! 😀

    http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/462/12/

    @eugen: Izanagi seems more like a technique that short circuits reality with genjutsu thus the eye shuts down forever. It’s a technique that gives the user a very powerful counter attack(If someone attacks with a finishing move, then they will prob have the worst attack opening immediately after). EMS protects the user from going blind but it would not make sense if it allowed Izanagi. There is a difference between wear and tear versus a complete overload. Otherwise, Madera would be using it all the time, right?. He wouldn’t need Zetsu for body parts!

    @anyone: Who thinks the moon’s eye plan is Madera’s true intention?

  171. @ visionary, yeah I guess I overlooked the fact that just as u and Marks said the eyes are closed 4 ever. While I was under the impression that it’s a fast blindness that comes once the time interval for izanagi expires, so in other words I misunderstood the differences between the blindness and the closing of the eyes, and thus thinking is was almost the same thing only at a faster pace regarding Izanagi.

    But my question still remains,what if the EMS can counter that, or at least prolong the time period in with u can use Izanagi before it closes.
    And thatwhichisbored had a good point, what if Madara indeed used Izanagi right before Hashirama’s fatal blow and now only has one eye due to the fact that the other closed on that particular incident.

    But between u and me I stop’ed thinking Tobi is Madara ever since the casket incident with Kabuto, so it could go both ways.

  172. Hi guys, it’s been a while.

    I want to say something about Pain vs. Sasuke but I’ll be short cuse I have limited internet at the moment.

    I’ll begin with the statement that Pain would loose against EMS Sasuke. The paths are just too limiting for him to have a chance. Not stabbed by the statue Nagato on the other hand is a whole different story. I. Personally believe the rinnegan has an edge on the EMS.

    Unfortunally I’ll debate further when I get to my typewriter :p

  173. @Eugen: If anything, Madera is probably scheming to transplant his arsenal of sharingans into his new lackeys so they can control their bijuu. “Tobi” probably also needs the eyes for Izanagi so he can transplant the bijuu into their bodies without dying. This is a great example of how the Uchiha think. Instead of working with nature, they want to man-handle it and get what they want resulting in these abominations. BTW!! I think he actually wants Naruto to defeat the temporary Jinchuurikis and thus store the bijuu in himself(the proverbial “fattening of the pig”). Why? Because otherwise the bijuus would run a muck! All will go well for our young hero until he suddenly has all nine bijuus and Madera does a bait and switch on him! Madera probably knows about Naruto’s four element seal as well. So I think he wants Naruto to kill Sasuke just like I thought he wanted Naruto to kill Pain as well. As far as I remember, I didn’t see “Tobi” help Pain out. When making predictions of Madera I like to think “What would the Emperor(in Star Wars) do?” Oh, and I also noticed that necklace on Yahiko is more like something he’s wearing from his own sense of entitlement where as Naruto’s necklace is part of his new chakra system created by the fusion between his four element seal and the fox chakra. So what this could mean is that “Tobi” is indirectly after the four element seal! 😮

  174. @to63, I say God Realm, Animal Realm, Hungry Ghost, Human Realm, Hell Realm and Demon Realm would be more than enough to handle Sasuke, no matter what his EMS gives him. PAIN FOREVER!!!

  175. @to63to Everything that Ass-uke throw would be repelled/absorbed by by: Tendo and Gakido respectively.

  176. @kantokage

    We were shown that both of these paths can be easily beaten with the right tactic. As we all know, Sasuke is quite capable of mustering complicated maneuvers in the heat of battle. Furthermore, with his EMS he is bound to be stronger than Naruto at the time he fought Pain so I don’t really see a reson why Sasuke wouldn’t be able to beat Them. There is also the fact we know nothing of the EMS and that it’s only known user manipulated Pain like a toy which means that he is strong enough to defend himself if Pain found out. I still say that the paths are too limited in capabillities to beat sasuke. Nagato on the other hand has every chance in doing so. Remember he can use each of the 5 chakra types including the ying-yang (i spelled this wrong, right?) one, whatever
    it is.

    @kisu
    First, where is your proof of that. This nothing more than wild guess based on your biased opinion of both Sasuke and Pain. You know, reality doesn’t care what you belive in, it only appreciates raw facts. You good sir have no knowledge of the EMS so you, or me, or anyone else can’t really tell what emo queen is capable of. Whatever it is though, it is sure to be far more powerful than we think. It is sasuke after all- overpowered in every aspect, except where it counts, if you know what I mean. 😀

  177. @ Pein vs Sasuke – Even I am skeptical of Pein’s ability but in the end he is above life and death and we havn’t actually fully seen the extent of all the paths at full power, though EMS for us at the moment is also guess work so lets take a look and see…

  178. If Pein is a god, what does that make Chuck Noris? O_o

    *Looks up the definition of Chuck Noris in dictionary.*

    *Dictionary sets on fire because of overwhelming power.* Well, it was worth a try. T__T

  179. Actually, now that the paths of Pein have been mentioned, it brings up the question of how powerful Nagato would have been in his original body, without relying on his puppets to battle for him.

    From what we can tell in the flashbacks, Nagato was able to use every single mainstream jutsu in existence. He was also shown using the shinra Tensei as well. So it stands to reason that in his original body, he could use the power of all his paths and just about every other jutsu that exists that isn’t restricted to a specific bloodline.

    That also makes me wonder why Nagato weakened himself the way he did…

    Anyway, the biggest question of them all is… if he was really outside of life and death and if he is able to bring people back from the dead, why didn’t he just bring back Yahiko right after he died? O_o

    *Starts walking away but falls into huge plot hole.*

    GAH!!! Who put that there???? T__T

  180. PARODY ALERT!!!!

    *Nagato finally arrives in heaven after giving up his life in Konoha and sees Yahiko waiting for him at the pearly gates, highly irate.*

    Nagato: Hey Yahiko!!! It’s so good to finally see you again after all these years! *Tears in eyes.*

    *Yahiko walks up to Nagato and slaps him in the face*

    Nagato: O__O!

    Yahiko: YOU IDIOT! Why did you just leave me dead like that?

    Nagato: Wha… I don’t understand. You forced me to kill you, it wasn’t my fault. T__T

    Yahiko: *slaps forehead*. You really are dumb, aren’t you? Did you really think I would just off myself like that for no reason? I knew they wouldn’t let Konan go even after I died, I’m not that stupid. It was a part of ‘THE PLAN’ you numb skull!!! All you had to do was bring me back to life after everyone thought I was dead and it would have all been fine. Didn’t you see me winking at you?

    Nagato: I…. I wasn’t thinking…

    Yahiko: Yeah, you weren’t. All you had to do was bring me back, but NOOEEEE, you had to go all emo and flip out. >__<

    *Yahiko eats Nagato*

  181. @Tenrai: I think Nagato didn’t bring Yahiko back to life because he didn’t have the life-force (or, in other words, the worms that come out of people) that he takes from people with his King of Hell or Outer Path jutsu. http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/426/03/

    I don’t think he stole people’s life-force during the civil war (before Yahiko died), but if he did then he really was an idiot because he didn’t revive Yahiko with it.

    I think he revived the people of Konoha with the life-force he stole from them AND the life-force of his enemies in the Amegakure civil war after Yahiko died.

  182. @Dragon

    If he needs life force or souls to use to bring people back to life, he stole plenty in the battle against Danzou’s and Hanzou’s forces. I doubt he needed more than that to bring only one person back to life if he does in fact need that at all.

    He also had enough time as well, because he brought Kakashi back quite some time after he died, even after the entire battle with Naruto. I don’t see why the same wouldn’t apply to Yahiko.

  183. @Tenrai

    Maybe he hadn’t developed that technique yet. Just because he can use any non-bloodline jutsu doesn’t mean he mustn’t learn them first. But then again, there are many single use jutsus like the death god that make you wonder how the hell did you learn them without practice.

  184. SPOILER ALERT

    Hey guys this was all I could dig up for now.

    VERIFICATION: CONFIRMED

    SPOILER #1
    CREDITS: Ohana

    仮面の暗部(多分マダラ)
    赤ちゃんナルト抱っこしてる

    またあとで来る

    There’s an Anbu mask (Probably Madara)
    Baby Naruto is being carried.

    More will come later.

    SPOILER #2
    CREDITS: Ohana

    出産は極秘だった

    が、ミコトが赤ちゃん(サスケ)を連れクシナの前に
    2人は友達

    クシナ、ミコトで出産て痛かった~~女の話。

    出産の際、九尾が出てくるかもしれない(封印が弱まる)から
    ミナトも立ち会い

    痛がるクシナ
    暗部数名部屋の前で待機

    生まれる 10月10日

    封印が弱まる、封印し直そうとミナト

    赤ちゃん(ナルト)暗部の仮面した奴にとられる

    仮面『人柱から離れろ、さもないとこの赤ん坊は』

    サーセイ★
    詳しく読んでくる

    TRANSLATED BY: agony

    i’ll summarise things up.

    Giving birth to naruto is top secret.

    Mikoto bring the baby(sasuke) to kushina’s place.

    Maybe due to giving birth,the seal controlling kyuubi became weaker.

    kushina felt pain and there were some ANBU guarding outside the room.

    October 10,naruto was born.

    The seal was remade again by minato again.so tat the seal would regain its power again.

    one of the ANBU steal naruto away.

    SPOILER #3
    CREDITS: Crush

    Slightly more detailed Translation.

    Naruto’s birth was carried out in secret.

    But, Mikoto and Kushina were friends, so Mikoto was
    allowed to bring baby Sasuke to where Naruto was to be born.

    Mikota and Kushina have a woman’s conversation (About the pain of birth).

    At the time of birth, the Kyuubi threatens to escape fro Kushina (due to the weakening of the seal), so Minato makes an appearance.

    Kushina was in great pain, and Anbu stand by (on alert) right outside the room.

    Naruto was born on October 10th.

    The seal was greatly weakened, so Minata attempted to fix it.

    Baby Naruto is taken by a masked Anbu; seperated from his parents, otherwise he will be the next human sacrifice.

    That’s it.
    Read it if you want to learn more. 😉

    Edit: Not entirely sure about the last line. It involves the ANBU saying some cryptic line about taking the child from human sacrifices.

    http://www.edgarluvitug.com/2010/06/naruto-chapter-500-spoilers.html

  185. “there are many single use jutsus like the death god that make you wonder how the hell did you learn them without practice.” This is a question that will never be answered lol

    @Tenrai, LMFAO

    @to63, my proof is simple. Sharingan always gives ninjutsu and genjutsu, both of which are ineffective against Pain.

  186. @To63to: Nagato has all 6 elements. The 6th one having something to do with Yin and Yang. I don’t think it’s really an “element” but I’m just going off of what Jiraiya said and he said he had all 6 elements.

    @Tenrai: Lol, what To63to said. He probably hadn’t developed that technique yet or mastered his Rinnengan to the extent we saw when he attacked Konoha.

    @Kisu: I’m pretty sure as soon as we get more insight into the power of Sasuke’s EMS we’ll see what he can truly do to Pein. I’m not saying the EMS will make a difference regarding whether Preta Path can absorb his jutsus or not. I’m just saying there’s no point in assuming a victor when we haven’t even seen a glimpse of Sasuke’s new powers. Besides, you seem to be set on thinking it’s impossible for Sasuke to develop a strategy (Sasuke of all people) to destroy Preta Path without ninjutsu.

    Lol, and how can you say ninjutsu is ineffective against Pein when 5/6 of his bodies were in fact taken down by…? 😉

  187. @Trek

    Kisu’s in love Pein. He’d defend him until Hell froze over and then some. 😛

    Anyways, I think Sasuke could beat Pein with Ninjutsu. He also has Tsukiyomi and all that crap. As much as I hate to admit it, he could take down Pein easily.

  188. @Superdude, those were special circumstances were they not? lol

    @cookie, well the general consensus is that Sasuke can’t. Wanna debate? >:)

  189. Sure, I guess I’ll debate.

  190. @Kisu what do you have against Sasuke? O_o I think that he’s awesome. In pain, yes. Chose the wrong way, yes. But still awesome. >:D A good good manga/anime needs a good villain. And who would have been better than the main character’s best friend/old best friend?

  191. BUBBLITION!:

    DON’T F*CK WITH THE KYUUBI!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  192. @Kushina: I completely agree with you. Every good manga needs a strong, unbeatable, attractive (sexy for the fangirls and supertrek 😉 XD) and evil villain.
    Just look at Aizen-SAMAAAAAA!!! XD 😛

  193. Well I think we can all agree that Sasuke went from a boring character with nothing really defining him to a complex character after learning about his past and motivations. Around that time no really disliked him out and out and few were looking for emo boy neck. These was the days when Naruto was just plain weak and Sakura had potential. As the character is being built we all find our own reason for liking or diliking them.

    From the establishing how he is driven and his rationale I could understand why he had to go after Itachi. It was like something out of kill bill and in kill bill, and we know bill had to die. To be fair, I liked it better than the lets be friends after you try to kill me approach that naruto has.

    All the way up to the Sasuke + Itachi showdown his movements made sense and his action justified to a degree (including the attack of his stalkers to ditch them). He after all was not just driven by his own desire but the injustice that faced his entire clan.

    After the whole showdown he exacted the revenge he had every right to desire against his brother and learned the “truth” about Itachi. This is for me when my opinion of Sasuke changed.

    Then somewhere between learning that news and his fight marathon he went from complex character who you could decipher to a random, bipolar ninja who got even more tempremental by the battle. By the end of the battle royal he was bat shit crazy and did make any sense at all.

    I get that all that conflicting information messed up his head but Sasuke comes across as having hissy fits rather being confused. Then it dawned on most the haters by this point but certainly me that Sasuke is an asshole. Before his jackass tendencies could be offset by his past but that selfish streak in him grew outta control. He thinks of himself only of himself. His revenge symbolise his feeling of injustice against him. The days of saving anyone but himself had long since forgotten.

    Sasuke although a punk bitch is vital to the manga and is better for having him in it. But it doesn’t mean I have to like him. Many people have there own reasons to like or dislike him aside from mine or pick on him cos it fun. I think of it like the theatre when you boo the bad guy on stage. It probably means his character is done well and who says your meant to like Sasuke any way. Kishi has manipulated my opinion on him like he did with Gaara. Although I liked Gaara better when he was like something horror flick. But everyone face it Sasuke is ann asshole.

  194. meh i wrote a long ass comment and it didnt get through well imma keep it short this time

    @super

    even if sasugay gets ems he is no match for pain i can bet on that

    @kushina

    sorry aint gonna list the reasons again but in short he is an assh%$£ and is cocky and that too when he has no powers of his own everything of itachi or what kakashi taught him or what he absorbed from oro or what kishi gifts him ( like unlimited chakra , like summoning manda out of nonwhere in a second that too when he is out of chakra a guy is exploding infront of him and then uses a “space time ninjutsu ” wonder how he did that so fast and how he got the chakra ? kishi’s love is the ansswer

  195. Ok, first of all this is my opinion.

    Well I have a lot of criticisms about Sasuke’s “decent into darkness”. It didn’t “flow”, it felt forced, rushed somehow. Compare Anakin’s decent into the dark side with Sasuke’s, or Vegeta’s fall to Babidi’s darkness. In the aforementioned cases, it felt natural and one could really sympathize with them. Sasuke really had NO reason to want to exterminate Konoha. This is where Kishi f*cked up in my book. Someone doesnt just hear a story and suddenly switch to the dark side. It took Chancellor Palpatine 13 years to turn Anakin to the dark side, and it took Vegeta 7 to want to go back to the darkness, it took Sasuke about three days. His character isnt deep or complex. His character has been described:

    1. IGN characterized Sasuke as “the resident emo-kid” due to his cold and serious personality, and found it difficult to have a degree of empathy for his character.

    2. GameSpot extolled Sasuke’s abilities as “badass,” although echoing IGN’s comments concerning his personality.

    3. T.H.E.M. Anime Reviews noted that Sasuke fell into the stereotypical “rival” mold of several other shōnen manga, and found him, along with several of the other characters, to not be likable.

    (These are copied from wikipedia. There are a few that praise Sasuke’s character though)

    Every series deserves a good villain, but Sasuke isnt it. In my book, Sasuke will always be the whiny, annoying emo kid that switches sides whenever something doesnt go the way he wanted it to (Konoha–>Oro–>Akatsuki). Pain was a deeper character and could have served as the series’ final villain because he shared so much in common with Naruto and exemplifies what constant war can do to someone, while Sasuke’s actions have alienated most of his ex-supporters because what he’s doing just doesnt make sense. You’re clan that nearly caused a war got killed and you want revenge on everyone despite knowing that your actions will have dire consequences for everyone else? I reiterate, Sasuke isnt a deep character or complex, I’d even say the villain from Power Rangers Jungle Fury was deeper and more complex than him.

  196. I blame Akira Toriyama for creating Vegeta. Almost every Shonen series has a carbon-copy of Vegeta, and Naruto falls into this. Sasuke is a watered down lamer version of the proud Saiyan Prince.

    That ends my rant.

  197. 100 Awesomeness points for kisu !!!

    sasugay haters FTEW

  198. Sasuke is a watered down lamer version of the proud Saiyan Prince.

    id say no …. vegeta had pride and he stood by it he was a true warrior sasugay doesnt even fall into the catagory of a watered down lamer version of vegeta . vegeta was a true warrior @_@

  199. Screw this, I’m continuing my rant >:)

    Next thing I hate about Sasuke’s character are his constant power-ups. Back in Part 1 of the series, he was bitching about being weaker than Naruto instead of doing what Lee or Naruto did, TRAIN! Instead he went to Oro for a free power-up. Then he gets CS2 and is suddenly pumped up to the point he can face 1/9 of the Kyubi’s power. Then ever since Part 2 he just gets one free power-up after another. Its really annoying. People sympathize with characters that work hard. That’s the sole reason Hinata has any fans at all, or Lee, or Naruto. IF Sasuke put his all into training and was still squarely weaker, THEN he would have a good reason to join Oro. Vegeta trained at 400 times the Earth’s gravity, while Goku only trained at 100 times, but he still couldnt surpass Goku which is why he became Majin Vegeta. Anakin went to the dark side for the power to save his wife. I could probably find more but meh, I’m done 4 now.

  200. so u say that u hate him cuz he’s emo? O_o wow… just woow

  201. @Kisu

    Indeed your analisys of Sasukes personality is true but how does that hold any relevance to his abillities. The manga has what both Pain amd Sasuke are capable of, it has also showns us that Pain can be, and in fact was, defeated. You can argue that he wasn’t trying to kill Naruto but that doesn’t change the fact he ultimately lost. Furthemore Pain himself said that had Jirayia have any prior knowledge of his abillities he would have lost.

    Firstly, Sasuke is rolling with Madara so he is bound to have info on Pain. Secondly we have absolutely no idea what the EMS does. Just because Pains abillities worked on normal attacks doesn’t necesserely mean they would on Ems ones.

    The paths, in reality lack what is reqiured to effectively battle an opponent like Sasuke-i.e. variety. They are just overly specialised weapon platforms, which albeit extremely potent, have only one strength and many weaknesses. Naruto already showed us that over relliance on one thing leads only to defeat.

    I still think that Sasuke will loose, but for that to happen Nagato must fight as himself, not as Pain. This will give him the needed versatility needed to fight Sasuke. This will also enable him to use the rinnegan at its fullest potential.

  202. i always hear “the 6th element/path got something to do with yin ang yang”. that makes no sense somehow. u know u didnt even analyze the paths if u say the 5 others are standing for elements, the 5 paths would have to be like kakuzus minions (hearts) but they use technics that dont have any connection to elements.
    the whole world is about yin ang yang and chakra itself can be any element, cuz of CHAKRA MANIPULATION. that means chakrs consists of both yin AND yang chakra and manipulation means that u just mix these 2 in some direction to get a jutsu out of it, that means a jutsu is a combination of yin and yang chakra.
    the 6 paths dont mean that the user can use 6 elements, i think the element thing is a side-effect of the rinnegan, they say nagato and his rinnegan was a mutation, maybe its like a kekkei genkai mutation as the user got a natural affinity not to a mix of 2 or more elements (becuz of his natural affinity) but more hes like capable of manipulating his chakra in 5 directions. we cant be sure whats the 6th element, but all elements consist of yin and/or yang chakra.
    and thinking again, the rinnegan would be sooo perfect for naruto 😀
    it doesnt make sense for 1 person, didnt u see that? ok u can use 6 elements and all technics in one and so on, but the shared field of vision only makes sense (and perfect use) with many ppl (for example six like pain did). u ask why naruto? answer: shadow clones.
    1000 ppl with a shared field of vision omg 😀

  203. Pain can be, and in fact was, defeated. You can argue that he wasn’t trying to kill Naruto but that doesn’t change the fact he ultimately lost.

    man seriosly how many times do i have to say pein didnt loose to naruto he killed himself even if you forget everything (that he had wasted all his chakra in pwning an entire village and that he wasnt trying to kill naruto ) still naruto COULDNT BEAT PEIN

    im not saying pein isnt beatable im just saying that pein is above the level of everything we have ever seen or have been told about in the manga that is named naruto 😛

  204. @Kisu

    “People sympathize with characters that work hard. That’s the sole reason Hinata has any fans at all, or Lee, or Naruto.”

    If you want to pick on Hinata, go back to Shannaro. 😛

  205. @kizu and ahsan Sasuke is a Frieza nuff said.

  206. dont make fun of Vegeta by comparing him to Sasugay..
    the only one that reminded me of Vegeta was Sasori and that was a good thing..

    DONT BELIEVE IT!!!!!!!

  207. Lol, last time I checked it took Sasuke 7-8 years to descend into darkness. It was no overnight flip of the switch. His turning to the influences of Itachi was heavily covered Pre-Shippuden and when he learned of the truth behind Itachi in Shippuden he just finally snapped. It’s obvious his mental condition isn’t healthy and he does train hard no matter how much it’s denied. Lol, and yes he’s an asshole!

    But he’s still awesome sauce. 😛 Opinions people, remember they’re like assholes. Everyone has them. ^_^ That phrase is mostly used for “excuses” though…>_> Don’t make me talk about how Pein was turned by a book after years of ambition and planning. Complex character right there for ya or just a crappy end to an arc. ~_~

    As for the debate…I still think it’s silly to put current Sasuke up against Pein when we haven’t seen Sasuke’s new powers and improvements yet. xD

  208. Super….I must say I love your new genjutsu(No homo). You managed to trap every body in it . LOL!!! I almost want to try my own. I ll save it for later….Besides everybody knows Rock lee owns both of them(and quickly ). Not only that but they(both)stole his jutsu!!!

  209. I was just reading through some past chapters and wondered, who gave Sasuke a Falcon contract? Has he trained with someone who used birds (i guess in secret) or idk what but i think summons are big deals that don;t just comout of the blue. Anyway WHERES 500???!!!

  210. @super he is still an easily manipulated douche.

  211. http://mangastream.com/read/naruto/87110441/1 FINALLY!!!!

  212. DAMN YOU MADARA and HOLY SHIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIITTTTTTTTTTT *passes out*

  213. @kisu

    If it was only a case of people sympathising with characters that work hard, then Lee would be the most popular character in Naruto. But he isn’t now, is he? And I doubt those who like Lee only do because he works hard. People like Naruto because of his character, not just because he works hard.

    He is compassionate, brave and he stands up for what he believes in. He is willing to put himself on the line to help someone in need and he isn’t afraid to speak out when he feels something is wrong, even if it means putting himself in a negative light. He works hard to become stronger, but he also does so with others in mind and he doesn’t use ways that would end up hurting or betraying those close to him. He stands as a good example of the type of person many of us could look up too, even though he also makes mistakes.

    Now, maybe you prefer the type of role model who kills thousands of innocents for his own glorified sense of justice (aka Pein), but not everyone is going to share those tastes. But that doesn’t mean it is alright to cheapen Naruto’s character by saying that he only has fans due to the sole fact that people sympathise with him for working hard. I believe in the ideal of being good to those around me and if people want to point fingers at me and call it idealism, that is fine. At least I know that I am making at least someone smile and that is more than worth the effort. How many smiling faces does killing someone bring out?

    (P.S. Sorry if that sounded too forward. I get a bit passionate about certain subjects).

  214. honestly I don’t know why Kishi made us wait 2 weeks when this chapter could have been over and done with a week before, and he cut us out just at the most interesting part.

    Damn u kishi and your manipulative mind.

    Other then that the chapter was pretty str8 forward, not much to be said about it other then the cool fact that the uzumakis and the senjuu are related and also that the uzumaki clan has a long life span and are good at sealing jutsu, maybe Naruto will inherit some of those traits latter on.

  215. so it looks like Sasuke’s mom may have advised her family [Madara] that the current jinchuuriki is about to give birth.. as Kushina ran into her and told her…

  216. also big YAY!!! Tobi is BACK!!!!!!! W000T!!!! that crazy mofo is going to team up with Zombie Deidara…

  217. idk but those arms of toby look pretty young and healthy no signs of oldness in his hands…more clues maybe???

  218. Did the remark at the end of the chapter suggested we’ll get to see Tobi/Madara’s face next time??
    I hope we will, but I know for a fact that he’ll be holding on to that mask at least till the uchiha massacre, because he had the same one when he met with Itachi right before the slaughter.

  219. @Eugen

    Kishi also needs his breaks I suppose. One thing about working in a publishing industry (and I know this for a fact) is that it extremely strenuous.

    As in, you normally end up working up to 8pm every night on a good day (sometimes through the night on a bad day) and just about every weekend. So yeah, the guy may need a break every now and again. He has to push out those chapters quickly enough for them to go to print and before he can even take a breather, he is already working on the next one. It’s not like he is only drawing, he is also writing, brain storming and drafting ideas.

    He has to work far ahead to stop the story from toppling over and if that means he needs a weeks break now and again to get his thoughts back again, I think we as readers need to be more understanding of that. It is a cut throat industry, believe me. People just don’t understand it, that’s why it is easy to complain.

  220. As for the chapter, I thought it was great. There was a lot of suspense at the end there and yet another epic “OMG!!!! NOOOEEEESSSS” cliffhanger at the end.

    I swear, if I die of a heart attach anytime soon, I’ll know what the likely cause is. <_<

    I also liked that this chapter put a lot of theories to bed. A lot of people were wondering if Naruto maybe had some Senju blood in him and now we know that is the case. The Uzumaki and Senju clans are distantly related by blood, and they had particularly strong chakras and life force.

    In fact, I recall Madara saying that the descendants of the younger son were the Senju, but that doesn’t mean they are the only descendants or even the closest descendants. Does anyone think that the Uzumaki may actually be closer to the youngest son genetically than the Senju? It says they are related by blood, but it doesn't say which is closer to the Sage's youngest son, so that might actually be the case.

    It would also explain the long lives of the Uzumaki, because of their vitality and body would have been inherited from the Sage when he gave those blessings to his youngest son. It also makes more sense and fits the description more than any special properties we have seen in the Senju. Out of the Senju, only Hashirama seemed to be exceptionally special and and only he was known to be able to control the Kyuubi out of all the Senju, so maybe he was just closer to the Uzumaki in blood than the rest of the Senju or perhaps he was just a special case.

    He was also the only one who could use Mokuton, so I doubt that is a special power passed through blood from the youngest son of the sage so much as just a mutation.

    Another thing that gets me is that if the Uzumaki clan is so respected in Konoha, why is it never talked about like the Uchiha clan or the Hyuuga clan. The younger generation doesn't even seem to be aware of it, or anyone for that matter and yet everyone is wearing their symbol in honor of them.

    Naruto wasn't shown any respect as an Uzumaki even though his namesake clearly identified him as one, while the Uchiha were practically worshiped and even the Hyuuga were praised.

    I guess being a Jinchuuriki overshadows anything good about you…

  221. One last thing… (Sorry about all the comments).

    I didn’t think that Konoha would make Jinchuuriki willingly so I was a bit surprised when I learned that they had three including Naruto, but I think it is clear that they didn’t do it for power so much as to keep that power from being used by someone who would harm the village.

    I mean, normally Jinchuuriki are a representation of a nations power, so any country that has one would make it well known so that they appear more powerful to other countries. Yet Konoha kept theirs a secret even from their own people. I mean, not even Jiraiya knew about Kushina being a host, because he was also questioning whether it had been summoned by Madara.

    I guess it just shows you how secretive it was if Minato’s own mentor didn’t even know everything about him or his wife. Even still, I do find it odd that they resealed it into another host rather than just letting it die with its first host, so they must have kept it as a defensive “just in case something happens” measure as well.

    I wonder if they would have intended to seal it in Naruto next regardless of whether Madara attacked or not. Clearly Naruto became a Jinchuuriki out of desperation, but there is a chance he may have become one regardless. Then again, at least he would have then had parents to love him and guide him through it rather than just being alone.

    Mito said that before you can become the container of hatred, you must fill that cup with love. I guess Naruto never had that chance, and it is sad that he never got to fill his cup before becoming a host. He was just abandoned by everyone.

    I am surprised Jiraiya just left him to live alone as well. If he knew Naruto was a host, and knew how he would live such a lonely life, why didn’t he stay in Konoha and look after him so he had at least one person making him feel wanted and accepted that felt like family?

    The way Naruto seemed surprised that Kushina could have lived a happy life at all just shows how unhappy he himself was, even up to this point no doubt despite his cheery mask. It just goes to show you…

  222. @new chapter: I liked it for the same reasons as Tenrai.

    Anyway, what is that strange jutsu the masked man (Madara?) used against those anbus??
    To me it looks like scar’s tecnique from FMA, he places his hand on your face and you die… O_O http://www.onemanga.com/Full_Metal_Alchemist/6/28/

  223. FCK YEA!!!
    I see Naruto now Maturing much more now than ever. He now has Family scattered throughout the world, I like how this kind of makes the Narutoverse much more interesting.

    I dont see Naruto becoming Hokage Konohamaru can have that Title, I see Naruto reviving Uzumaki Clan YAY 🙂 More wierd Uzumaki Ninjas, and Sasuke wanting to revive his own Uchiha Clan.

    In time the two strongest Clans Uzumaki and Uchiha… Im such a Narunerd Right now 🙂

  224. This chapter was awesome! everything was perfect! from the senju and the uzumaki to the first junchuriki of the 9 tails… We even got to see the 3rd’s wife!
    there’s just one thing i didn’t understand, Madara suppously used the 9 tails agaist hashirama, but how is that possible if the first’s wife (mito) was the jinchuriki? Not only that, but how is she alive after that?

    Also, by the looks of this chapter madara killed the 3rds wife 0.0

  225. @1010…

    what if the Sage of Six Path’s wife’s last name is Uzumaki??

    i bet you never thought of that one!!!

    😛

  226. @superfreak..

    it looked like to me that Madara used to have control of the Kyuubi prior to the 1st Hokage’s wife, but as Kushina explained Mito Uzumaki was also from her village also a power ninja who knew lots of sealing jutsu’s that turned her into the first Jinchuuriki as she used a Fuuin [spell check police to isle 7] sealing jutsu on herself.. [did i just play pete and repeat?] at that time Hashirama the 1st Hokage had control of the 9tails.. she was still alive because she was a powerful ninja..

    all powerful ninja chicks have to survive.. for the boobies!!

    😛

  227. Great chapter! I need to do a post for Madara before his mask falls off…>_>

    @Tenrai: Indeed, Konoha did in fact make a Jinchuuriki. I wasn’t surprised at all, lol, of course I wasn’t seeing as how I knew it before this chapter. This kinda gave me the hint they weren’t so innocent in the Jinchuuriki game, but you’ve seen the link before so you don’t even have to bother with it. 😉

    http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/261/03/

    So them keeping it a secret isn’t much of a surprise either. A military’s greatest weapon is usually kept in great secret. Not saying that was a Jinchuuriki’s main and only purpose in Konoha, but it definitely had something to do with it. They may have also kept their Jinchuuriki secret because they know the hate filled life one may lead. As for Naruto’s case…well he wasn’t so lucky in that regard.

    But hey, here’s one thing the Uzamaki Clan have over the Uchiha. They weren’t shunned to the outskirts of the village, reduced to live under Senju surveillance, and then massacred. Ok, so that’s more than one thing but… I’m pretty sure no one’s counting.

    @Dragon: Holy smokes! Madara is using alchemy! That’s how he’s going through walls and people! Best theory ever! XD You get 10+ awesomeness points my good sir! 😀

    @Superfreak: It seems to me Madara already had the 9 tails in his control and then Hashirama and Madara battled. Hashirama won the battle and took control of the 9 tails. Kinda like the spoils goes to the victor at the end of a battle. We know Hashirama can collect Biju like pokemon. After he had control of the 9 tails then his wife (Mito) sealed the Bijuu inside of herself. I hope it makes sense now.

    http://mangastream.com/read/naruto/87110441/6

    P.S. Mangastream links are being taken down after 4 chapters so I’ll replace this link with a Onemanga link when the site puts it up the new chapter.

    @Sasuke (The character): You’re such an asshole!

    http://img408.imageshack.us/img408/7162/dumbassrw.jpg

    LMFAO!!! XD I didn’t have to edit that! If I edit a picture…oh the fun I could have… ^_^

  228. @supertrek89

    Um… actually the Uzumaki were also massacred out of fear and their village was destroyed, while their people were used as hosts for the Jinchuuriki, so I don’t see how you get to the conclusion that they were any better of than the Uchiha. O_o

    And only three people were responsible for the Uchiha massacre, not all of Konoha. The rest of Konoha praised the Uchiha and admired them, so it is not like it was their fault.

    To me it just sounds like you are trying to find more reasons to victimize the Uchiha and villainize everyone else. You make them sound like a special case where they were the only ones hated or ostracized, when the fact is that they weren’t and that many clans were wiped out over fear.

    We see examples of that in Haku, Kimimaru, the Uchiha and now the Uzumaki as well. So why do you always make it seem like the Uchiha had it worst off when they clearly didn’t. At least they were loved and admired by everyone else in Konoha except for a few stupid higher ups. How do the Uzimaki have anything over the Uchiha when they met the exact same fate for practically the same reasons (fear), along with other clans who met similar fates?

  229. Oh man the last page was epic (ripe old age of 1 minute lmao!)! Sorry but I hate childbirth scenes, they give me bad images X_X

  230. And too be fair, the Uchiha actually were trying to stage a coup unlike the other examples of wiped out clans we’ve seen…..so they kinda deserved it.

  231. @Tenrai, you misunderstood my comment. I wasnt saying people only liked Naruto cuz he worked hard (that’s why I like him though), I was saying ppl sympathize more with characters that worked hard instead of characters that are just born strong (because no one in real life is born successful). This is all just another reason many people don’t like Sasugay.

  232. Regarding 500 there is one mystery that I’m curious about, Hiruzen or his wife, can’t recall now, told Minato and Kushina that they did the same ritual of birth for Mito, so then who was there son or daughter, I’m talking about Tsunade’s father or mother, being the closest offspring of Hashirama this guy/girl had to be really strong so how come he/she wasn’t mentioned at all ??

    About your point Tenrai, I think u might just be wright about the uzumaki being more closer descendants of the younger son, just because of there long lifespan, that means that the blood that has descended from the younger son is more pure and more potent than that of the Senjuu.

  233. @Tenrai: Actually it wasn’t a massacre. They got involved in a war and surviving members are scattered across the globe probably having families and growing, passing on their blood. Then their symbol is used as a prideful mark for the Leaf Village. The Uchiha weren’t so lucky now were they? Lol, and I wasn’t blaming Konoha for anything…at this point…>_> I never even said Konoha was responsible for the Uchiha massacre so I have no clue where that came from. o_O I just said what specifically happened to the Uchiha. Nothing more, nothing less.

    I’m sure it does seem like I’m defending the Uchiha more than I ought to be because that’s…exactly what I’m trying to do. 😉 The rest of the clans and villages all have their rightful support and praise that I find substantial enough to need no more support from me. Even so, I do understand the pain and suffering other clans have gone through and if you remember I posted a link…

    http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/29/10/

    Referring to the suffering special bloodlines have gone through. Oh look, Sasuke is involved too. Coincidence. >(>_>)> What clan isn’t loved and admired in Konoha? xD Lastly, I believe it’s important to understand the Uchiha are not the complete victims. Lol, it’d be ridiculous to believe otherwise. I think Itachi and Madara are the two biggest douchebags in the series. Sasuke is an asshole…I’m sure I mentioned that before, so overall the Uchiha are a bunch of assholes and douchebags. Not all of them of course. ^_-

    @Mandi: Ja, they were trying to stage a coup after what the Senju did to them for Madara’s solo actions. Lol, if a rebellion pops up for unjust actions is there any surprise?

  234. @supertrek89

    I don’t mind you supporting the Uchiha, it’s just you make it sound like other clans are always better off. Yes, some are, but not all. I bet most of Konoha don’t even know what that spiral on their backs mean. You never once hear any of the students in Naruto’s class talking about how admired the Uzumaki were, but they sure do go on about the Uchiha.

    If you ask me, they get a great deal of praise, even now after their passing. Yet the only time we ever hear about the Uzumaki clan is through a technically dead member who is only mentioning it so Naruto can have some closure. The Uchiha were made the special police force in Konoha and their clan symbol become a symbol of authority and pride. Sure, that may have been the higher-ups way of making them feel comfortable, but the rest of Konoha didn’t see it that way.

    The rest saw it as something special, something to be proud of and that is why the Uchiha were so admired. It’s also why Sasuke had so many fangirls. <_<

    And you mention that the Uzumaki were destroyed because of war, that's the same as me saying so were the Uchiha. They were destroyed to prevent a war, so I don't see how the circumstances are so different. Both were feared for their power, both were destroyed because of that fear.

    But I still don't make excuses for the way the Uchiha were killed nor do I agree with it. It was just another injustice in a world full of injustices.

  235. Guilty by association…happens all the time

  236. Uzumaki > Uchiha imo

  237. naw cute ^_^ Kushina thought sasuke would be a girl xD

  238. Uzumaki vs Uchiha
    Naruto vs Sasuke
    Tenrai vs Super

    *Tenrai summons Mandi to help him battle*

    lol!!!! ^ ^

  239. This chapter proves that Tsunade and Naruto are related somehow…

    If Tsunade is Hashirama’s grandaughter then that means he had a son or a daughter which had Tsunade; that means that she has Uzumaki and Senju blood in her, so she could be Naruto’s distant cousin or aunt because Uzumaki Mito and Kushina are related in some way (maybe Mito is Kushina’s aunt).
    Wow, Naruto thought he didn’t have any family in Konoha, but now he’s related to almost all the Hokages… <_<

  240. @Kushina

    She was right, wasn’t she? O_o

    LOL!!!!! JJ!!! JJ!!!! Or am I…..

  241. “This is why women have babies, you men cant handle pain.”
    Lol… true >_>

  242. lol Ten xD AND I WAS RIGHT!!!! he did sneaked in while Kushina was weak! HA!! xD

  243. @Tenrai: Fair enough but the Uchiha weren’t just given the police role to make them “comfortable”. It was to strip and distance them from any important role in the government effectively reducing their power, and to have them controlled and watched. Afterall, the police force is controlled by the governing body of Konoha and thanks to the Senju the Uchiha had no more place in governing Konoha. Even if the Senju and Uchiha founded it together.

    It could have been looked at something to be proud of. Take what you’re given I guess, but the Uchiha are prideful and could tell how they were being moved down the ladder. And they still have only…2 surviving members compared to who knows how many Uzamaki. Praise can only mean so much to a near extinct clan. >_>

    I need to go to bed. In mother Russia. Bed goes to you! ~_~ *stumbles off*

  244. I have this image of Sasuke and Naruto, about 2-3 years old, playing and have fun like best friends. And their moms are watching from somewhere drinking tea and their dads train jutsu with each other, Yellow flash vs. Sharingan……. If everyone were alive T_T

    Instead… they grown up emo-ish and goth-ish… TT__TT

  245. @supertrek89

    Yeah, “who knows how many?” is right, because we don’t know how many. Perhaps they also eventually died out or were hunted down. Naruto may be the last, or he may be one of 100.

    How many survive is irrelevant to the injustice of it. Killing innocents is still killing innocents.

  246. I Lol’d when Kushina said she thought Mikoto had a girl.
    Sasuke got pwned.
    And who can blame her, Sasuke still looks like a girl.

    And Super,

    If the Uchiha weren’t happy with the way the senju and later the higher ups of Konoha treated them, then why did Mikoto name her son after the father of the Third Hokage?!!…
    This got me thinking, what if the Uchiha were happy with what they had. What if they were controlled by Madara to form a coup d’etat. Think about it. Yagura, the 4th Mizukage was controlled as well. That couldn’t have been Danzou so that leaves only two other suspects, Itachi and Madara. Itachi wouldn’t have had any reason to do so, Madara would. The same goes for manipulating the Uchiha clan. Madara wanted to take his revenge out on the Uchiha clan for exiling him. What better way then to destroy them from the inside out. OR Madara controlled Itachi and the higher ups of Konoha to make them believe the Uchiha were planning a coup d’etat….
    Nah, probably not. The Uchiha were probably just struggling with their superiority complex as always and decided, on a whim, that only their existence is meaningful.

  247. @1redbaron1

    What if Mikoto wasnt a Uchiha from the begining?
    And the Uchiha just want it better, everyone does. It’s in the human nature, we all are greedy and want the best.

  248. @Kushina

    It isn’t wrong to want to go higher in life, but you do have to consider how many people you are stepping on for those gains. You can further your own goals without being greedy, but when you bring others down selfishly then that is where it becomes a problem.

    I don’t think the Uchiha had a problem with not being good enough, nor did they necessarily want more of anything, because they seemed quite content to let the Senju lead and they even went as far turning on Madara to ensure that peaceful co-existence. I just think it was the fact that they began to notice how much they were being isolated and discriminated against that eventually pushed them into considering rebellion.

    I can understand those kinds of ill feelings, but the real question is, did they try to bring those forward and negotiate before planning a coup de tat? Or did they just plan to act before trying to find a peaceful resolution? In the same vein, one can also take into question the lack of negotiation on the side of Konoha’s leaders as well.

    I guess we will never know either way whether either side tried just understand one another.

  249. after chapter 500, i was thinking if it is possible that the last coffin that Kabuto held in front of Madara would be holding the 1st Jinchuuriki, Uzumaki Mito, since she had the power to hold the Kyuubi..

    discuss..

    also episode 167 again had poor animation quailty but did some amazing story telling.. that fight was epic!!!

  250. @Tenrai: How many survive is irrelevant? As compared to the injustice of it? Meh, I don’t think how many survive is irrelevant at all compared to anything but we all have our own opinions. The most likely case is that they survived and are growing in number. Kushina made it clear the “survivors” escaped and spread themselves across the entire globe. 10 to 1 chance they’re growing in number again.

    @1redbarno1: Remember the 3rd Hokage was the only one to protest against the Uchiha relocation and massacre? Didn’t help them in the end but at least he tried. Besides that, the 3rd’s father had nothing to do with what happened to the Uchiha anyway…at least it doesn’t say he did so far…>_>

    Madara controlling the Uchiha and forcing them to plan the coup d’etat is speculation and theory, and that would just really make the Uchiha the victims even more. Effectively saying it’s not their fault, they were being controlled. Lol, so yes it’s most likely not the case. What really happened was the result of the Uchiha acting selfishly against the Senju merely because they were being treated unfairly. The Uchiha should have kept their superiority complex under restraint and just understood sometimes it’s fair to be treated unfairly. I’m glad we got that down. ^_-

    @Spill: I think she’d be really old. o_o

  251. @super Madara the guy who is almost as good as Aizen when it comes to planning

  252. I wonder what led to Madaras change in appearance after the uchiha massacre. In this last chapter we see madara with a different mask then the one in present day

    http://www.mangastream.com/read/naruto/87110441/18

    He has the same mask as well as a different hair style when itachi confronted him before the massacre.

    http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/400/08/

    I think he might be changing bodies, but that doesnt really explain why he only uses one eye. Any other ideas? I though this chapter was great, there will be 1 or two more of flashbacks i think.

  253. lol did anybody else notice that the fight for shi 167 had a BUNCH of extra stuff then in the manga, like the nintails was doin things i never knew it could do XD

  254. @Super

    She’s a zombie, they never get old.

  255. @Blackburstboom – pretty good point. It’s possible that this’ll be another way that Naruto can relate to Sasuke. What would suck is if this just started a whole ‘nother loop with something similar to Senju vs. Uchiha, but in this case it’s Uzumaki vs. Uchiha. I’m more hoping for a combination here.

  256. @ Super,

    We’ll never really know the motives behind the Uchiha actions. The only one alive who knows the truth is Madara, in fact it was Madara who explained everything and we know he isn’t the most reliable person when it comes to speaking about facts;
    http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/399/15/
    The Kyuubi attack was a natural disaster… Sure, Madara, sure,… I believe you. >__>
    Just keep in mind. EVERYTHING he said in there was only and solely to win Sasuke over. We can’t possibly tell what was true or not (except for Itachi’s story)
    I think Sasuke’s comment here is an example of the real truth;
    http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/401/05/

  257. Tobirama is the least developed of the Hokages. Sucks to be him

  258. @kizu lol just like the hyuuga.

  259. LOL, i had a freaky idea!!!!!!!!!!!!
    READ MY THEORY!!!!!
    i analyzed the uzumakis we know, they got:
    -special chakra.
    -sealing techniques
    -red hair
    -are related to konoha/senju
    -are related to the sage
    -are scattered around the world
    -supposed to be VERY powerful with longevity

    now tell me, to which person does this description fit perfectly???
    think again…
    i tell you if u dont see this:

    NAGATO

    can it be, that nagato was an uzumaki?

  260. @salamiyo

    i can see where your coming from but the major flaw with that is pretty much summed up with this link
    http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/462/12/
    one brother had the eyes and the other the body and the uzumaki obviousley have the bodys as they do not have the eyes but they are all related anyway.that makes the uchiha and uzumaki clan related as they are relatives of the senju.

  261. I regard to what salamiyo said, could it be that a descendant of the younger son, by some sort of evolution, could actually come to achieve the rinnegan ??

    It’s tricky but that maybe the only way Naruto could somehow be related to Nagato, say Nagato’s father was a distant descendant of the younger son and her mother of the elder son, so because of that he’d have the traits representing the younger son and powers that the elder possessed.

    Who knows but I surely doubt theres any relation between Nagato and Naruto.

    @ 1redbaron1 dude I totally agree with u and often said that what we know from Madara is a load of horse shit, that’s why when we have a debate about something said by Madara I chose to pass the info as unreliable, cause he’s been proven to be a good lier time and again, so don’t base u’re arguments in a debate or any other Naruto related discussions on the premise that Madara said it so it must be true.

    Cause so far much of what he said is not true, and possibly the most important of all could be that he is not even Madara himself, like most of us speculated since the Kabuto incident.

    In that regard maybe the feud between the elder and younger brothers might not have even happened, and the result of that grudge might as well come from the uchiha themselves.
    Madara using that story just to blame it on destiny and not on actual facts.
    That’s just my honest opinion, and it might be wrong, but it doesn’t excuse the fact that Tobi eats a lot of crap and he’s hardly truthful with what he says.

  262. @super.. Kushina said my mind exactly.. if the coffins all contain the zombiefied versions of their previous lives… then age is irrelevant..

    @dricedt- this is exactly what the anime has been missing for a long time.. it looks to me that the animators of the filler have taken over in the design of the show as the quality seems to have suffered greatly in the visual, however the advance story telling from manga to moving image needed this “extra” that you just cant have in 18 pages of comics.. it was something that used to be part of the main cannon of the anime to expand the story from manga.. only that the last 4-8 episodes have been seriously lacking the useage of this..

    thankfully this episode rocked, although it was rather comedic in a cat and mouse fight between naruto and pein, i really liked it.. i used to think the fight with orochimaru was one of the best of the series but this one has taken a lead. if only the visual didnt look like it was out of a filler arc.. its lacking full colour and shadows and depth.. like the animation feels rushed.. you know when you see the quality of the movies for naruto. it has a stronger visual.. i miss that..

    the animation of this episode seriously reminded me of Metabots.. there is a lot of simalities in the faces and the fast moving sequences.. i cant place it exactly.. it feels like the level is from a few years back if not a few decades back in illustration quality..

    DONT BELIEVE IT!!

  263. i REALLY dont see how NOBODY knew naruto was related to the 4th. His last name is uzamaki, who else in that village has that last name, it’s not a popular name at all and anybody else who DID have it would deny him. People know that kushina was preg with a baby, she’s uzamaki …naruto is an orphin his parents are gone…..COME ON PEOPLE!!!! plus he looks like the fourth!!!

  264. @salamiyo- your theory sounds tight.. although red hair alone doesn’t speak to me on that alone.. but in this instance of powerful ninjas from destroyed villages long forgotten, where exactly is Kabuto from.. as he is the sole survivor of his destroyed village.. but back to Nagato.. perhaps he is related to Naruto.. he does have the Rinnegan, which is a direct relation to the Sage of Six.. but in this manga, being related to anyone doesn’t mean anything except that your brother or sister or mother or father will kill/ sacrifice/ contain you for greater power.. look at Naruto’s parents or Madara and his brother or Itachi and his brother.. all sacrificed for power..

    all Nagato lost was TINY, his small puppy that he found..

  265. dricedt… im not sure nobody knew… the people of naruto’s generation didnt know… same as how they didnt know about kyuubi, despite the fact that the whole village knew. Kakashi knew, jiraiya knew, im sure all the jounin did…. even akatsuki knew (referencing kisame referring to him as the 4th’s legacy)

  266. @dricedt- Naruto’s father didnt have the last name of Uzumaki, only Kushina did.
    Minato’s last name is Namikaze. only the top 3 ninjas and the 3rd knew of the history of the Uzumaki clan, while the entire Konoha village were all brought up with lies and surrounded with more to cover up the fact that Naruto was even born from the 4th and Kushina, no one even knew she was pregnant outside of what seems to be Sasuke’s mom who looks like to be the one that advised to Madara that a Jinchuuriki is having a baby.

    it states that a female Jinchuuriki has a pregnancy for 10 months over the regular of 9.this can be understood that a 10 month pregnancy is only of a Jinchuuriki and thus open the hidden secret.

    so in the end no one in Konoha would even have the slightest thought Naruto was the child of the 4th and the previous Jinchuuriki that not one outside of the 3 and the 3rd Hokage even knew existed..

    but i cant wait to see how that story pans out..

  267. @spill

    If u really think that all nagato lost was tiny then u should re-read the manga… I mean what happened to nagato is the same exact thing that kakashi used as a scenario to test Sakura in like the 3rd episode (kill naruto or i’ll kill sasuke…)

  268. no™!! all he lost was TINY!!! he is a Ginger who lost a pet.. get over it and stop blaming the world for your problems..!!!

    telling me to re-read.. pffft!!!

    you must be a ginger too!!!

    😛

  269. also Nagato “gained” the Rinnegan.. for being placed into that life altering “decision” he actually had a choice.. yes to kill one of his buddies or lose the other still he had a choice..

    what happened to Naruto was done with him having no choices.. your connections are misleading.. and perhaps it is you that should re-read the manga, as you seem to be missing that..

  270. wait a second… so ur telling me that choosing to kill ur friend or to watch ur friend die is a real choice?? thats like picking ur poison, some1 close to u will still die… idk… i might prefer being born without parents than watching them being killed right in front of me (then again its close, they both suck balls) my point is, nagato got his parents killed right in front of him, his best friend, and ok yes his dog which i didnt find that compelling. but i dont know what ur talking about with choices… in fact i dont know what choices ur talking about… im pretty sure nagato didnt chose to be born in a war torn nation, full of death and struggle

  271. Nagato had his parents killed in front of him during a war that was raging on for quite a long time.. after all that “pain” he was taken in by Jiraiya who actually showed him love and friendship.. after all that he was presented with the “choice”.. your time span on the events seem to happen instantly as you describe them.. he did indeed have a choice..

    the “choice” i am referring towards is towards your comparison of Kakashi and his student to nagato and his friends.. Nagato still had a choice to make.. while Kakashi’s training with Sakura and Sasuke and Naruto was to show that in a battle you will be placed in moments where your choices are already set in stone and you have none.. as they are unexperienced ninjas their choices weren’t there to have any.

    Nagato on the other hand was an older and more experienced person over Sakura who never seen death, never felt pain and never had any real life altering choices to make..

    what i am stating is your analogy to convey the common ground of these 2 scenarios are so far off that there aren’t any choices for Sakura to make.. while Nagato had not just 2 choices, he claimed a 3rd choice by silencing those that presented him with such a choice to make..

    Also without that exact moment in his life he would never have unlocked the Rinnegan.. something not Sakura, or Sasuke or Naruto would have been able to do..

    again your analogy is not something that is not easily comparable.. so its easy to argue it from your end.. but look at it from a step out.. they really dont have the same situations to formulate the same answer..

  272. also to bring back that which Kakashi was trying to explain is, that living a life as a ninja, you must lose all reality towards friendships and love as life on the battle field holds no place for such ideals..

    this is life of war, life in the ninja world.. it is something all must accept..
    yes its hard to make that life decision.. but it is still a choice..

    not all life choices end with a smile and a happy ending.. this is what real life is..

  273. the more i think about my theory, the more im convinced im right.
    i know madara said that and it sums up: nothing 🙂
    they say nagatos rinnegan was a mutation.
    remember the sage only had the rinnegan, we dunno if he was able to use the sharingan. we know NOTHING about the rinnegan, except the thing with the paths, the field of vision and some fancy stuff like being able to use 6 elements and see some barriers and stuff.
    how does somebody get the rinnegan?? its not really a kekkei genkai like the sharingan, theres no bloodline, it seems to be a pure coincidence! but is that so?
    not really, the answer: the toads prophecy.
    there were 2 childs of prophecy known as nagato and naruto. nagato as a symbol of DESPAIR and naruto as a symbol of HOPE, they are antagonists. is it coincidence that exactly these 2 were “chosen”?
    i dont think so.

  274. spill… i guess i see ur point, maybe my analogy wasn’t the greatest, the only point i was trying to make was that nagato did suffer a lot more than the loss of his puppy… but i will try to quote almost exactly from the manga here… http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/8/09/
    “Sakura, kill Naruto or Sasuke dies” compared to … http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/446/14/

    “You with the red hair, use this to kill him (Yahiko) and I’ll let the girl go free (Konan).”

    Maybe the circumstances were a little bit different for Nagato and Sakura, but from what i can see, this is the exact example that kakashi set for sakura choosing between naruto and sasuke, except with nagato choosing between yahiko and konan

  275. my next point:
    as u see naruto and sasuke are the main antagonists somehow.
    both had 2 own antagonists.
    before the pain-fight, sasuke killed his brother, its like an uchiha-prophecy coming true, they were both BROTHERS.
    then naruto “defeated” pain and the toadprophecy came true, both children of the prophecy, maybe blood-related too?
    strange coincidences.

  276. I think Taji is related to Shizune.

  277. Minato’s a bad Hokage. He should have Rasenganed Kushina’s head off and kill her right there and then, the moment Naruto was grabbed. That would kill the fox, spare a lot of villagers their lives, make Akatsuki unnecessary, spare the Uchihas, ruined the Moon’s Eye Plan and prevented the Fourth Ninja War

  278. @salamiyo, sorry, but Nagato and Naruto are the children of prophecy, NOT Sasugay. The Toad Sage said so himself.

  279. @Super and Tenrai, sometmies decisive actions need to be taken. The Uzumakis had it coming because they were involved in a war, and the Uchihas had it coming becuz their actions could have started a war. I say god riddance! The only clan I feel sorry for is the Kaguya Clan (plus they had the best Kekei Genkai ever, not counting the Rinnegan or Mangakyous -_-‘), they were just so stupid its pitiful

  280. For those saying Nagato was an Uzumaki, that is entirely plausible. Jiraiya said Nagato was the Sage’s reincarnation which explains why he had the Rinnegan. The fact that he’s a reincarnation means he has the Sage’s soul, but none of his memories nor his body, so he could be the son of a hentai actress it wouldnt make a difference becuz he’d still be God. It would be really cool if we found out Nagato was Naruto’s distant cousin or something 😀

  281. @Kizu and why not have him say “Now, that you have bore me a child you have outlived your usefulness” NOT!!! As much as you hate Konoha that’s pretty Heartless to say. This is coming from the Master of Chaos himself. Well, I blame Hiruzen and his incompetence.
    Nagato should have been killed by Orochimaru when they first met then there would be no Emo “pacifist” killer. and so many tragedies could have been avoided.

  282. what if Nagato is really Kushina’s long lost brother…

  283. CAPTION

    “Crazy thoughts and emotions start running through narutos head … one of them being this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2aljlKYesT4

  284. @kisu: i never said sasuke is the child of jiraiyas prophecy, i said theres an analogy when the 2 main antagonists have “defeated” (somehow) their personal antagonists. the uchiha had their strange “prophecy” with this 2-brothers-thingy and naruto had the sage toads prophecy.
    anyway naruto had a prophecy too, the sage toad told him that he would fight somebody he knows or something, he could mean sasuke, if thats the case, sasuke is a child of a (different) prophecy, too ;D
    but naruto stopped the sage toad from telling him exactly, so we dont know if the toad meant sasuke and we dont know kabutos role now.

  285. yeah its heartless, but its the right thing to do kanton. But I blame HAshirama. He could have taken out ALL the Biju 80+ years ago. But like they say, greed is human nature.

  286. would ressangening a host kill the beast in it ? i think it would just release it kisu 😛

  287. Host dead = Biju dead X_X

  288. @Kizu Say you kill all of the jinchuuriki ok Personally, I blame the sons of the rikudo sennin.

  289. i had to go back and re-read the manga regarding the time span..
    it shows that Kushina and Mikoto could have been close friends without any segregation of the Uchihas. There move to a corner of the village did not happen til, the day Naruto was born and the 9tails was released.

    here are images describing this as Madara is explaining the history to Sasuke.

    and

    so it seems that a friendship bond could easily have happened, as i had previously thought that since the Uchiha family was separated from the rest of the village and a few other people here posted that it might have been impossible for a friendship bond to happen, now seems very possible..

  290. @Kanton, that’s going a tad too far lol -_-‘. Blame the Sage! Its a common known fact in manga. If you have 2 sons, or 2 daughters or 2 students, NEVER give ANYTHING to either of them, especially a dying gift.

  291. Naruto didn’t become a Jinchuuriki until after the fox was back in Konoha’s hands, i assume. I was under the impression that the beast’s traits would THEN become visible, but Naruto was born with the “whiskers” haha. ooh man whats up with that?? Was the 3rd caught off guard or would he get owned by Madara?

  292. @maiden, maybe he was born with the whiskers becuz the Kyubi’s chakra influenced him while he was in the womb. Maybe that’s why he also has a naturally high chakra reserve

  293. well this has nothing to do with anything, but the new Avatar movie makes Dragonball Evolution look good lol. Worst 2 hours of my life 😛

  294. where in the manga does it say that killing the host or when the host dies so does the biju? when the 6 sage died the 10 tails would have been released, not dead. Also when sasuke is inside naruto’s mind and talks to the fox, the fox says not to kill naruto or he’ll regret it, if the fox and naruto both died why would he regret it?

  295. i dont think that the kyuubi has anything to do with it.
    i think his parents are somekind of “fateful”.
    again, there are some plot-“holes” that are frightening me somehow.
    at first: we dont know some persons or dont know enough about persons supposed to be main characters, for example:
    – the 3 sannin: the strongest in konoha in past times, but who are they? why are especially these 3 sooo strong? are they senju? (marriage can change names, its safer to not have the name senju i guess, for example (crazy example but i wanna do it :D) tsunade senju + dan namikaze = minato namikaze, sounds safer than minato senju)
    – the 2nd ninja war, what was the reason, how did it end, why did kishi make a 2nd war if its useless for the whole plot?
    – why are there “only” 2 known senju (hashirama and tobirama), they’ve found konoha so there must be MORE senju!
    – who’s the father of konohamaru?

  296. So since the Sage was the father of justsu, where in the loop does that place the myokobuzan‎ frogs?? Are they apprentices of the teachings of the Sage?

  297. @salamiyo- the 3 Sannin are the strongest because during the Great Ninja Wars those 3 were the top of all the Ninjas from the villages, they each had their own summon each with the master level of those summons.. if anyone else used a summon it would be able to summon the master levels, also they were each respected.. blah blah

    ok i have no idea why.. i also wondered why those 3 were the top considering that Naruto, Sasuke even Konohamaru mastered a jutsu that most of them couldnt even kakashi has trouble with the rasengan..

    i have major issues with kakashi.. all this talk about him being so smart and stuff ok he smart, but i havent seen anything close to more than 10 jutsu’s he may have stolen from anyone.. mostly Zabuza and Sasuke moves he copies and uses.. not much more than that.. to me Kakashi is a weak fake ass ninja who doesnt have enough chakra to real damage.. his trump card nearly wastes all his energies and puts him into a coma.. where is the fearful strength of that…compared to any power sets of lets say Raikage strength or naruto or even hinata.. i think in a fight to the death he has a lot under his belt but no real fearful finishing moves or a any real strength in fighting,.. i was happy when pein killed him as i thoiught his usefullness was over.. there is no more team 7 so what is he really worth.. not much as far as i can see..

    .. spell check police to isle 7…

  298. @maiden…

    the sage refers to the first ninja, the sage of six path that contain all the jutsus..
    the frog sage is a style of fighting only thru the frogs, this iis nit the same as the sage of six paths only that they both are sages.. meaning the most learnt of knowledge and experience.. a complete total mind body soul jutsu.. the others use elements and body..

    ok i went off on a tangent.. maybe someone like 1010 can explain this with 10 paragraphs.. or super can just say what he thinks and then end it with saying he said it so its true..

    haha!!!

    where is flex when you need the sarcasm!!!??

  299. @dricedt, I cant be bothered to search through the manga after being traumatized by the Last Airbender, so you can either search through the manga, google it, or just accept it. Or maybe some GOOD SAMARITAN!!!!! can provide the links 😉

  300. but i think in a 1on1 kakashi is troublesome, but if he has to face very much opponents he cant handle it.
    imho coma > death or whatever happens to ppl he transfers to this strange dimension.
    i think for example naruto would have REAL problems fighting kisame, but kakashi could just transfer his arms somewhere and then kisame has a problem, well he could just bite kakashi head off lol…
    but kakashi as hokage?
    no way.
    i just cant abandon the thought that the sannin are all descendants of the senju and somehow minato was senju too, he’s suddenly there from nowhere. and mayke the hatake were senju, too but having THAT low chakra makes it seem impossible.
    the senju have no special bloodline-abilities, they only possess strong/special chakras and are able to specialize in their own way of fighting almost perfectly, that really fits the sannin and minato too and it would make it more clear why naruto is so special, possessing both “halves” of the one halve of the sage making him a “true” descendant of the younger son of the sage (senju = strong chakra; uzumaki = much chakra).
    anyway im asking myself, why did the descendants of the older son of the sage each possess the sharingan and not the rinnegan? what happend there and i can remember, didnt tobi say anything like “then i can get rid of the rinnegan too” and that was AFTER nagato died.
    any1 remembers that too?

  301. @driecdt When Naruto was fighting Kabutops who cut some artery vein and almost died.
    As seen here the attack http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/168/09/
    and here Kyuubi almost dying http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/168/12.

  302. @salamiyo, its not so much as Kakashi having low reserves, its the immense ammount of chakra the Sharingan takes from him. Remember he isnt an Uchiha so he loses way more chakra than an Uchiha. Even Danzo had to use Hashirama’s cels to power his Sharingan arm because of all the chakra it takes to use them when you dont have Uchiha blood.

  303. @kantonkage: why is it then that the nine tails told sasuke not to kill naruto or he’d regret it? he’d have no backlash from the kubi, also why wouldn’t the rikudou sennin just allow himself to die and the jubi with him?

  304. @dricedt That I do not know about kyuubi warning that. Rikudo Sennin’s was different because the Juubi is all of the bijuu in one single entity. It was so strong that the Rikudo Sennin’s seal would have broke when he died.
    seen here:http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/467/15-16/

  305. Note: Sapsucker = that (most ppl know him as Sasuke but my Firefox knows him as Sapsucker though i preferred Assuke)

  306. @dricedt-

    you know how the 9tails chakra was spilt into 2 parts.. Minato put half the chakra into Naruto.. and you know how Karin sensed a dark chakra in Sasuke and she also sensed a chakra in Naruto that is like something she remembered in Sasuke.. do you think that perhaps, the other half of the 9tails chakra resides in Sasuke?

    perhaps that is what the 9tails meant when he told Sasuke that killing Naruto would be a mistake.. that if Naruto dies, so would Sasuke and the 9tails..

    [my conspiracy theory…]

  307. @dricedt-

    Tobi/ Madara advised that in order for the 10 tails Juubi to be revived, all the other tailed beast must be brought together.. to form Voltron Defender of the Universe..

    or something like a Moons Eye Plan ..

  308. can a biju “die”? i think its sucked into another dimension or something.
    maybe this way it’d be easier for creatures like tobi to gain control of their power, with bijus they can use the bijus themselves and prevent something like this.

  309. @salamiyo and all

    i thought none of you guys would question the kamui’s abiliy after we saw the anime . i mean the theroies are now gone that it takes a long time and stuff . manga showed us the kakashi took down that freakin chakra arrow and pain’s nail. the anime further enhanced the thing to show us exactly how it was done (i know you guys will complaint that anime is no solid proof but along with refrenses from manga it is WAY more authenticating than your theories 😛 ) the anime showed us something like the time was slowed down . kakashi when he activated it the image around him froze and the nail too . he then looked at the nail and sent it to another dimension , the manga has already also shown that it takes no time to get the jutsu started as well (arrow of chakra) … so its a 99 % chance kakashi can take the head of kisame in the start … though i doubt he would do that and i also doubt he would win … but he certainly can take that head off before kisame knows it 😀

    i for one would certainly take such a guy as hokage who could literally kill anyone X_X

    @kanton , sapsucker ? assuke ? why not sasugay 😉

  310. @Biju dying. Ok, then why wouldnt Akatsuki just kill the Jinchurikis? Becuz capturing them alive is MUCH more difficult. It takes a lot to NOT step on ants lol. Killing the Jinchuriki = killing the Biju. That’s the reason they extracted the KYubi from Mito instead of letting her die naturally, becuz then the Kyubi would die too.

  311. @Ahsan the first was b/c i want to see the correction and the second one was b/c he is an ass despite being asexual all i did was switch the first two letters of his name. I wonder why No one else thought of it.

  312. there are some questions that were coming up to me when i re-re-re-re-re-read the new ep:
    mito uzumaki: what is that sign on her forehead? looks like tsunades and what are these seals on her ears, they look like that from the kiri guy with the byakugan.
    masked guy: did he vanish in the wall? o_O like a friggin ghost? O.O i never thought he’d be able to use this jutsu before he attacked konoha, i dont know who tobi really is…
    and why does he have such “young” arms? somehow i believe that mikoto told her husband about kushina childbirth and then “tobi” got to know that from him.

    well wheres the 500 breakdown…….? ~~

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